POLL - Futures: How do you determine the trend?

[Charlie Dow]

Quote from Equalizer:

ROFLMAO


What, even if these alleged negative posts are TRUE?

Mr Dow would appear to have been rather economical with the presentation of the facts whilst he commented about his altruistic tendencies in his previous post. A random omission perchance on his behalf. Benefit of the doubt. Thus if he is to make such comments, I think he should not have any issues with anyone who wants the complete picture.

Like I said before, I have no issues with Mr Dow/Logic posting about his "methodology", or promoting his services, I could not give a shit, thats for Barron and the Moderators to decide if he has gone too far and has to pay up some cashola to ET.

However, when he starts with his "hollier than thou - I'm perfect and so is my methodology - you must be an idiot and an asshole not do trade as I do" bollocks attitude - well I'm afraid that going to invite criticism at best.

And of course it gets better with the "I'm giving it away for free - 3 people are attending the Seminar for free" - the dude is a saint for shag's sakes.

Dude, cut that shit out, focus on your "methodology" (and I use that word loosely), and thats it. If Hanketsurfer criticises your method - he is entitled to do that - or wants projections, then deal with it. If you do this in an appropriate manner then you'll avoid a lot of the criticism, like the type of criticism towards the end of the "ProfLogic" posts (lets not open that can of worms - some apparently ex-students really put the boots in so to speak in those threads), and guess what, you might even get more people to attend your seminars.

There is one and only one reason for your existence on ET. Shameless Self-Promotion. Period. Lets accept this and move on.

Have a nice day, EQ.

Wow, what if they aren't?
I don't "Promote" anything. I have NEVER MENTIONED MY SITES IN ANY OF MY DOW POST's. You have mentioned more of what I do or more regarding my sites than I have in all of my of my posts.
Does the exchange of ideas different from yours really scare you that much?
I never said that, "It was my way or the wrong way", I said that what I do can't be manipulated without ruining what it is. Does misquoting someone to make you look omnipotent add to your own self value?
Someone said earlier in the thread that would this be a great place if we all could sit around and throw ideas out and discuss them. I agree. You need to get back to what ET is all about or find another thread to misquote people in.

 

[psycho-analitix]

Quote from Charlie Dow:

snip....
The Ergodic is not proprietary but my setting are.
snip.....

And students have reported that the settings kept on changing. And the number of bars per day kept changing. And you moved from tick charts to volume based charts.

It would be far more believable if you could take any setting, any chart (intraday, day, week) etc, any symbol, commodity and trade that.

The fact that you need a "proprietary setting" and volume based charts means that your stuff is curvefitted and we all know that such leads to the poorhouse.

I will say that you have the gift of the gooblydegook, or as I will spell it out: you are a confidence trickster. I believe they call that in the trading world: snakeoil.

 

[downtickboy]

Quote from Charlie Dow:

The class starts this morning and if you would like to call the hotel to check but there are 4 people in the class all are free seats; the two organizers, a friend and the father who is a math teacher. When the advertising for the class didn't work out I could have left and came home but I made a promise to the people here that requested I do a class here in Germany and set it up for me. The class goes on with or without any paid students. I would venture a guess that if you were in the same situation you have already left to cut expenses. I still here until the class is finished at my expense.

I make no mention of my sites on ET and won't. This is a forum to exchange ideas. If if weren't for individuals like yourself no one on this site would know about those sites or there content.

That is a very honest post on how the seminar went. What you mentioned later is kind of funny too because you have not made any mention of even having a site or giving seminars. It was all the other posters who brought these things up. I think it is frusterating for traders to think someone might have a very consistent strategy that they have absolute confidence in especially if they have been seeking that themselves and unable to find it. Then to themselves the idea of that consistency seems utterly impossible for anyone to have. Now whether or not you are as consistent in your real time trading results as you say is another story because that is hard to verify without seeing it and sort of hard to believe that someone has a 90%+success rate over a long period of time. However regardless of the actually percentage I do think it is possible for some traders to have highly consistent results.

 

[Equalizer]

Quote from Charlie Dow:

The class starts this morning and if you would like to call the hotel to check but there are 4 people in the class all are free seats; the two organizers, a friend and the father who is a math teacher. When the advertising for the class didn't work out I could have left and came home but I made a promise to the people here that requested I do a class here in Germany and set it up for me. The class goes on with or without any paid students. I would venture a guess that if you were in the same situation you have already left to cut expenses. I still here until the class is finished at my expense.

Wow dude, you're such a philanthropist.

rESpeKt !

 

[Equalizer]

Quote from Charlie Dow:

I don't "Promote" anything. I have NEVER MENTIONED MY SITES IN ANY OF MY DOW POST's.

Really? Guess thats a matter of opinion then

Quote from Charlie Dow:

Does the exchange of ideas different from yours really scare you that much?

Talking of misquoting, you don't even know what my ideas are, therefore you should perhaps refrain from expressing yourself through your sphincter and assuming that your mangled Dow theory is something unique and unknown, or different to what others use.

Quote from Charlie Dow:

I never said that, "It was my way or the wrong way", I said that what I do can't be manipulated without ruining what it is.

read my post again, where I talk about your bollocks attitude, perhaps you might then understand what I was talking about. Perhaps I should dig up some posts from your ex-students who if memory serves described your approach as that of a bully - heaven forfend that they might question the methods of a true master on a chat site

Quote from Charlie Dow:

You need to get back to what ET is all about or find another thread to misquote people in.

Thats right, when someone challenges you, just weasel off by saying they are not playing fair, or they are "misquoting you".

Enjoy your "charity work" in Germany. Drink more beer.

 

[Equalizer]

Quote from downtickboy:

That is a very honest post on how the seminar went. What you mentioned later is kind of funny too because you have not made any mention of even having a site or giving seminars. It was all the other posters who brought these things up. I think it is frusterating for traders to think someone might have a very consistent strategy that they have absolute confidence in especially if they have been seeking that themselves and unable to find it. Then to themselves the idea of that consistency seems utterly impossible for anyone to have. Now whether or not you are as consistent in your real time trading results as you say is another story because that is hard to verify without seeing it and sort of hard to believe that someone has a 90%+success rate over a long period of time. However regardless of the actually percentage I do think it is possible for some traders to have highly consistent results.

With all due respect downtickboy, ask yourself this question. If Mr Dow was really that good, why is taking time off with seminars in the USA, Singapore and now Germany - away from trading. Especially with Seminars in the US, he can't teach and trade at the same time.

Ahh yeah, I know, because he really cares about people and wants to spread the knowledge.

90%+ success rate over a long time... LOL

PS... Enjoy...
http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=49608&highlight=Proflogic*
http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=49269&highlight=Proflogic*

 

[hirsch.im.wald]

I don't get it.

Anybody who is not totally nuts knows, there cannot possibly be a ready made solution to trading. There can't be any "optimized" indicator settings to anything, by default.
This site is not kindergarten, I can't imagine a single member of Et only could ignore this.

So why does ET exist then?

Because trading is a lot of work, a lot of investigation, and sometimes you are happy to get some inspiration for new lines of research. If you have your own understanding of the market even the most stupid of ideas could bring you to something you've completely overlooked.

If you don't have your own understanding of the market, you're cannon fodder anyway and nothing will save you. No warning, no advise, no deus-ex-machina.

Charlie put out a very simple system, nothing new, instead a combination of three well known things: Dow theory, equivolume, CCI/ Detrend. Well, in my mind something snapped. I just came to see something I happened to overlook.
Now I'm going to investigate it, and I couldn't care less if Charlie is profitable at all. It's MY JOB to find out if there is any implicit edge in something I stumbled upon!
What do you expect from life guys, to get it all on a silver plate? Do you actually believe nobody on this planet is able to think for himself?

Instead of ranting around, you should better work on your own stuff. I don't like this attitude of "I know better!", "No, I know!".
In my eyes everybody coming forward with anything concrete on this forum is welcome, very welcome. I happen to be independent enough to make my conclusions...

 

[hans37]

Quote from Charlie Dow:

One might entertain the content of your posts if you knew what I do.

Holy crap you are too funny. I made a observation concerning the impression I got from of one of your posts, evidently I stepped on a nerve . At the time I honestly did not know you were a vendor of sorts, nor do I care now , although it does explain why you were so personally offended. All I do know is, I tore you a new asshole with simple logic and observations (contained in your posts thereafter to myself and others)and all you do is appear to retort with how great and educated you are.

What’s really funny is you continue down the road of looking the fool defending your illogical retorts by engaging in the appeal to authority fallacy concerning trading.


Just because you are an expert trader does not give you extra credibility as a poster .
If you continue with this approach I will continue to embarrass you as long as I find it entertaining.

 

[VictorS]

Quote from hirsch.im.wald:



I just came to see something I happened to overlook.
Now I'm going to investigate it, and I couldn't care less if Charlie is profitable at all. It's MY JOB to find out if there is any implicit edge in something I stumbled upon!

This is exactly what happened with me. So, in private messages I asked him his thoughts on the e-minis on three different occasions. He pinpointed where the market was headed and what the market would do when it reached those price levels.Three freaking times he nailed them with price reversals. I had to investigate. Never paid for any service yet he helps me with better understanding his system. He never solicited me. Why? Heck if I know.

Just investigate what he is saying. I promise you'll learn to read price better even if u dont trade the way he does. Reading the market instead of predicting the market will save you bundles.
By the way, its not easy to learn his trading method.

This is my last post ever on this subject defending him. Your loss not mine.

 

[mhashe]

Quote from hirsch.im.wald:

I don't get it.

Anybody who is not totally nuts knows, there cannot possibly be a ready made solution to trading. There can't be any "optimized" indicator settings to anything, by default.
This site is not kindergarten, I can't imagine a single member of Et only could ignore this.

So why does ET exist then?

Because trading is a lot of work, a lot of investigation, and sometimes you are happy to get some inspiration for new lines of research. If you have your own understanding of the market even the most stupid of ideas could bring you to something you've completely overlooked.

If you don't have your own understanding of the market, you're cannon fodder anyway and nothing will save you. No warning, no advise, no deus-ex-machina.

Charlie put out a very simple system, nothing new, instead a combination of three well known things: Dow theory, equivolume, CCI/ Detrend. Well, in my mind something snapped. I just came to see something I happened to overlook.
Now I'm going to investigate it, and I couldn't care less if Charlie is profitable at all. It's MY JOB to find out if there is any implicit edge in something I stumbled upon!
What do you expect from life guys, to get it all on a silver plate? Do you actually believe nobody on this planet is able to think for himself?

Instead of ranting around, you should better work on your own stuff. I don't like this attitude of "I know better!", "No, I know!".
In my eyes everybody coming forward with anything concrete on this forum is welcome, very welcome. I happen to be independent enough to make my conclusions...

Very well put. Interesting to observe how a useful thread has degenerated into mud slinging. For those with so much negativity, lets see you post some charts. Probably won't or can't, because negativity is usually the sign of frustrated unsuccessful trader/person. Someone looking for handouts, bitter that no one will give him the "grail" indicator.

Hint: Charlies divergence works with any oscillator. All you're doing is looking for a high probabilty inflection point where market sentiment is changing. Don't even need an indicator if you concentrate on the price action/momentum. Another Hint: Markets change constantly, Different markets oscillate at different frequencies, how do you compensate for that. Answer those two questions and that's all there is to trading. The rest is your own psychological makeup.