Paying for a mentor vs. Elite Trader Forum

[thedaytradr]

Hello everyone,

So I have been attempting to find a mentor here on cyberspace, getting a complete stranger from a faraway land who I will probably never meet to mentor me in my full time trading career (since I have been unprofitable for the past two years ).

I have been debating within myself whether there is any additional value of paying for a mentor.

So here is my question to the Elite Trader Community:

"What can a personal mentor (receiving compensation) offer, that the various members on the Elite Trader forum cannot?"

-or to rephrase the question-

" If I simply post here on ET, will I be receiving the same guidance or advice that a paid mentor will be providing? "

Thanks to everyone who replies and answers the poll.

IWDI

I think instead of paying mentors or anything else, you should try to learn as much as you can on internet. There is a bunch of information out there, from youtube video to social stock market network. if you want some good resources just send me in private inbox i will send you back some links

 

[newwurldmn]

I never paid for a mentor. But I did learn from a lot of guys: former bosses, former colleagues, people from outside the industry, and this forum. If you pay for it then the incentives are not aligned properly. The key to having a good mentor is your ability to understand what information you are receiving is good and what information is bad. Profitability is not the key determining factor of a good mentor. Insight and ability to explain is. And one mentor won't solve all your problems.

I learned the right personality through one guy. (not even a trader)
I learned the value of information from another guy. (a good and profitable trader)
I learned the important of risk management from a third guy (not very profitable as a prop trader but very profitable as an exotics trader) and fourth guy (was profitable but through luck).
I learned how to manage my boss from a fifth guy (only relevant in the institutional space).
And there are many others.... it's like an Oscar speech.

Rather than spending hard earned dollars on one mentor who is greedy, there is actually a lot of good information on this board. Your job is to figure out who is worth listening to and who isn't. Get the different view points and ask questions. Use that information to develop your own opinions and use that as a basis to share and ask more questions. If you are cut out to be a trader, you can blossom this way.

 

[qxr1011]

do not kid yourself: you will either do this on your own or not

there are no mentors in this filed, those who know what to do - do, those who do not - teach

 

[wrbtrader]

So here is my question to the Elite Trader Community:

"What can a personal mentor (receiving compensation) offer, that the various members on the Elite Trader forum cannot?"

-or to rephrase the question-

" If I simply post here on ET, will I be receiving the same guidance or advice that a paid mentor will be providing? "

Thanks to everyone who replies and answers the poll.

IWDI

It's impossible to be properly mentored here at Elitetrader.com forum. This forum is not setup for such. At best someone here can do at this forum is share trading tips. In contrast, if you're looking for a mentor...it has to be done in person. Too many traders are not suitable for trading and only a good mentor can discover such if mentoring was done in person.

Note: Trading tips are helpful but it ain't mentoring.

What effort have you made to find a mentor ?

For example, have you been telling folks here and elsewhere online your city location, do you attend in person trader meetings, do you join forums that are exclusive to the trading platform you're using, you willing to relocate if you're trying to trade for a living and so on.

ET has some sponsor mentors (e.g. Bone). They will not mentor you here at the forum. In contrast, you'll be required to be mentored at their website, chat room or office...you'll know who they are in comparison to the typical anonymous ET member.

Note: I'm not recommending Bone...he's just a sponsor name that I suddenly remember. There are other sponsors that you need to contact Baron (ET owner) for a list.

I've never understood why folks think posting message posts at this forum is mentoring. This forum at best can be used for trading tips. Seriously, look at this place, too much arguing, too much debate, long lags in moderator response to clean up threads, too many off topic discussions caused by trolls trying to derail threads, no real-time chatting tools, no white board collaboration, no screen sharing and many other tools that a student/mentor will need to have proper mentoring...

This place is not setup for mentoring. At best you can do is contact Baron (ET owner) to find out whom are the sponsor mentors and you then contact them. You will quickly see that none of them mentor AT this forum. Instead, they will mentor you in their own back yard in an environment they can control without interference from other ET members.

Seriously, if you doubt me, just take a look at all of the ET members that were viewed here as "teachers". Every time they started threads and were helping someone...everybody else showed up with their own perspective about trading or the trolls showed up.

If you're under-capitalized and can't afford one of ETs sponsored mentors...wait for Baron to soon implement thread starters being able to moderate their own threads. Next, start your own journal to see which ET member shows up and is helpful (helps you design your trading plan, helps ensure you're properly setup to be a trader in your home environment, takes risk management seriously, has a good grasp of all the variables involved to succeed in trading, has you verified you're properly capitalized, talks about how your charts should be setup on your screen, lots of trading advice beyond talking about trade entry signals because a good mentor will share more than just trade signals that actually improves your trading and so on)...as a moderator of your own thread you can then remove commentary by the trolls and folks that's trying to derail your trade journal.

After that, you can then setup something more private with that ET member elsewhere that gets more into actual mentoring...things like in person trading sessions, real-time collaboration and so on. Anything less...it ain't mentoring...that type of real mentoring ain't cheap.

Most traders are not suitable for trading let alone get involved in some student/mentor relationship. A good mentor will spot these types of traders a mile away and stay away just as fast as a good student being able to spot a bad mentor a mile away.

Once again, contact Baron (ET owner) about his sponsor mentor list and ask him about you being able to moderate your own trade journal...its a new feature that he will soon release here at his forum.

 

[prc117f]

Yes it is a strange phenomenon. My theory is that they have spent such a long time studying their own field that they can be very naive in other endeavours. Of course this is a generalisation. They also seem to take instruction well from a supposed expert in the finance field. Then of course they often have large savings and disposable income.

The problem is Doctors are smart in a narrow field but everything else is out of the picture. They spend 8 years in school and little "Street smarts" experience. They are sheep for the shearing.

 

[marketsurfer]

The best thing to do is join a real prop firm that will teach you working edges in the market. A real prop firm is one that profits from your profits not a churn and burn shop that just gives you leverage and makes$ from fees and commissions.

I see you haven't read the altucher mentor advice piece. Or you wouldnt be asking this question.

surf

 

[wrbtrader]

...I think the best place to find a trading mentor is for someone working in the financial arena to provide extra work in exchange for being taught...

Those particular mentors scrutinize the student background and qualifications (that includes security check...don't want to work with someone that once been arrested for trading violations) to ensure they are even suitable to be a trader.

My best friend kid attends a top university that recently built a multi million dollar trading room for business/finance/economic students. One of the sponsors of that trading room was looking for a few students as interns.

They checked grades, students were tested, security background check was done and so on. If someone made it into the internship...no pay but hands on learning with the firm head trader that could eventually lead into a job or pretty info on a resume when applying for a job elsewhere or going out on your own as a private trader.

If attending one of the almost hundred listed universities that offer trading rooms and mentoring isn't possible...

Reputable prop firm is an option as marketsurfer suggested but not all prop firms offer actual mentoring. Simply, gotta be careful there too about actual mentoring considering the trader at his desk next to you isn't going to waste his time teaching you because he's trying to make a living too without any interruptions.

Simply, if the goal is to trade for a living...you can't be cheap about it via Elitetrader.com simple text message board.

 

[marketsurfer]

Those particular mentors scrutinize the student background and qualifications (that includes security check...don't want to work with someone that once been arrested for trading violations) to ensure they are even suitable to be a trader.

My best friend kid attends a top university that recently built a multi million dollar trading room for business/finance/economic students. One of the sponsors of that trading room was looking for a few students as interns.

They checked grades, students were tested, security background check was done and so on. If someone made it into the internship...no pay but hands on learning with the firm head trader that could eventually lead into a job or pretty info on a resume when applying for a job elsewhere or going out on your own as a private trader.

Yes, great idea. But it weeds out everyone but the top tier. Most are far below the top tier that are attracted to trading. In fact, the market holds the greatest attraction for those least suited for it.

Surf

 

[kut2k2]

Self moderation of threads will never happen. If it does, et will be closed down within 6 months

surf

How is keeping trolls from disrupting threads going to shut ET down?

You're not making any sense here.

 

[wrbtrader]

Self moderation of threads will never happen. If it does, et will be closed down within 6 months

surf

Baron has already promise such. I assumed he'll eventually do it or do some sort'uv beta test format for a select few members that haven't been problematic but active members.

Yes, great idea. But it weeds out everyone but the top tier. Most are far below the top tier that are attracted to trading. In fact, the market holds the greatest attraction for those least suited for it.

Surf

Yeah, I agree in some way.

That's why if someone is even worthy of being a mentor (e.g. prop firm, university education trading program, professional private trader with an institutional background and so on)...they'll verify if someone is even suitable to be a trader before any so called mentoring even starts.

The real problem with this thread and so many others like it...traders do not know what real mentoring really is. They think they can come to a trader forum, post a chart and ask questions like if this is a buy or sell, how do I use this indicator, explain s/r analysis on this chart...they think any in-depth explanation is mentoring from anonymous folks.

Its not mentoring...its just someone sharing trading tips or as Kp calls it snippets. Hopefully the trader on their own can then piece together everything else on their own...most can't.

This thread starter (Iwilldoit) said he graduated from a business program. I wonder if he's willing to apply at one of the hundred of universities with a trading room and education program to get his mentoring that will most likely open up other job opportunities for traders via networking, internships and such.

Has he even looked at reputable prop firms ?

Elitetrader.com as a mentoring format...no way possible and I'm a little shock that the thread starter a business school graduate would believe such or consider such. ET is just a place for tips and snippets.