I think we should discuss on the merits of the case. I believe it is sheer discrimination, just because the SEC wants to give an appearance it is maintaining orderliness in the markets. I equally had less than $25000, but traded my balance above that. It was frustrating having to sit out a losing trade just because if you exit the trade, you would incur more than the maximum day-trades allowed and you become a pattern day-trader, unable to short-sell, trade on margin, trade options etc. If it was intended for the protection of the small guy, it is a sham: just like the requirement to have 2.5million dollars to invest in a hedge-fund: what rule says if you have more than that you are sophisticated enough to understand the risks, but if not you are a moron. Like I said, it is just arbitrary rules made to portray an appearance they are on top of their responsibilities.
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pattern daytrade rule discrimination ???
- Thread starter razor99
- Start date
I think we should discuss on the merits of the case. I believe it is sheer discrimination, just because the SEC wants to give an appearance it is maintaining orderliness in the markets. I equally had less than $25000, but traded my balance above that. It was frustrating having to sit out a losing trade just because if you exit the trade, you would incur more than the maximum day-trades allowed and you become a pattern day-trader, unable to short-sell, trade on margin, trade options etc. If it was intended for the protection of the small guy, it is a sham: just like the requirement to have 2.5million dollars to invest in a hedge-fund: what rule says if you have more than that you are sophisticated enough to understand the risks, but if not you are a moron. Like I said, it is just arbitrary rules made to portray an appearance they are on top of their responsibilities.
Quote from stylark3:
They have no right to tell an individual how often they can trade
their own money.
If you have limited funds and you are a good daytrader making
profits on every trade but you are limited to trading just 3 times
a week you are going to miss out on alot of profitable trades
weekly. So, in effect, the SEC is causing you to lose money.
We should be able to sue them for limiting our earning potential.
Sue them for all the potential money each individual is losing each
week by not being able to trade freely.
This ruling is unconstitutional limit our right to free trade and nobody is challenging it.
Ever heard of being undercapitalized? What's the chance of being successful long term in trading or any small business venture? Fairly low ... add in being undercapitalized and the odds of success grow even smaller.
If you want to trade $25K isn't very much money to come up with ... that is, if you're serious about it.
EpiphanyTrading
ET Sponsor
The logic that someone who doesn't have $25k is not a good trader is flawed. There are so many outside factors that go beyond the account including living expenses, outside business, etc. The list goes on.
I know plenty of talented traders who can handle their account but cannot handle their personal lives. Some people make tens and hundreds of thousands of dollars with us and they spend it just as fast.
I know plenty of talented traders who can handle their account but cannot handle their personal lives. Some people make tens and hundreds of thousands of dollars with us and they spend it just as fast.
I'm in the same boat. I have an intraday trading idea (an "edge") and I just don't want to put up $25k to start testing my idea. All I am willing to risk is $3k. So I asked on that forum and received some directions.
Now I think I found a solution, that's questrade.com. It's a Canadian broker. They let you trade US equities without PDT limitation. The commissions are reasonable, intraday margin is 1:3. There is a also a Jamaician broker alliancetrader.com, but their commissions are higher and the Web site looks ... how to say ... outdated.
Now I think I found a solution, that's questrade.com. It's a Canadian broker. They let you trade US equities without PDT limitation. The commissions are reasonable, intraday margin is 1:3. There is a also a Jamaician broker alliancetrader.com, but their commissions are higher and the Web site looks ... how to say ... outdated.
i agree, it IS discriminatory. it's also terrible for limiting long-term risk (see previous discussions), because if you're properly employing stops, and have an unfortunate run - using proper management - you get screwed.
two circumstances that can be for a 'real' trader to be under 25k?
1) a new house purchase, while the old one is still in the 'closing' period.
2) opening up a new brokerage account while most funds are tied up in a main one.
i've had to deal with both of those situations.
but i don't like government saying how you can / can't spend your money. then again, they've also done the "gambling bad, except for ponies! cuz we've been paid off - and except for certain places, cuz we've been paid off there".
not exclusive to one party, though recent repubs have been more in favor of taking away people's rights with their money.
two circumstances that can be for a 'real' trader to be under 25k?
1) a new house purchase, while the old one is still in the 'closing' period.
2) opening up a new brokerage account while most funds are tied up in a main one.
i've had to deal with both of those situations.
but i don't like government saying how you can / can't spend your money. then again, they've also done the "gambling bad, except for ponies! cuz we've been paid off - and except for certain places, cuz we've been paid off there".
not exclusive to one party, though recent repubs have been more in favor of taking away people's rights with their money.
Here's the thing kiddos.
If you were a good trader, you'd realize that you would get better gearing elsewhere while employing good money management, trading under $25k.
As I said, the SEC knows who they're discriminating against. They're protecting dummies from themselves.
Quit whining. You sound like the piker whiners when REG-T went into effect.
If you were a good trader, you'd realize that you would get better gearing elsewhere while employing good money management, trading under $25k.
As I said, the SEC knows who they're discriminating against. They're protecting dummies from themselves.
Quit whining. You sound like the piker whiners when REG-T went into effect.