Patak Trading

Maverick74 · Aug 17, 2012

Quote from colonial dr:

their largest account is defined by a 15 contract limit. This is a $7500 account -or slightly more if someone has $1,000 + commodity contracts.

Huh? Hold on buddy. I don't think you have traded futures before. If some one is giving you 15 contract limit on crude oil, bonds, gold, nat gas, copper, no way on earth can you do that with 7500. LOL. What I tell newbies is you should have 10k in cash in your FCM account for every one lot of ES you are trading or 25k in cash for every one lot in crude. This is a little conservative, but trust me, you will go through this money fast. Crude oil has a 3k atr per day per contract!!!!

We might need to do a primer on futures here on this thread as it appears a lot of guys are not even familiar with the basic terminology.

Maverick74 · Aug 17, 2012

Quote from operator:

$500 ES day trading margin x 15 = $7500.

Anybody who is stupid enough to trade 15 contracts of ES with only 7500 in their account is going to blow out inside of 48 hours. You can take that to the bank.

colonial dr · Aug 17, 2012

You think I'm a newbie? You act like you work for them. bottm line is, they will not fund or keep you if you lose 7500 dollars. 350 buys you a 7500 account, and shady (unclear) employment terms. I view it as a revenue operation, and I'm sure that they make more money on deposit revenue than cuts.

Why do they need $350 for a sim account and a guy to QUICKLY review it? This is NOT operational expense, it's revenue. Things cost money, but a sim account and brief interaction that spends less than a man hour of their time does not take $350. I hope no newb will ever go over there. Or a broke trader.

TopStepTrader is a bucket shop looking for revenue deposits. They do not have clear employment terms, and they're demanding hundreds of dollars for a sim account and a review. Need a deposit to take only serious traders? How about $20 then? That will keep the spamers away.

Maverick74 · Aug 17, 2012

Quote from colonial dr:

You think I'm a newbie? You act like you work for them. bottm line is, they will not fund or keep you if you lose 7500 dollars. 350 buys you a 7500 account, and shady (unclear) employment terms. I view it as a revenue operation, and I'm sure that they make more money on deposit revenue than cuts.

Why do they need $350 for a sim account and a guy to QUICKLY review it? This is NOT operational expense, it's revenue. Things cost money, but a sim account and brief interaction that spends less than a man hour of their time does not take $350. I hope no newb will ever go over there. Or a broke trader.

TopStepTrader is a bucket shop looking for revenue deposits. They do not have clear employment terms, and they're demanding hundreds of dollars for a sim account and a review. Need a deposit to take only serious traders? How about $20 then? That will keep the spamers away.

Yeah dude, you're a newbie. You have ZERO understanding of how futures work. Hell you were asking on another thread if you lease a seat at the CME do you have to pay brokerage fees. LOL.

Look, this has nothing to do with topstep, anyone who trades 15 lots of ES with 7500 is going to last 2 days. And forget about gold, copper or crude. Here is a quiz question for you, do you even know what the dollar value is for a handle in Gold or Copper? I know you're going to google it but I bet you still get it wrong.

Laissez Faire · Aug 17, 2012

Quote from Maverick74:

Here is a quiz question for you, do you even know what the dollar value is for a handle in Gold or Copper? I know you're going to google it but I bet you still get it wrong.

Maverick74 · Aug 17, 2012

Quote from Maverick74:

Here is a quiz question for you, do you even know what the dollar value is for a handle in Gold or Copper? I know you're going to google it but I bet you still get it wrong.

colonial dr · Aug 17, 2012

Quote from Maverick74:

Yeah dude, you're a newbie. You have ZERO understanding of how futures work. Hell you were asking on another thread if you lease a seat at the CME do you have to pay brokerage fees. LOL.

Look, this has nothing to do with topstep, anyone who trades 15 lots of ES with 7500 is going to last 2 days. And forget about gold, copper or crude. Here is a quiz question for you, do you even know what the dollar value is for a handle in Gold or Copper? I know you're going to google it but I bet you still get it wrong.

I'm a multimillionaire hanging out on elitetrader while eating junk food. If you wonder why I came here to ask about exchange seats, it's because I'm fucking rich. (sorry couldn't resist saying fucking) You are here selling TopStepTrader. Who knows maybe you are patak (I read in another thread you lost your girlfriend? Was it because of the picture of you on the top step website?)

Anyways....I'm just posting my opinion. I dont recommend a shop that charges hundreds for sim and review. Unfortunately for customers, there are lots of desperate suckers out there.

ps you could be profitable and rich too, but most likely you are a loser trader or a junior trader. Nothing wrong with being that, but naming me a newbe is funny and a dumb response. Quoting yourself is also dumb. You should go back to ripping off newbes for the rest of your days.

Maverick74 · Aug 17, 2012

Quote from colonial dr:

I'm a multimillionaire hanging out on elitetrader while eating junk food. If you wonder why I came here to ask about exchange seats, it's because I'm fucking rich. (sorry couldn't resist saying fucking) You are here selling TopStepTrader. Who knows maybe you are patak (I read in another thread you lost your girlfriend? Was it because of the picture of you on the top step website?)

Anyways....I'm just posting my opinion. I dont recommend a shop that charges hundreds for sim and review. Unfortunately for customers, there are lots of desperate suckers out there.

ps you could be profitable and rich too, but most likely you are a loser trader or a junior trader. Nothing wrong with being that, but naming me a newbe is funny and a dumb response. Quoting yourself is also dumb. You should go back to ripping off newbes for the rest of your days.

I knew it. You don't even know the tick value of Gold and Copper. Dude, just get out of here OK. I usually only act like a dick down in P&R but you really take the cake. I'm trying to have a serious discussion about futures up here and you don't even know what an exchange seat is, you don't know the tick value of futures contracts, you obviously have no clue how to margin futures properly and the advice you give young traders is to borrow 7500 from their parents or a credit card and trade 15 lots of crude with that 7500? LOL. I mean, this is actually serious and a lot of guys are reading this, so I want to at least get the facts out there so no newbie EVER EVER takes your advice.

BTW, your reading skills are as bad as your knowledge of futures, that wasn't me on that thread who lost his girlfriend, that was the thread starter. And no, I don't work for Patak, my series 7 is currently hanging with Bright. If you actually knew how to use the search button you would have figured that out in 2 minutes. Please stop the ruse. Go play make believe somewhere else.

You are not adding any value here. I would laugh at how ignorant you are about futures, but I'm trying to be relatively civil up here. Come down to P&R and I'll rip your skull off and defaecate down your neck. Up here I have to use the kiddie gloves.

ExchangeBonds · Aug 17, 2012

Tst is a great place to learn imo. It is better than a regular sim as you have something on the line but not like straight trading futures. They know that if you had the money to trade on your own, you would, so they get some bottom of the barrel traders. This is one reason why they keep a tight leash, but a bit too tight at times to me. On the 100k account, if you lose 5k, you WILL definitely be sent back, and I'm being generous on the 5k. They will be on you before that from what I've heard. Imo, this does not produce good psychology for trading when starting out, but it is their money after all. I believe they want traders to succeed and are good people but risk limits are a bit tight, as they are concerned about their money which is 100% reasonable. Also the commission rate is horrible but that is another discussion. In the end, if you have your own account and are profitable, you do not need tst unless you want to supplement your own account. There is no salary so no point in only having a tst account if you have the money for your own. If you are a poor trader, tst is a good opportunity if you can live with their requirements.

Maverick74 · Aug 17, 2012

Quote from ExchangeBonds:

Tst is a great place to learn imo. It is better than a regular sim as you have something on the line but not like straight trading futures. They know that if you had the money to trade on your own, you would, so they get some bottom of the barrel traders. This is one reason why they keep a tight leash, but a bit too tight at times to me. On the 100k account, if you lose 5k, you WILL definitely be sent back, and I'm being generous on the 5k. They will be on you before that from what I've heard. Imo, this does not produce good psychology for trading when starting out, but it is their money after all. I believe they want traders to succeed and are good people but risk limits are a bit tight, as they are concerned about their money which is 100% reasonable. Also the commission rate is horrible but that is another discussion. In the end, if you have your own account and are profitable, you do not need tst unless you want to supplement your own account. There is no salary so no point in only having a tst account if you have the money for your own. If you are a poor trader, tst is a good opportunity if you can live with their requirements.

BTW, as far as commission goes, you get member rates after you have a certain amount of equity in your account. That cuts your rates by over 50%. So that is pretty fair. Also, they have to make money somewhere when you go live, so that's going to be on commish.