Ironically you are the gonzo and the h8er on ET.
Let's see your data. Until then, it's a myth created by a self professed provocateur.
Our 400,000 Trade Test Proves Using Stops Is Not Very Bright
- Thread starter marketsurfer
- Start date
Ironically you are the gonzo and the h8er on ET.
Let's see your data. Until then, it's a myth created by a self professed provocateur.
Indeed.
But even as an Average Joe trader I knew (but only after a while since I began trading) that it is a bad idea to let the others (especially the broker and his ilk of partners in the chain... Hi Citadel!
) to know about my intention by informing them about my stop level...I never anymore use stops, I set the stop level only locally (ie. it never leaves my room) and fire the close order myself (ie. my pgm) if the stop signal hits...
The difference is of course that otherwise, ie. when sending the stop order to the broker, that then the close order would be sent by the broker...
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This is 100% true. You either have it, or you don't. No prestigious university in the world can change that
Smart! Most guys don't understand that the market is DESIGNED to take your money. That's how it survives and thrives. Most all common sense wisdom propagated by brokers and the market's marketing machine is deeply flawed. Ie Charts, stops, etc--- its all designed for u to lose. Infact its quite insidious. Just look at how the true believers attack me since i offer another viewpoint.
Once one "gets the joke" of the market, they are well on their way to understanding.
True, the market is designed to take your money, like with these methods:
1.) bid/ask spread
2.) broker and his partners spying and trading against own clients
...
But, one can trick them out:
- never use market orders, instead use always limit orders and offer mid-price or a better price for you
- split the opening order into at least 2 parts, to get a better average entry price
- split the closing order into at least 2 parts, to get a better average exit price
- never use stop orders (which by definition only sit at the broker), instead do it yourself...
- use brokers with cheap commissions
- use at least 2 brokers so that no one broker can know everything about your method/strategy...
(some brokers nowadays are like google and facebook: they sell all the information they collect about you and your orders and trades to 3rd party companies like Citadel, and they then make very good use of that information, sometimes even trading against you!...)
...
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It scares you, doesn't it? You will never gain traction in this biz until you "get the joke".
No need to respond, your posting history tells us all we need to know, chefbusboyardee.
surf
Sounds great in theory, but in fast moving markets it only works in fantasyland. With entries you miss getting filled on some of the best trades and with self-held stops, the exit slippage stabs your asshole real hard. That delay from your terminal to their system matters.
I tried both of what you mention and realized the hard way it was penny wise/pound foolish. Logical stop placement (at broker) works much better for me
It depends on the individual trading style or the system used.
I assume you mean FX trading where every tick counts. No, I just mean normal stock and options trading, and not the very short-time trading daytraders usually use.
My strategy is not dependent on immediate fills; it works even if the order gets filled only after some minutes, or even gets not filled at all --> no problem, re-evaluate the situation and possibly try with a new order...
As shown in the list I make use of averaging. And I think you too could make use of that.
Maybe traders need some new paradigms...
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Yeah, try to save some pennies and miss at the same time 5 to 100 times bigger moves because you were not filled. If the impact of these pennies is so important for your profit it means profits are very small and you should build a real system.
If you have a buy signal: buy at market.
If you have a sell signal: sell at market.
If you have a stop signal: out at market. That's the only one I agree on with you. Never show where your stop is.
That is your method, not mine ;-)
Be happy if it works for you.
I know my method is better for my style of trading... or are you going to question that?