options . . . very hard to make money

Quote from billyjoerob:

According to a recent post, "trying to make a buck over the past year has been the triple-diamond-black slope of trading history. It's been just miserable."


So my point here is that there's no evidence any of these people are making money . . . and every reason to believe that they're not. Until I see evidence to the contrary, I will continue to believe that a) options attracts gamblers with huge appetite for leverage and b) in the long run, only the house wins. [/B]
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Billy ... couple of questions .... assuming succesful option traders were willing .... How much would you be willing to pay

1. To see the evidence and
2. To be mentored for say 12 months
 
I wouldn't pay anything for mentoring. Trading is more like dieting than knowing how to play the piano . . . Everybody knows how to lose weight, they just don't follow the plan. If there is a way to make money in options, it should be for sale at Amazon.
 
To take the other side of the argument, there do seem to be ways to make money in options. There may be some bivalent outcomes that are better played with options, taking advantage of the "convexity," as one poster put it. Adam Warner at DailyOptionsReport seems to have some strategies that work, such as selling calls on broken stocks and selling puts on volatile, trending stocks.
 
Hypothetical: Your model predicts a rally exceeding 1SD in 5 trading days on XYZ with a drop of 1SD on SV. I can assure you that options will produce the best ROC and risk-adjusted return.

If you like i will post a position here at 10am Eastern tomorrow. A delta position in options and one in shares. We can wager on the outcome.
 
If you can predict the timing and the extent of a move, then you've solved 100% of the problem. Yes, if I knew McAfee was going to be acquired, I would buy options too.
 
Quote from billyjoerob:

If you can predict the timing and the extent of a move, then you've solved 100% of the problem. Yes, if I knew McAfee was going to be acquired, I would buy options too.
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Nonsense. I am not referring to inside info or clairvoyance. I'll post a position I am taking in SLB at 10am Eastern. A position that will outperform a position in the shares in absolute and risk-adjusted terms.
 
Quote from billyjoerob:

I've come to the conclusion that there are no retail options traders who consistently make money. The arguments for options make no sense. Hedging: the best form of hedge is going to cash. Leverage: I can get plenty of movement on my equity curve with margin alone, I don't need options to give me more anxiety. Non-directional, uncorrelated income: again, cash is non-directional and uncorrelated. Don't try to make trading more complicated.
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You can't find anyone so you claim there "are NO retails options traders consistently make money"? That's crazy in the first place.


Hedging: the best form of hedge is going to cash.
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No, it's not. It's that simple.


Leverage: I can get plenty of movement on my equity curve with margin alone, I don't need options to give me more anxiety.
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I would have more anxiety with margin which can wipe a person out then long options, where the max risk is known up front. Besides, your level of anxiety has nothing to do with the power of options.

Also, there are trades that are volatility trades that simply can't be done without options.

If you don't want to use options however that is fine and I would not try to talk you into using them - just understand that for a certain group of people they can be profitable over and over again.

JJacksET4
 
Quote from billyjoerob:

If there is a way to make money in options, it should be for sale at Amazon.
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I think it is on the same shelf as the recipe for Coke ...
 
Quote from atticus:

There are many guys on here who are successful on the retail level. One guy I know from CT turned 6k into 200k in a couple of years.
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What was his strategy ?
 
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