"Operation Weback"

Scataphagos · Mar 7, 2012

Quote from achilles28:

"... The argument illegals do jobs Americans won't is total red herring.

May be some truth to that.

However, if "$500/week UI" were terminated, those jobs will soon be taken up.

A little hunger is great motivation.

(I remember reading a story last year or so... some guy turned down a $60,000/yr job offer... because his "unemployment + subsidies" netted him more than the "after tax" of $60K/yr employment. Anybody but me see the problem here?)

achilles28 · Mar 7, 2012

Quote from Scataphagos:

May be some truth to that.

However, if "$500/week UI" were terminated, those jobs will soon be taken up.

A little hunger is great motivation.

So true. End UI and deport illegals. Jobless problem solved.

achilles28 · Mar 7, 2012

Quote from Scataphagos:

(I remember reading a story last year or so... some guy turned down a $60,000/yr job offer... because his "unemployment + subsidies" netted him more than the "after tax" of $60K/yr employment. Anybody but me see the problem here?)

Nope. No problem.

America prides itself on it's affluence. That we can shoulder a 60K a year parasite to sit on his ass and do nothing, is a mark of strength. Not weakness?

bigarrow · Mar 7, 2012

Quote from achilles28:

That's corporate propaganda disseminated by farm operators who don't want to pay higher wages. So they run to the newspapers and say they can't get enough labor to pick the strawberrys.

If they paid a decent wage (10-12 bucks an hour), those positions would get filled by Americans.

The argument illegals do jobs Americans won't is total red herring.

$10 to $12 an hour is the least an illegal will work for hard labor.
For seasonal work and where the worker has to travel to chase the jobs it would cost much more to hire Americans and when you figure in matching SS and workers comp and insurance and the associated book keeping the cost skyrockets.
So the answer is hire American and prepare to pay double or triple for American grown produce.

achilles28 · Mar 7, 2012

Quote from bigarrow:

$10 to $12 an hour is the least an illegal will work for hard labor.
For seasonal work and where the worker has to travel to chase the jobs it would cost much more to hire Americans and when you figure in matching SS and workers comp and insurance the cost skyrockets.
So the answer is hire American and prepare to pay double or triple for American grown produce.

That's the point. Wages are supposed to come up. Doubling wages to pay an American a competitive income is fine. I seriously doubt farmers can't attract labor at 16 bucks/hour + benefits. That's bunk. McDonalds pays minimum wage, which in many States, is ~10 bucks. And traveling? Ever heard of commuting? Most workers do it.

377OHMS · Mar 7, 2012

Strawberries and onions are paid by the box and the foreman distributes the money to the picking crew. There is no minimum wage.

bigarrow · Mar 7, 2012

Quote from achilles28:

That's the point. Wages are supposed to come up. Doubling wages to pay an American a competitive income is fine. I seriously doubt farmers can't attract labor at 16 bucks/hour + benefits. That's bunk. McDonalds pays minimum wage, which in many States, is ~10 bucks.

I don't know what the price is to attract good American workers, but the farmers aren't paying that price because the customers won't pay that price so it doesn't really matter.

People should stop blaming the illegals, they are providing a service in demand by the market place as are the employers.
The ones who merit blame is the purchasing public in America, if they don't want cheap labor from Mexico they can stop it with their checkbooks. But Americans do want cheap illegal Mexican labor, just like they want cheap Chinese products made under slave like conditions.

achilles28 · Mar 7, 2012

Quote from 377OHMS:

Strawberries and onions are paid by the box and the foreman distributes the money to the picking crew. There is no minimum wage.

Then growers pay more per box, instead of more per hour....?

377OHMS · Mar 7, 2012

Quote from achilles28:

Then growers pay more per box, instead of more per hour....?

Yeah I guess.

But picking is a skill. If the Mexicans allow an unskilled American onto the crew then the whole crew loses money.

achilles28 · Mar 7, 2012

Quote from bigarrow:

I don't know what the price is to attract good American workers, but the farmers aren't paying that price because the customers won't pay that price so it doesn't really matter.

Wrong. Farmers aren't willing to increase wages because they can hire illegals for less. That's the problem. If illegal labor was outlawed, growers would be forced to increase wages to attract American labor. And yes, consumers would buy less at the checkout. But that's beside the point.

Quote from bigarrow:

People should stop blaming the illegals, they are providing a service in demand by the market place as are the employers.
The ones who merit blame is the purchasing public in America, if they don't want cheap labor from Mexico they can stop it with their checkbooks. But Americans do want cheap illegal Mexican labor, just like they want cheap Chinese products made under slave like conditions.

Again, more propaganda. It's Corporations who want to offshore factories and import illegals. NOT consumers. Consumers want jobs that pay a decent wage. Sure, if you asked the average American 20 years ago, they'd pick lower prices over wages. But the pendulum is swinging back and most Americans are willing to pay more for US-made products, after seeing the damage wrought by illegals and outsourcing. The reason why Walmart is the #1 retailer is not because we love Chinese products. It's because most Americans are broke off their ass and can't afford much else! Average incomes dropped considerably over the past 20 years, after REAL inflation (not politically-rigged BLS CPI) is factored in. It now takes 2 income earners to barely support a family. 50 years ago, it only took one.