Opening Orders - 2008

total_keops · Dec 17, 2008

Quote from EMZ:

4 fills, all longs, 4 wins +0.075 avg

re: losing trades
Sometimes there is not much one can do, and those trades/days can erase a great deal of winnings. Best reaction at least in hindsight would be to just get out.
E.g. this stock opens down away from its FV by 1.6%, no news anywhere. Ofc you get a fill long, and if you are layering you may have higher size in that position.
It opens at 35.98, and within few seconds prints down to 35 and stays there. Futs moving up, check news again, nothing, check your pricings, they were ok, you may add some more near the figure, expecting an up move. Nothing, next few prints and it's down 34.70's straight down line. Stock closes at it's LOD in the 32.60's never printing above 35.

Sometimes yes they do recover to even print you out with profits, but the ones that don't, would cause significant losses.

And if it wasn't enough, after the market close you will read very insightfull stories on Yahoo! from nowhere journalists knowing shit about trading telling you exactly why the stock went down (or up), like they knew or called every investor/trader and asked them their motives. Just adding to the insult. And then you have to stay calm, lol.

jodistrict · Dec 17, 2008

Quote from EMZ:

4 fills, all longs, 4 wins +0.075 avg

re: losing trades
Sometimes there is not much one can do, and those trades/days can erase a great deal of winnings. Best reaction at least in hindsight would be to just get out.
E.g. this stock opens down away from its FV by 1.6%, no news anywhere. Ofc you get a fill long, and if you are layering you may have higher size in that position.
It opens at 35.98, and within few seconds prints down to 35 and stays there. Futs moving up, check news again, nothing, check your pricings, they were ok, you may add some more near the figure, expecting an up move. Nothing, next few prints and it's down 34.70's straight down line. Stock closes at it's LOD in the 32.60's never printing above 35.

Sometimes yes they do recover to even print you out with profits, but the ones that don't, would cause significant losses.

Does anyone make use of the pre-market data? I have been putting up a time&sales window and go through the stocks comparing the last print of the t&s window to my buy and sell envelopes . If for example, the premarket price is already significantly lower then my bid, I may remove the stock from my list. I have caught some news stocks this way.

Don Bright · Dec 17, 2008

Quote from jodistrict:

Does anyone make use of the pre-market data? I have been putting up a time&sales window and go through the stocks comparing the last print of the t&s window to my buy and sell envelopes . If for example, the premarket price is already significantly lower then my bid, I may remove the stock from my list. I have caught some news stocks this way.

I "do" check my L2 montage but don't pay tooooo much attention if the trading is not way away. Since the stock is going to open based on a large number of shares on the NYSE....I only change pricing if 50 cents or more away from my indicated bid/offer.

Don

Sky123987 · Dec 18, 2008

Hi,

I was just wondering how long you guys hold your positions?

Thanks

VinMan · Dec 18, 2008

13 Fills 12 Longs. 7 Winners 6 Losers

+3.4c/sh

Tempted to increase size a bit but every time I do I go into a losing streak. I wonder if thats just coincidence or a function of size contributing to greater slippage (not large size either way).

Is there a point of diminishing returns as size increases?

total_keops · Dec 18, 2008

Quote from jodistrict:

Does anyone make use of the pre-market data? I have been putting up a time&sales window and go through the stocks comparing the last print of the t&s window to my buy and sell envelopes . If for example, the premarket price is already significantly lower then my bid, I may remove the stock from my list. I have caught some news stocks this way.

I look at pre bid/ask and adjust if necessary.

total_keops · Dec 18, 2008

Quote from Sky123987:

Hi,

I was just wondering how long you guys hold your positions?

Thanks

From less than 1 sec to 5 minutes. Less than 1 minute on average.

Don Bright · Dec 18, 2008

T and AVP good + 18 cents.

Obviously another slow day, but check for imbalances today for expiration tomorrow. The "year end effect" last expiration. Tomorrow should be pretty good....then...."Happy Holidays" ...

Snow in Vegas, LOL

Don

total_keops · Dec 18, 2008

Quote from VinMan:

13 Fills 12 Longs. 7 Winners 6 Losers

+3.4c/sh

Tempted to increase size a bit but every time I do I go into a losing streak. I wonder if thats just coincidence or a function of size contributing to greater slippage (not large size either way).

Is there a point of diminishing returns as size increases?

Could it be a psychological factor, you not being totally comfortable with the increased size and therefore not responding the same way?

total_keops · Dec 18, 2008

Quote from Don Bright:

Geez, break even day with only 2 fills. Oh well, FOMC in a couple of hours should be fun.
Don

Don,
What products your traders trade on FOMC? (ES, Forex, ...)
Are the strategies mostly fading and trying to get in the long swings?
Is there an avantage for retail traders to associate themselves with Bright for the FOMC?
Thanks