On the fundamentalism of PA traders

Some traders "see" price action better without using any (or perhaps very few) indicators.

Other traders (most definitely) "see" price action better while using a few indictors in an integrated, supported fashion which shows them the move that the markets are most likely to make.

***

The fact of the matter is that everying is in an indicator, including the price bars on your screen whose content can easily be manipulated to show different types of information and those lines that people draw to show them support and resistance, et. al.

It's really all about YOU and YOUR TRADING. Not indicators, or price action, or what Joe Trader is doing on his screen with his account.

Period.

So Good Luck.
 
Quote from Smurfie:
I finally got an inherently indicator-based system down that works, but of course it works because it captures something about price behaviour - not because this indicator and the patterns it makes are magical. It took me five years to get to this point
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Could you elaborate please?

I’m not looking for specifics about the actual indicator or its settings, just some general yes/no and quick answers to compare it to generic indicators and their usages.

is it a common indicator or did you write it yourself?

is it a combination system of many indicators, or multiple time frames for confirmation, or anything like that?

is it a price derivative of the symbol being traded, or does it use external data, ie benchmark index comparison or market statistics?

can all signals be taken as is, or must you concentrate on nuances and small details of the indicator?

must you combine it with what you do know about price action?

can it be used on any stock/future, or is it specific to only one or a few?

how long has it been working?
 
This is true of all indicator based trading.

It gives you an effective way of reading "price action", it tells you what price is doing right now, and has the highest probability of continuing to do for "X" amount of bars in the future.
 
Quote from AlmostGotIt:

Could you elaborate please?

I’m not looking for specifics about the actual indicator or its settings, just some general yes/no and quick answers to compare it to generic indicators and their usages.
is it a common indicator or did you write it yourself?
is it a combination system of many indicators, or multiple time frames for confirmation, or anything like that?
is it a price derivative of the symbol being traded, or does it use external data, ie benchmark index comparison or market statistics?
can all signals be taken as is, or must you concentrate on nuances and small details of the indicator?
must you combine it with what you do know about price action?
can it be used on any stock/future, or is it specific to only one or a few?
how long has it been working?
More...

Golly, this is a very impressive shopping list for one poor little indicator.

regards
f9
 
Hey AlmostGotIt

I wrote you a long answer, but then I kinda thought it looked more like an autobiography of my trading life, and it would interest no one.

Basically, I use three indicators found in most charting packages: An EMA, Keltner channels and MACD. I also use standard candlesticks.

I trade the Eur/Usd spot in the 5m TF and that is all I look at. I'm looking into 4H as well now.

I focus on a handful of really standard tactics such as the bounces Kiwi mentioned and MACD action along with well-known chart patterns and/or single-bar stuff. I've found the idiom that entries are a dime a dozen, but good traders to trade them are precious and few to be true. I'm a horrible, horrible trader, so I'm reading Douglas, Steenbarger and Kiev to a bloody pulp plus 25+ tomes I recently bought on Zen buddhism (no, really).

I find that it really lies in you; in your studies and statistics and basically getting to know your chart configuration. Indicators may be a crutch but they make an awful lot of sense to me and I've constructed and tested many myself until I realised, it's not really about the bike.

I've traded for five years and this spring I started taking my new-found breakeveness into gradual profitability. For six months and somewhere between 700-900 trades,* I've slowly and steadily increased my positions based on profits. I'm not trading for a living ... yet.

I'm nowhere near an accomplished trader, and I'll never be a trading rock star. My psyche is not really that of a trader, but I've come a long way and it just sorta rubs me the wrong way sometimes when I'm told that what I do is inferior and plain wrong.

Cheers,

Smurf

* My statistics is based on what should be done; what I actually did I save for my diary and chart mark-ups which is why I don't have a clear picture of it.
 
Quote from bbqbbq:

i have noticed in trending markets volume is higher in direction of the trend, in choppy markets you will have irregular volume especially on the 1 min chart.. so volume can be a good indicator whether youre in a choppy or trendy market

also a pair of ma's is great to see if markets are choppy or trendy
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ma's underwear?
 
Smurfie, The use of the indicators you mentioned sound a lot like the approach used by Ryan Watts. He basically uses them as filters for price action. He is a scapler and has a high success ratio. You might like to check out his site. He seems to be an honest guy, full time trader. fwiw.
Not my style, but works well for him.
 
<i>"Maybe it's because indicators offer a sense of security, a false sense of security no doubt. I used indicators for many years, until I finally realized, hold it there chief, what am I doing, I see things happening multiple bars earlier by just examining price and fortunately that woke me up."</i>

Indicators of any kind are akin to training wheels. Whether they are oscillator, sentiment or volume related, it's all just ancillary information. No standard setting or custom-written indicators can outperform or in all reality even keep par with bare-bones price measurement.

Learn how to pattern = measure price bars themselves, and everything else is irrelevant fluff. Volume included.

The tape talks clearly to those who speak it's language. Funny how so many people chase tails and waste endless hours coding up stuff that merely retards their overall performance potential. Ironic how the true holy grails of trading actually lie in plain sight of all... just cleverly hidden by human nature itself. :cool:
 
Hey Bmwhendrix

I did buy his stuff and followed the group for a while, but in the end I tweaked it to my own liking. I made it mine so to speak. But Watts is one of the good guys I think. They're few and far between. :)

Smurf
 
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