offshoring/outsourcing reduces salaries in tech sector: proof?

if u say outsourcing is a good thing u R WRONG
u say that because of your dogmatic indoctrinated socialist beliefs like free trade is good, competition is good.

LOL
:D
 
Quote from SNYP40A1:

I really don't see any problem with having Americans compete with other people in other countries. Competition is what drives a free and efficient market and the Americans complaining about job loss or wage loss simply need to develop a higher-paying skill set. We certainly have a lot more educational opportunities to do that compared to people living in other countries such as India. I am glad that outsourcing exists so that some people in India and China are able to perform at their higher skillset (what else would the be doing?). The real problem is cultural. Our society does not value hard work. It only values the product of hard work, wealth and status. If you go to Japan and tell someone that you work in finance or law, they will look at you like some kind of parasite. Programmers are like any other type of profession, there are good programmers and there are bad programmers. And the best will always be able to claim the highest premium.
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LOL

you fell for the myth of the more u work the more u earn. this is the myth called american dream, and shared alot by the working poor. its ok they have nothing else to hope for. lol the real world doesnt work like that
 
I really don't see any problem with having Americans compete with other people in other countries. Competition is what drives a free and efficient market and the Americans complaining about job loss or wage loss simply need to develop a higher-paying skill set. We certainly have a lot more educational opportunities to do that compared to people living in other countries such as India. I am glad that outsourcing exists so that some people in India and China are able to perform at their higher skillset (what else would the be doing?). The real problem is cultural. Our society does not value hard work. It only values the product of hard work, wealth and status. If you go to Japan and tell someone that you work in finance or law, they will look at you like some kind of parasite. Programmers are like any other type of profession, there are good programmers and there are bad programmers. And the best will always be able to claim the highest premium.
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SNYP, there are no higher paying skill sets. Are we so arrogant to think that there are so many things we do better that we can employ 100 million americans doing higher end jobs? Take a look around, it isn't working.

They are just as educated as us and will work for a fraction of the cost. China now puts out more engineers, who work for less, and they work hard.

You simply cannnot compete with someone who will work for less at the same job.
 
Quote from PocketChange:

There is no viable solution that would not escalate into all out trade wars:

Unfortunately our power wielding processes are plagued with special interests and corruption. One big Congressional Circle Jerk.
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That's bottom line. US Fortune 500 won't allow reasonable tariffs. And the wh**res Washington will do their bidding.
 
Quote from Mav88:

SNYP, there are no higher paying skill sets. Are we so arrogant to think that there are so many things we do better that we can employ 100 million americans doing higher end jobs? Take a look around, it isn't working.

They are just as educated as us and will work for a fraction of the cost. China now puts out more engineers, who work for less, and they work hard.

You simply cannnot compete with someone who will work for less at the same job.
More...

Yeah China's engineering salaries are just fine....in CHINA! In fact, they're upper middle class salaries.

Big problem in the USA is overpriced assets, and the insanely overpriced service sector (ie: finance, law, healthcare, etc.).

Chinese engineers get paid, what, $1000/month? So if bankers in the USA started earning $500/month, lawyers $600/month, etc. -- $1000/month for an American engineer wouldn't be a bad salary. I suspect that's where we're heading anyways, as ultimately salaries will reflect the value that is provided to society.
 
Quote from Mav88:

SNYP, there are no higher paying skill sets. Are we so arrogant to think that there are so many things we do better that we can employ 100 million americans doing higher end jobs?

You simply cannnot compete with someone who will work for less at the same job.
More...

Indeed.

The post-industrial economic Utopia never materialized. It was a myth sold by academics and politicians who were on the take, or too dumb to know they were taken (for a ride).

Exporting manufacturing didn't shift IQ's 20-30 points up the scale. To suggest the armies of laidoff blue collar-types should "retrain" and become calculator-wielding geeks for Boeing or Goldman, is more ivory tower pie-in-the-sky crap. Most Americans simply don't have the gray matter to comprehend advanced skill sets. And that's not an insult against them, in any way. That's normal.

*Even if* we could somehow retrain the 8 Million causalities from the last recession into an advanced vocation - say engineers - guess what? They're competing against Chindian engineers at 1/4'er the cost.

Technology, education and tariffs were an asset. We gave it all away. All globalization does is export jobs/wealth from developed economies to build and fuel growth in 3rd world countries. They win, we lose. Well, the Fortune 500 execs, their shareholders, and our politicians that sold us down the river for 30 pieces of silver, they win. That's why the did it. Oh well. Fuck it. Right?
 
Quote from pitz:

Yeah China's engineering salaries are just fine....in CHINA! In fact, they're upper middle class salaries.

Big problem in the USA is overpriced assets, and the insanely overpriced service sector (ie: finance, law, healthcare, etc.).

Chinese engineers get paid, what, $1000/month? So if bankers in the USA started earning $500/month, lawyers $600/month, etc. -- $1000/month for an American engineer wouldn't be a bad salary. I suspect that's where we're heading anyways, as ultimately salaries will reflect the value that is provided to society.
More...

Yep. One undifferentiated mass of labor that all toils for the same wage. That's where its headed. Third World incomes come up by tearing ours down.

Is that what our parents and grandparents fought and died for in WW1 and 2?

So the Chinese, Indians, Latin Americans could get rich off of our sacrifice, ingenuity and research?

The answer to free trade is fair trade. No tariffs between high-income states (G8), moderate tariffs against low-income/cheap labor States. That's a fair compromise. Unfortunately, there's little to stop it now. Except a grassroots revolt. Could happen in Europe.
 
Yeah Achilles, there's still plenty of engineers who never were able to recover from the 2001 recession. Having more engineers running around chasing the same jobs isn't the answer. The only 'education' required, I would submit, would be to confine bankers to "re-education" concentration camps, as punishment for the mistakes made over the past 30 years.

USA needs a gameplan for getting its engineering workforce back to work after being off of work for the past decade. Not a plan to rescue the banks, or anything dumb like that.
 
Quote from pitz:

Yeah Achilles, there's still plenty of engineers who never were able to recover from the 2001 recession. Having more engineers running around chasing the same jobs isn't the answer. The only 'education' required, I would submit, would be to confine bankers to "re-education" concentration camps, as punishment for the mistakes made over the past 30 years.

USA needs a gameplan for getting its engineering workforce back to work after being off of work for the past decade. Not a plan to rescue the banks, or anything dumb like that.
More...

You know, my heart goes out to your plight. Most of the Boomers gladly abandoned their civic duty in exchange for Government handouts and medicare checks. The era of populist-fueled largess and unshakable faith in Government really brought this Country to it's knees, economically. And when MFN status for China was tabled and NAFTA back in the 80's and 90's? Nobody cared. Those idiots ate up all the nonsense their political shills sold them. I still remember my dad lamenting for *years* how MFN status and NAFTA would kill Canadian industry. It did. His paper conversion factory (founded in 1913) went under in 2008. China + India + Mexico + Housing crash.

I say my heart goes out to you, because this is the new normal. America has been rendered so uncompetitive by unions, entitlement spending, endless debt, and the abolition of tariffs, I don't see it coming back. And then there's a looming debt implosion about 5 years down the road that'll send this economy into a Depression for a good 10 years. New normal is ugly. The truth is ugly. And our futures are downright scary. All I can recommend is take whatever job you can find in IT, work up the chain as fast as you can, and try to land a position in a sector that can weather the coming storm. Preferably healthcare, Government (non-DHS related, please), or overseas (China/India). I daytrade currencies. What I do is a joke. 99.9% of people out there who work a real job, creating real value, most of them will pay hard. Instead of what's optimal, you need to start thinking about long-term survival. Good luck.
 
This is a little out there and outside of the box.
Don't take it out context.

When you look at the US from outside of our borders you realize we are a War machine with superior technology and weapons of mass destruction.

We need to be the outsourced military for our allies and the forced peace keeping military occupying our foes period. We must keep control... and anyone that develops any weapons technology must be put in place. Without this big stick our words are meaningless.

For this worldly peace keeping service we employ only US citizens and and US companies. All transactions are in our currency and is mandatory. We take a non negotiable rate = 1/3 of their GDP through what ever means: taxing/treaty or flat out force.

Currently 40% of our tax payers are already on the government and military payrolls. We already provide these services essentially free of charge to the world. To get out of this depression we need to expand our tax base and this is the business we do best.

I'm sure there are a few historians that can draw parallels to the brits, romans, germans and others.
 
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