Observations on the NYSE specialist.

Quote from Hamlet:

Than kindly clarify for all of us please, so that their can be no misinterpretation. I only seek the truth, the last thing I want to do is misunderstand you.

You have said in many posts I believe, and correct me if I am wrong here, that you felt it would be a waste of time for anyone to learn how to trade on the NYSE. Yet now you say traders can indeed profitably trade on the NYSE.

I would like to know what you actually mean by these seemingly conflicting statements.
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No, I never said that it would be a waste of time to learn NYSE trading. I said it would be unwise for a new trader to invest in such a project. I have always maintained that some traders can trade NYSE profitably.

Kindly cease and desist from attempting to describe my statements. Your descriptions are highly inaccurate, and disputing them wastes my time and disrupts the thread. I consider it a form of harassment. If you do not cease at once, I will make another complaint to the moderator. Please express your views about the truth of the topic and not your views about the truth of me.
 
It seems to me since chances are they will not be getting rid of the specialsts they need to just stop letting the specialists trade for their own accounts.
 
Quote from jimrockford:

No. Kindly cease and desist, as I have previously requested, from offering your opinions about what I have said. I don't mind it from others, but I consider it harassment when it comes from you, because you nearly always misinterpret me, and because correcting you is a waste of my time and disrupts the thread. Kindly focus your discussion on the topic, instead of on me.
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I think this might confuse some people here. I hope that you might clarify this, so that there can be no misunderstanding. I am pretty certain that you are not reserving a right for yourself (posting opinions about posts) that you would wish to deny others on this board. I am also quite certain that you are not selectively determining who to engage with regarding mistakes, misspeaks or misstatements, in the vein of "I'll only kill and eat my weakest prey". Of course, as always, please do correct me If I am wrong.

This is a lively spirited discussion on the NYSE. I hope it continues with everyone's participation.
 
Quote from jimrockford:

No, I never said that it would be a waste of time to learn NYSE trading. I said it would be unwise for a new trader to invest in such a project.
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Please clarify this distinction, as I would venture many here might fail to see it. The last thing I would want is for myself or anyone else here to misunderstand your statements.
 
Quote from ttbodnar:

It seems to me since chances are they will not be getting rid of the specialists they need to just stop letting the specialists trade for their own accounts.
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Surprisingly, I have not seen it discussed at all here on this long thread, but the specialists are highly limited and must adhere to strict rules when trading for their own account. Think of a blackjack dealer as a loose metaphor.
 
Don

The Spear Leads explanation is wrong. I have never heard this borrowed line but by the time the orders reach the floor they have been "borrowed" and are all good to go. Again, we are talking orders entrusted to the specialists.

With orders entrusted to the specislist time-priority rules. On the opening at each specific limit price, once agian time-priority rules.

On the close, the only thing this person could be talking about is that a MOC long sell does have priority over an MOC short sale. This is because the long is going to be part of the final sale regardless of tick or anything else, the short will only become held after the bell, or when it is clear where the last sale before the final sale is. Pretty easy actually.

I know you are a betting man, if you want to rely on a SLK knucklehead go ahead but I am more than willing to place a wager on this.
 
Hamlet

The Specialists do adhere to strict rules as far as ticks. They also must try to adhere to depth market guidlines when a stock is moving. Frankly the the guideline also include orders that the specialist is acting as agent, so in liquid stocks it is pretty easy to adhere.

In less liquid, volatile stocks, one must be careful. Of course, short of a continuing problem, there is no penalty.

One of the problems, and I am not as familiar because I have been gone for about 8-10 years is the fact that some specialists units have trading desks upstairs. Not having access to their sheets, however, I have heard they can use different tick rules if they have a derivative position upstairs on the books.

Probably not a good idea for the long term health/viability of the nyse floor operation.

Of course with AX/GS boyz, i am not sure they want many "dopes" like me running around on the floor.
 
Quote from cstu:

Don

The Spear Leads explanation is wrong. I have never heard this borrowed line but by the time the orders reach the floor they have been "borrowed" and are all good to go. Again, we are talking orders entrusted to the specialists.

With orders entrusted to the specislist time-priority rules. On the opening at each specific limit price, once agian time-priority rules.

On the close, the only thing this person could be talking about is that a MOC long sell does have priority over an MOC short sale. This is because the long is going to be part of the final sale regardless of tick or anything else, the short will only become held after the bell, or when it is clear where the last sale before the final sale is. Pretty easy actually.

I know you are a betting man, if you want to rely on a SLK knucklehead go ahead but I am more than willing to place a wager on this.
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You may be right...the "acceptance" of the order part does make sense on the short order (opening)....I'm not sure about the time priority aspect pre-open...and not completely sure about the "accepted" order pre-open either.....I'm always willing to accept the fact that I may be incorrect (rarely willing to bet on it, LOL).....Since most limit opening only orders are not at the exact price, they "sweep" all the orders with lower limits...it's that last group right at the price....Hmmm? I may have to check with another GS/SLK "knucklehead" on this.....

Good point, thanks!!

Don
 
Don

You live in Las Vegas and no bet? Seriously, part of the problem, and it has become more prominent with market segmentation, but the NYSE has terms that really are part of the rules and mean specific things. Other exchanges and ECn's have adopted the terms but they don't have the same meaning. I am constantly frustrated when I call any broker. I might add that often Dot services at the NYSE does not know all the rules and can only beg the floor.

Anyway, I know your firm is very committed to education of traders and this is just a small part. the more we all know the more profitable we can all be.
 
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