Obama's war on Catholics

Quote from cgroupman:

Right, but many large organizations started out small as well. I really don't like the idea of 'size' makes it ok. We have 'size' in many, not so proud groups. Extreme in KKK etc.



c
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Oh, I never suggested it was okay. Just that larger numbers appear to give religions more "legitimacy." And the larger numbered groups generally look down upon the smaller numbered groups, derisively calling them cults and so on. As an atheist, they're all cults to me.
 
Quote from Wallet:

...The Founding Fathers were extremely religious, and extremely Christian in their beliefs...
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I love these alternate universe posts.
 
Quote from Wallet:

The modern day interpretation ..... see above.

Stu,

I wouldn't expect anything different from you, however your personal beliefs are meaningless in the historical accuracy of your posts.

The Founding Fathers were extremely religious, and extremely Christian in their beliefs, ( I understand there's a huge undertaking to rewrite history away from those facts, but they don't hold up under close inspection ) , all you need to see is in the Deceleration of Independence........

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights , that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,

The Constitution was written to form a government on these principles...... that the "rights" of the people don't come from the Government, they come from their" Creator"...." God given rights". Hence they can not be taken away and the Government is forbid in establishing a law that does that,

The Government exists to protect those rights..... not the other way around, protecting Government from the influence of Religion.

Sorry if that doesn't jive with your personal beliefs, it's just the way it was intended to be.
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And I wouldn't expect anything but an emotional and slightly hysterical response from you in reply.
For someone who didn't want to open up a can of worms over interpretation of constitutional intent, you sure give the contrary impression.

Do you really want to swap statements made by the Founders? Or do you just prefer to blind side and refuse to acknowledge them expressing and confirming their NON religious NON christian beliefs?

Your reference to the Declaration of Independence is one way of rewriting the Constitution, or perhaps what you might call "interpreting" it , but nevertheless I don't see anywhere the mention of religious rights, nor for that matter slavery rights, in that snippet of the Declaration. Neither documents were written to support all those things people call - their rights.

The Government exists to protect the legal rights of all under law. It should not exist to exempt certain people, including the religious, from the ordinary obligations everyone is joined to respect through the Constitution and the law.
 
Quote from stu:

And I wouldn't expect anything but an emotional and slightly hysterical response from you in reply.
For someone who didn't want to open up a can of worms over interpretation of constitutional intent, you sure give the contrary impression.

Do you really want to swap statements made by the Founders? Or do you just prefer to blind side and refuse to acknowledge them expressing and confirming their NON religious NON christian beliefs?

Your reference to the Declaration of Independence is one way of rewriting the Constitution, or perhaps what you might call "interpreting" it , but nevertheless I don't see anywhere the mention of religious rights, nor for that matter slavery rights, in that snippet of the Declaration. Neither documents were written to support all those things people call - their rights.

The Government exists to protect the legal rights of all under law. It should not exist to exempt certain people, including the religious, from the ordinary obligations everyone is joined to respect through the Constitution and the law.
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Haven't we been down this road before? Don't have time..... anyone who wants to find the truth can find it.

let me refresh your memory............

http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=196370&perpage=6&pagenumber=5

Quote from wallet:
04-19-10 08:05 PM
For Stu,

"There is no mention of Christian, Christianity or any Christian religious roots anywhere within the Founding Documents. Who told you there was?
How strange it is that you would try to imply there are."


Let’s See,…….

The Declaration of Independence starts,

When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights

And ends,……..

And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes, and our sacred Honor.

Hummmmm, ……..God, Creator and Divine Providence.

April 10 1606

The First Virginia Charter,

(Excerpt) Wee, greately commending and graciously accepting of theire desires to the furtherance of soe noble a worke which may, by the providence of Almightie God, hereafter tende to the glorie of His Divine Majestie in propagating of Christian religion to suche people as yet live in darkenesse and miserable ignorance of the true knoweledge and worshippe of

1620 Mayflower compact

In the name of God, Amen., …………… Having undertaken for the Glory of God, and Advancement of the Christian Faith, and the Honour of our King and Country, a voyage to plant the first colony in the northern parts of Virginia;

1639 The Fundamental Orders of Connecticut……………..

For as much as it hath pleased Almighty God by the wise disposition of his divine providence so to order and dispose of things that we the Inhabitants and Residents of Windsor, Hartford and Wethersfield are now cohabiting and dwelling in and upon the River of Connectecotte and the lands thereunto adjoining; and well knowing where a people are gathered together the word of God requires that to maintain the peace and union of such a people there should be an orderly and decent Government established according to God

Fundamental Agreement, or Original Constitution of the Colony of New Haven, June 4, 1639….

THE 4th day of the 4th month, called June, 1639, all the free planters assembled together in a general meeting, to consult about settling civil government, according to GOD, and the nomination of persons that might be found, by consent of all, fittest in all respects for the foundation work of a church,……

Query I. WHETHER the scriptures do hold forth a perfect rule for the direction and government of all men in all duties which they are to perform to GOD and men, as well in families and commonwealth, as in matters of the church ? This was assented unto by all, no man dissenting, as was expressed by holding up of hands. Afterwards it was read over to them, that they might see in what words their vote was expressed. They again expressed their consent by holding up their hands, no man dissenting.

1676 The First Thanksgiving Proclamation……………….

"The Holy God having by a long and Continual Series of his Afflictive dispensations……

.Charter of Delaware – 1701

First

BECAUSE no People can be truly happy, though under the greatest Enjoyment of Civil Liberties, if abridged of the Freedom of their Consciences, as to their Religious Profession and Worship: And Almighty God being the only Lord of Conscience, Father of Lights and Spirits; and the Author as well as Object of all divine Knowledge, Faith and Worship, who only doth enlighten the Minds, and persuade and convince the Understandings of People, I do hereby grant and declare, That no Person or Persons, inhabiting In this Province or Territories, who shall confess and acknowledge One almighty God, the Creator, Upholder and Ruler of the World; and professes him or themselves obliged to live quietly under the Civil Government, shall be in any Case molested or prejudiced, in his or their Person or Estate, because of his or their conscientious Persuasion or Practice, nor be compelled to frequent or maintain any religious Worship, Place or Ministry, contrary to his or their Mind, or to do or suffer any other Act or Thing, contrary to their religious Persuasion.

Shall I continue????????????????????????????

Document after document, when The Colonists gathered they credited GOD ( the God of the Bible) for their provision and guidance...........

52 of the 55 Constitution signers were members of established colonial churches.
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"Document after document, when The Colonists gathered they credited "GOD" ( the God of the Bible) for their provision and guidance........... "


That's because saying "artificial mental construct" or "14.7 billion years of evolution of the universe" was just too awkward.
 
My favorite gods are

1. Zeus
2. Thor
3. Posidean (sp?)
These are some bad ass gods.
Jesus was just OK, kinda plain vanilla, his dad, god was a bad ass but a major asshole too.
Budda though not a god, has some good ideas but carries it too far
And last on the list is Alla just because his followers are so murderous. Though according to some is the same god as Jesus's dad.
 
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