Obamacare to be Overturned?

Quote from ChkitOut:

healthcare will never work correctly if the law is you have to treat someone even if they cannot pay.

the healthcare business model is always going to be farked up.

"Uncompensated care" isn't actually that much of overall spending. Something like 2% of all healthcare dollars.

The main drivers of cost increases are advances in technology, the aging of society and overall higher demand for "health" in a wealthy society.

I don't really see the "crisis" that "forced" Obama and the Dems to actually put Obamacare into law. Surveys have consistently shown that ~85% of people with insurance coverage were happy with their coverage and most of the people who were considered "without coverage" were so of their own volition. There is a contingent of people with pre-existing conditions who wanted coverage but could only get it at a high cost and they complained a lot and became the focus of a lot of anecdotal sob stories. Well, you don't make policy by "sob story". These people could have been singled out for some level of subsidy (not my preference, which is to do nothing for them, but that's probably not going to fly in a society as soft-headed as the US of 2012). Then, there are some inefficiencies in the individual coverage market due to the fact that most people get their coverage from their employers and those inefficiencies could be taken care of for the most part by equalizing the tax treatment of both markets, which would have the effect of making individual policies closer in price to group policies.

So, what we ended up with is a stealth welfare program designed to solve the "problems" of a very small proportion of the population, but to do so in a way that redistributes wealth from both the rich and the young to the poor and the middle-aged.

Great, more social engineering by people who wouldn't merit the title "engineer" unless "sanitation" were the adjective modifying it.
 
Quote from logic_man:

Healthcare is essentially local, so how exactly would "deregulating" create more competition? I'm not going to travel 80 miles for a doctor just because under a less-regulated regime that doctor is a slightly more competitive provider. Yes, you can do some things in pharmacies or in other kinds of walk-in offices that would end up being cheaper than the current system, but vaccinations aren't where the big money is spent anyway, so the overall savings won't be that significant.

I actually think the problem is more along the lines of the fact that every Joe Schmoe who walks into a doctor's office expects to be treated with the most up-to-date technology for no cost, somehow believing that's his birthright.

If we tiered the quality of care to people's ability to pay (can only pay for 1970's technology? That's what you get), then a lot of the issues would disappear.

Also, get rid of Medicare, since all it seems to have accomplished is for the government to spend an enormous amount of money to keep grandma alive for a couple more months. Hey, want your grandma to live to see 1 more birthday? Take the funds to do so out of whatever inheritance she's leaving you and I'll do the same, or not, however I decide.

Set up medical savings accounts that are really robust. I can spend my life investing in the various segments of the health care industry and, given their enviable position as a crucial growth industry, I'm sure that those equity investments will leave me with far more funds in my medical savings account than will be in the Medicare "trust fund" when I retire. Yeah, these accounts will have the same issues as IRAs and 401k plans, in that people won't save enough, but once they see enough of their relatives turned away for lack of funds to pay for health care, the idea will get across that it's your own responsibility.

responsibility for your actions and liberalism is an oxymoron.
 
Quote from tenthousandmen:

So no one wants to answer the OP, which is supposed to be an economic question :D

At best, the hiring effect will be marginal. If Obamacare is a tax (which it is), regardless of how it impacts labor costs, that cost will be passed along to consumers.

Surveys of business owners have focused on lack of demand as the primary reason for not hiring. Obamacare being repealed won't really have a major impact on that.

In those same surveys, Obamacare and regulation generally rates lower, but it is considered a drag in the current environment.
 
Quote from logic_man:

"Uncompensated care" isn't actually that much of overall spending. Something like 2% of all healthcare dollars.

The main drivers of cost increases are advances in technology, the aging of society and overall higher demand for "health" in a wealthy society.

I don't really see the "crisis" that "forced" Obama and the Dems to actually put Obamacare into law. Surveys have consistently shown that ~85% of people with insurance coverage were happy with their coverage and most of the people who were considered "without coverage" were so of their own volition. There is a contingent of people with pre-existing conditions who wanted coverage but could only get it at a high cost and they complained a lot and became the focus of a lot of anecdotal sob stories. Well, you don't make policy by "sob story". These people could have been singled out for some level of subsidy (not my preference, which is to do nothing for them, but that's probably not going to fly in a society as soft-headed as the US of 2012). Then, there are some inefficiencies in the individual coverage market due to the fact that most people get their coverage from their employers and those inefficiencies could be taken care of for the most part by equalizing the tax treatment of both markets, which would have the effect of making individual policies closer in price to group policies.

So, what we ended up with is a stealth welfare program designed to solve the "problems" of a very small proportion of the population, but to do so in a way that redistributes wealth from both the rich and the young to the poor and the middle-aged.

Great, more social engineering by people who wouldn't merit the title "engineer" unless "sanitation" were the adjective modifying it.

One can only hope that you acquire a serious and chronic health condition as soon as possible and lose your job and your health care coverage.
 
Quote from piezoe:

One can only hope that you acquire a serious and chronic health condition as soon as possible and lose your job and your health care coverage.

If that happened, then it would suck to be me, but I wouldn't go around crying for the government to force someone else to pay my bills as a result. It's called having character in the face of adversity.
 
Quote from logic_man:

If that happened, then it would suck to be me, but I wouldn't go around crying for the government to force someone else to pay my bills as a result. It's called having character in the face of adversity.

yours is big talk until the shit hits the fan. why don't you post a list of reasons that will justify in your mind not paying your 5 or 6 figure hospital bill if one unfortunately comes due?
 
Quote from piezoe:

One can only hope that you acquire a serious and chronic health condition as soon as possible and lose your job and your health care coverage.

liberalism is your religion. your words and actions are almost like the words of a religious zealot. the religious zealot says i am a man of peace and a man of god. join me in the faith. if you say no u die by the tip of the sword. in western society it is coercion by government via congress/parliament via legislation and/or the executive branch through executive orders.
 
Quote from ElectricSavant:

Well...I hope they do the right thing and vote the entire thing down.

Do not under estimate the Obama Machine...We are still gong to get him another 4 years...The Morman will not win.

ES
"never underestimate the stupidity of the american public."
the american public is no smarter than Argentinians who elected juan peron and his successors. obama is juan peron reincarnate.
http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=204524&highlight=argentina
 
Because the court has had totally lib appointees who don't believe or understand it.



Quote from ElectricSavant:

How could they allow it? They would really need to show disregard for the constitution...wouldn't they?

I think they will at least shoot down part of it...

ES
 
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