‘Not my intention to do anything to benefit any American’

jem said:
then big insurance bought obama pelosi and reid and ripped us
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But you are wrong about that. Pelosi's job was to get something through, even with great compromise. Both Obama and Pelosi favored the "public Option" and would have jumped at a chance for single payer. Had even a few Republicans backed single payer, the public option, or repealing McCarran-Ferguson, we wouldn't be faced with this bad legislation (even though better by far that what we had). But in the end a handful of Democrats and a solid block of Republicans wrecked what could have been. It makes no sense to blame the handful of Democrats beholden to the insurance industry. Any reasonable person has to blame Mitch McConnell, the solid wall he held together, and Max Baucus, totally bought be insurance interests, for ruining what could have been great legislation. You're on the wrong side on this one. There is plenty to blame Democrats for, but this isn't one that you can pin on them.

The deal Obama made with the insurance industry was that if they were going to cover pre-existing conditions, than everyone would be mandated to buy in., including the young and healthy, that insurers could clean up on. This was the deal. Obama realized from the outset he was up against the insurance industry and a solid block of Republicans that favor Capital over Labor. He did what he had to do to get something through, but he clearly would have preferred retaining the Public Option, and I am certain his first choice would have been single payer. But that would have brought down on him not only the insurance industry but the AMA, Big Pharma, and the AHA . What would you have done under those circumstances?

Don't give me "the Democrats could have passed anything." That's bullshit! You know damn well that there were a handfiul of Democrats that were beholden to the insurance or drug industries that would have to be got round, and the only way to do that would be with a few Republican votes. There were none! No Republican votes. So in the end Obama and Pelosi did what they had to do to get something through. They compromised. Baucus, a democrat, was the single biggest benefactor of insurance industry contributions. So Baucus blocked the option. Baucus is the one you should be blaming. Not Obama or Pelosi. Their positions were secure. They did not need insurance industry money.

Your analysis is so fucking off base, it reminds me of fantasy, like the Christmas story!
 
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big mac said:
health insurance is for liberals..

go bare! pay your own way you libertarian anarchist!

we don't need no stinkin regulation!

I PAY MY OWN WAY LOL , like hell you do :D
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Obamacare Repeal already underway.

How does it feel, bitch

U like it
 
seriously... the craziest post you have every made.

Obama had 70 to 100 democrat members of Congress holding out for single payer.
and he pelosi and reid cojoled and strong armed them all into voting for insurance company care.

I have given you the links to the PBS frontline special which showed that Obama selected Bacaus because the insurance company lobbyist told him he had to. Did you ever watch that special I have given you the links to a 100 times. its real poeple involved i the matter telling you what happened.

I have also done this McCarran Fergusson thing with you a handful of times. You never once made a legitimate argument. You have no idea what you are talking about and manifest a clear misunderstanding of federal law vs state law. I will go over again with you anytime yo wish.

There would have been a few Republican votes for single payer. There were businesses that would have loved to get out from under their medical insurance costs.
There were no republicans for this crazy piece of crap pro insurance company legislation.


piezoe said:
But you are wrong about that. Pelosi's job was to get something through, even with great compromise. Both Obama and Pelosi favored the "public Option" and would have jumped at a chance for single payer. Had even a few Republicans backed single payer, the public option, or repealing McCarran-Ferguson, we wouldn't be faced with this bad legislation (even though better by far that what we had). But in the end a handful of Democrats and a solid block of Republicans wrecked what could have been. It makes no sense to blame the handful of Democrats beholden to the insurance industry. Any reasonable person has to blame Mitch McConnell, the solid wall he held together, and Max Baucus, totally bought be insurance interests, for ruining what could have been great legislation. You're on the wrong side on this one. There is plenty to blame Democrats for, but this isn't one that you can pin on them.

The deal Obama made with the insurance industry was that if they were going to cover pre-existing conditions, than everyone would be mandated to buy in., including the young and healthy, that insurers could clean up on. This was the deal. Obama realized from the outset he was up against the insurance industry and a solid block of Republicans that favor Capital over Labor. He did what he had to do to get something through, but he clearly would have preferred retaining the Public Option, and I am certain his first choice would have been single payer. But that would have brought down on him not only the insurance industry but the AMA, Big Pharma, and the AHA . What would you have done under those circumstances?

Don't give me "the Democrats could have passed anything." That's bullshit! You know damn well that there were a handfiul of Democrats that were beholden to the insurance or drug industries that would have to be got round, and the only way to do that would be with a few Republican votes. There were none! No Republican votes. So in the end Obama and Pelosi did what they had to do to get something through. They compromised. Baucus, a democrat, was the single biggest benefactor of insurance industry contributions. So Baucus blocked the option. Baucus is the one you should be blaming. Not Obama or Pelosi. Their positions were secure. They did not need insurance industry money.

Your analysis is so fucking off base, it reminds me of fantasy, like the Christmas story!
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Please watch this video before you ever post that b.s. again.
Here PBS tells you Obama handpicked Baucus to cut deals with the insurance companies. He handpicked Baucus because Obama was beholden to the insurance companies just a bush gave big pharma medicare part d.

Your review of what happened is complete fantasy and manifests a complete misunderstanding of who finances democrats and the power they have over them. Democrat in D.C. are not nice people. Even bernie sells out. you need to grow up and understand this. If democrats and republicans were in this for the good of the country... they would have done some good.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/obamasdeal/view/


To navigate the process of health reform, President Obama turned to his chief of staff, Rahm Emanuel, a consummate deal maker, who helped stock the West Wing with an all-star lineup of congressional insiders. But almost immediately, a key member of the team was forced to step down, and the country's greatest champion of health reform, Sen. Ted Kennedy (D-Mass.), was sidelined with incurable brain cancer. The administration's hopes for reform rested with Sen. Max Baucus (D-Mont.), the powerful head of the Senate Finance Committee, who also happened to be one of the Senate's top recipients of special interest money from the health care industry.

The White House encouraged Baucus to quietly negotiate deals with the insurance lobby, drug companies and other special interest groups, despite promises to run a different kind of White House. "The president said that having people at the table is better than having them throw stuff at the table," White House Communications Director Dan Pfeiffer tells FRONTLINE.
 
wildchild said:
It doesn't matter unless it actually passes. What are they trying to accomplish with the repeal?
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To get rid of Obamacare? Can't keep Doctor. Can't keep plan. Premiums shot up across the board. In some cases >50-100-200%.

Americans were sold a bill of goods. This was an election issue?
 
jem said:
and he pelosi and reid cojoled and strong armed them all into voting for insurance company care.
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Because they didn't have enough Republican votes to get it through. they needed just a handful of Republican votes, but they had zero, ZERO!!! Although they had a large majority of democrats, they did not have them all. Unlike the Republican sheep, the Democrats did not vote as a solid block. They could get something through one house, but then not the other! You need to get through BOTH houses to put legislation in effect!!! What a numbskull you are sometimes, jem. Are you ever going to get that through your thick skull!?!. What finally passed has nothing to do with what one person or another would have preferred had they their druthers. It had to do with the compromises that had to be made to get anything at all through both houses. :banghead: That is the downside of democracy!
 
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