"Not caring" about the money in order to win big

[comagnum]

Some people can handle 5-6+ digit fluctuations on open positions and be at ease getting stopped of the losers & letting profits run for up to to several months. Your not going to get these large gains like 500+ basis points move on futures contract on an intra-day time frame. Having a good trading & risk/trade mgmt plan makes this possible, as does experience, discipline, patience, and some guts. Draw-downs are expected along the way so it's really just a matter of focusing on the process of trading over the outcome.

 

[maxinger]

interesting topic.

Two most important Mind managment/control words for trading are
CALM and ALERT.

What is calm?
- ability to center your mind ALL the time. ie you don't think / feel the extreme like
fear/anxiety/worry or reckless / angry / frustrated
- you don't have OCD Obsessive compulsive Disorder thinking,
- you don't think about past problems, you don't worry about the future
- non judgmental. you don't see things as good or bad.
You see things as neutral.
You don't get elated when you earn tons of money.
You don't feel angry when you lose tons of money.


When you are calm, your mind is free from negative thoughts.
Your body is free from negative emotions.
Your focus is on the present moment.

When you are calm, you feel light, not burden by heavy weights.
You will be able to make wise smart decision,
and you will be able to go to next stage which is ALERT.
You will be able to focus your attention on trading and not distracted by
trading problems and trading losses and family problems etc.

Our subconscious mind could be causing all these negative thoughts and emotion over and over again throughout our life.
We have our consicious mind to neutralise all these negative thoughts and emotions.

Diffferent traders exercise their mind differently.
These are the various techniques :

- definitely physical exercise
- meditation like Qi meditation ....
- yoga
- chakra
- tap meridian points
- massage
- psycho cybernectics
- spiritual retreat
- listen to music
....

 

[JackRab]

@pinetboltz I think you need to understand Phil Ivey bankroll first. He's got a lot more than a low 7 figures. His net-worth is what? 50mln... 100mln?

So if he stakes 1mln in a pokergame where he is pretty darn good at it... he stands to lose 1mln when he's not in the money. Gains are a multitude of that... so if you would make an expected value on his game... he's already in the plus before he starts, since he's that good.

But again, 1mln on 50mln isn't that big of a deal. 2% max loss on a big game....
If you have a 10k account and lose 200 bucks... you would be okay right? If you would lose 200 buck 20 times in a row... that's a 40% loss... that would make you worry. If Phil Ivey loses 40% of net-worth in consecutive poker games, I'm sure he will worry a bit more as well... but still he has plenty left. He wouldn't be poor by any standards.... that's the key.

It's the "f#$ck you money"... he will keep 5 mln at least completely out of his poker bankroll... that's his pension fund... don't touch that, still rich... bit less... but enough.

 

[Cuddles]

I struggle with this. I do live frugally, but not from being stingy, I just don't get much joy out of spendy shit. It does take extra effort to protect positions, but also makes me not double guess throwing money at an opportunity.

I suppose the best ones may be like me, but also enjoy "the game". I play mostly from wanting out of the daily grind of corporate America, and freedom from necessity.

 

[longinus876]

I think you're confusing Wade Cook with Mark Cook. Mark Cook is the cumulative tick indicator guy.

https://www.markdcook.com/

No, I meant Wade Cook. He took any of the various opportunities out there to go broke, but taking a profit is never a bad thing. Getting out of a trade is sometimes harder to than getting in. Sitting around like a schmuck looking for the trend to continue is bs. If you see the price fluctuation following a pattern, it's because people are taking profits and establishing new trades. Wade warned against looking for a bonanza and sticking with a predictable pattern. That's solid advice and the way to trade. You'll have plenty opportunities to go broke. Don't invent new ones.

 

[longinus876]

Ah, yes, I remember Wade Cook. What a scum bag. I paste below, for your edification, his Wikipedia intro.

Wade Bruce Cook (born October 9, 1949) is an American author and self-proclaimed financial guru. Cook claims to have started his success when he was a taxi driver in the 1970s. His first book, Real Estate Money Machine, was originally self-published in 1981. He filed for personal bankruptcy in 1987. An updated version of his book was published in 1996. His company was liquidated in 2003 after it had been forced into Chapter 11 bankruptcy by creditors, and he served 88 months in prison for tax evasion. He still offers trading advice through his website and publications.

P.S.: His advice to take in pocket change, as you put it, was precisely what caused him to bankrupt his own trading account. He tried to push the value of short puts on his audience during a bull market run, as today, until it caught up with him.

If there is anyone whose advice you do NOT want to take, it is Wade Cook.

No, you're wrong. His advice was simple. Maybe you didn't understand it. Don't look for skyrockets when an oscillating trend that has established itself over time is more predictable. I don't know what other bs he got into, but that advice is correct if it fits your style.

 

[tomorton]

Not caring about money sounds odd at first. All money is money and all money is useful surely? So, again surely, we should care about our money?

But coming at this from the opposite direction, its possible to see negative implications from caring too much about money. One is the perceived need to make money fast, leading to over-trading, unplanned trading, over-leverage, risky trades.

Another danger, more subtle, is letting the unrealised gain in an open trade dictate your trade management plan. This is where so many writers, teachers and experts are at fault: I don't just mean mistaken, they are personally culpable. They are so desperate that their readers / viewers / trainees should see at least some profit coming back to them that they all too often advise using a profit target, getting out before the close, cutting winning position sizes, setting stops ahead of the trade because of support/resistance levels. This is the opposite of running your winners. Its letting the tail wag the dog. We should tell them the idea of trading is not to not lose profit, it is to make profit while not losing capital. Capital and profit are different. And by profit I mean maximum profit per trade. Maximum means maximum, not just enough to buy lunch.

 

[d08]

No, I meant Wade Cook. He took any of the various opportunities out there to go broke, but taking a profit is never a bad thing. Getting out of a trade is sometimes harder to than getting in. Sitting around like a schmuck looking for the trend to continue is bs. If you see the price fluctuation following a pattern, it's because people are taking profits and establishing new trades. Wade warned against looking for a bonanza and sticking with a predictable pattern. That's solid advice and the way to trade. You'll have plenty opportunities to go broke. Don't invent new ones.

Taking profits is often a bad thing. If you take small profits and big losses like he did, you end up the same as him. Basic math, really.
Anyway, he obviously had no predictable pattern - if he did, he wouldn't be bankrupt.
Why listen to him? It's like taking advice from a racing car driver who hasn't finished even one race. Anyone can go fast into a curve, the key is how you come out of it.

 

[maxinger]

Title should be changed from :

"Not caring" about the money in order to win big

to :

Not focusing on the money BUT
the trade plan in order to win big $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

 

[lindq]

No, you're wrong. His advice was simple. Maybe you didn't understand it. Don't look for skyrockets when an oscillating trend that has established itself over time is more predictable. I don't know what other bs he got into, but that advice is correct if it fits your style.

I hold a special place of pure disgust in my heart for your friend Wade Cook, and I am very familiar with his books and seminars, as following his advice 17 years ago nearly wiped out my account until I became wise to his ways, and those of his ilk. He is a fraud, a scammer, a thief, and has been documented as one of history's worst traders.

The fact that you have come here 3 times to promote his "wisdom", now earns you a very special and coveted spot on E.T: My ignore list.