Nice job, Nod!!! 
NoDoji's Day Trading Log
- Thread starter NoDoji
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Why would you use different time frames to pick an entry?
What advantage could be gained?
Tried and true experience would dictate the entry AND exit should come from the same time frame. Correct?
Some would say taking an early entry from a 3 or less minute chart and assuming exiting on a 5 or 15 minute chart is a mistake. How do you feel about that?
Lets say a trader is looking for something to get them in a trade early. If that trader took a signal from a 1 minute chart and looking to take profits in the 5, would that trader plan the STOP LOSS point in the 1 or in the 5?
No trading this morning, Dr appt day. ( need to impress on them to make all appt's later in day.) I slipped up on letting this one being made so early. My bad.
Yesterday was fun so can handle missing this morning.
What advantage could be gained?
Tried and true experience would dictate the entry AND exit should come from the same time frame. Correct?
Some would say taking an early entry from a 3 or less minute chart and assuming exiting on a 5 or 15 minute chart is a mistake. How do you feel about that?
Lets say a trader is looking for something to get them in a trade early. If that trader took a signal from a 1 minute chart and looking to take profits in the 5, would that trader plan the STOP LOSS point in the 1 or in the 5?
No trading this morning, Dr appt day. ( need to impress on them to make all appt's later in day.) I slipped up on letting this one being made so early. My bad.
Yesterday was fun so can handle missing this morning.
I will use X as an example since I originally planned to trade it yesterday, using larger time frames for my setup and then planning to use very short time frames for early, thereby attempting to catch the beginning of a trend from the opening move which is usually the strongest.
I chose X initially based on the DAILY chart. After pulling back from an approximate double top on Wed and overbought on the daily chart, price movement favored further downside because when an attempt to make a higher high in an uptrend fails, price usually moves down to an oversold condition on the daily chart. I was looking to catch the rest of the ride to oversold and as a day trader needed to time my entry very accurately to avoid getting stopped out.
I then confirm the daily setup by checking the 30-MIN 5-DAY chart and seeing that X went from oversold Wed (gap down and further decline) to overbought by Wednesday's end in an attempt to move back up and test the opening high, which failed, setting up the further ride down yesterday.
My plan yesterday on the open was to use a 1-min and 3-min chart to gauge an early entry through the opening noise.
My plans were dashed however because some analyst upgraded X and the price began to rise in pre-market. Since X had pulled back from highs quite a bit already, the upgrade countered the normal price action I expected from my analysis of the daily and 30-min charts, because MOST of the time a stock will bounce very nicely on an analyst upgrade.
That's when I changed my main focus to ESRX.
Turns out the X trade to the short side would've been a home run because it only rose .50 cents from the previous day's close before dropping $6 by day's end.
Sadly I'd taken X off my watch
-$212 Day
+$669 Week
+$2032 Month
Iâll document my mistakes in depth today because it was nothing more than the mental game that took me down today when in fact the trades I put on wouldâve brought in $2000+ if Iâd done NOTHING MORE THAN simply leave my initial stops in place and sit on my hands until the entire move played out and reached my initial target zone.
First mistake was not planning a â2-itemâ day. Instead I had 7 charts I was watching on the open. As a result my eyes darted from potential opportunity to potential opportunity and I actually traded a bit and ended up stopped out each trade at small profit. How? Because once the trades moved in my favor I moved the stops, believing I was keeping enough distance. WRONG!
Hereâs the early part of the day: I had 3 solid trades early on that moved in my favor as expected and that I micromanaged into nothing:
First was AMZN short @ 126.72, stop above the entry bar high. Once the trade was .20 cents in my favor I moved the stop to b/e, was taken out at EXACTLY b/e, then it started falling like crazy and I was afraid to chase another entry at that point and moved on. This was such an amateur way to trade this volatile stock; I needed to TRUST the setup and give it room to whip around. Had I left my initial stop in place until the trade was, say, even .50 cents in my favor, then moved it to b/e and sat on my hands, I couldâve reaped a 2.00/share gain on the first capitulation pivot. So $400 in profits left behind on this trade. (And significantly more had I left the trade on all day.)
I shorted CREE @ 62.78, stop @ 63.01 above the HOD. Trade moved my way and I again moved the stop too quickly, taken out for pretty much b/e, only to watch this one drop 1.45 from my entry price and I never re-entered because I then moved on to something else. Left at least $270 behind here.
Shorted X @ 55.62, stop @ 56.01 above the high of my entry bar (which was a lower high on the day). Then for some reason I moved the stop down .20 cents. Why .20 cents??? I couldâve moved to b/e or something, but no .20 cents... was hit on a silly X-type spike) for a $40 loss, then watched price fall again, chased a new entry with larger size @ 55.60, trailed the stop too close, taken out for a $60 gain, then watched price drop nearly 1.30 from my entry price. I never re-entered, because I moved onto something else. Left at least $500 behind on this 2nd X trade.
Shorted GMCR @ 78.95 as it fell hard from a much lower high, only getting 100 shares lifted out of 400. This time I left the stop in place, then moved it near b/e after price had moved .70 cents in my favor. Guess what??? This was the ONE that came all the way back from an .82 cent move to take me out near b/e. Then instead of contemplating a long position on the bounce, I decided to get some revenge on X and basically just churned in and out of trades, chalking up commissions, and again not letting winners run.
I played with ESRX a bit both long and short and pretty much came out b/e. Then later I had an ESRX trade where I moved my stop, and was inexplicably taken out on a phantom fill. By that I mean the Ask only reached a certain price on the DOM, yet my stop that was quite a bit away was activated in a flash, giving me a $78 loss. I looked at the bar and there was a wick to exactly the price I was filled at, and then price fell right back and continued down! Has anyone ever had this happen?? Again had I simply left my initial stop in place above the HOD, I wouldâve enjoyed about a .65 cent move and netted around $300 or so.
I tried several other trades through the afternoon chop, both long and short and churned mainly. I was in âget back what I left on the tableâ mode, not a very good state of mind in which to trade.
I had a CAL trade to the short side, lower high, overbought. It moved in my favor, but then found very strong support and the L2 got "that look" and I was stopped out for a small gain. Instead of staying focused on CAL, moved on yet again.
I put on an ES long position @ 1102.50, placed my stop too close (shouldâve placed it below the LOD at the time), stopped out for a $42 loss, but couldâve gotten a pt or so out of it. It was bottom picking later in the day and there wasnât much upward impetus, but then you never know, sometimes when weâve had a long down day, the buyers step in hard and that was hope on this one.
Tried POT to the long side. It was a 50/50 sort of setup, but it was off a pivot with buyers coming in and POT can be solid in its trajectories most of the time. Turned out to be a false reversal and took out my stop below the entry barâs low for -$47.
Later on I shorted X again on a solid setup with size, chasing entry like a madwoman to get all 600 shares in it was lifting 100 at a time on the way down. So I had a stop above the entry bar that wouldâve been a tidy loss if it reversed. Because of this I became nervous, trailed my stop too close AGAIN, taking a $66 gain and leavingâ¦well over $700 behind.
After all this, I decided enough was enough, reviewed all my mistakes and called it a day.
My commissions alone were $91, 17,000 shares traded.
Ironically, I thought that focusing on 1 or 2 things and catching nice moves was starting to sink into my psyche. If I had simply ONLY traded one stock today (X for example) AND patiently let the trades work instead of micromanaging, I wouldâve had a very fine dayâs pay on that one alone.
Letâs see if I can NEVER again jump around and overtrade. Itâs NEVER worked for me so why do I get in this mode? I still havenât meditated and practiced visualization. I plan to do that this weekend since all my soccer games are canceled due to rain. Iâm going to especially visualize myself patiently trusting the setup and being willing to accept the initial stop loss until the trade has had time to play out.
I remember having many conversations with Geez about stop management and targets and he told me what he'd found works best through his many years of experience and I just canât get it into my head!
Have a great weekend all!
+$669 Week
+$2032 Month
Iâll document my mistakes in depth today because it was nothing more than the mental game that took me down today when in fact the trades I put on wouldâve brought in $2000+ if Iâd done NOTHING MORE THAN simply leave my initial stops in place and sit on my hands until the entire move played out and reached my initial target zone.
First mistake was not planning a â2-itemâ day. Instead I had 7 charts I was watching on the open. As a result my eyes darted from potential opportunity to potential opportunity and I actually traded a bit and ended up stopped out each trade at small profit. How? Because once the trades moved in my favor I moved the stops, believing I was keeping enough distance. WRONG!
Hereâs the early part of the day: I had 3 solid trades early on that moved in my favor as expected and that I micromanaged into nothing:
First was AMZN short @ 126.72, stop above the entry bar high. Once the trade was .20 cents in my favor I moved the stop to b/e, was taken out at EXACTLY b/e, then it started falling like crazy and I was afraid to chase another entry at that point and moved on. This was such an amateur way to trade this volatile stock; I needed to TRUST the setup and give it room to whip around. Had I left my initial stop in place until the trade was, say, even .50 cents in my favor, then moved it to b/e and sat on my hands, I couldâve reaped a 2.00/share gain on the first capitulation pivot. So $400 in profits left behind on this trade. (And significantly more had I left the trade on all day.)
I shorted CREE @ 62.78, stop @ 63.01 above the HOD. Trade moved my way and I again moved the stop too quickly, taken out for pretty much b/e, only to watch this one drop 1.45 from my entry price and I never re-entered because I then moved on to something else. Left at least $270 behind here.
Shorted X @ 55.62, stop @ 56.01 above the high of my entry bar (which was a lower high on the day). Then for some reason I moved the stop down .20 cents. Why .20 cents??? I couldâve moved to b/e or something, but no .20 cents... was hit on a silly X-type spike) for a $40 loss, then watched price fall again, chased a new entry with larger size @ 55.60, trailed the stop too close, taken out for a $60 gain, then watched price drop nearly 1.30 from my entry price. I never re-entered, because I moved onto something else. Left at least $500 behind on this 2nd X trade.
Shorted GMCR @ 78.95 as it fell hard from a much lower high, only getting 100 shares lifted out of 400. This time I left the stop in place, then moved it near b/e after price had moved .70 cents in my favor. Guess what??? This was the ONE that came all the way back from an .82 cent move to take me out near b/e. Then instead of contemplating a long position on the bounce, I decided to get some revenge on X and basically just churned in and out of trades, chalking up commissions, and again not letting winners run.
I played with ESRX a bit both long and short and pretty much came out b/e. Then later I had an ESRX trade where I moved my stop, and was inexplicably taken out on a phantom fill. By that I mean the Ask only reached a certain price on the DOM, yet my stop that was quite a bit away was activated in a flash, giving me a $78 loss. I looked at the bar and there was a wick to exactly the price I was filled at, and then price fell right back and continued down! Has anyone ever had this happen?? Again had I simply left my initial stop in place above the HOD, I wouldâve enjoyed about a .65 cent move and netted around $300 or so.
I tried several other trades through the afternoon chop, both long and short and churned mainly. I was in âget back what I left on the tableâ mode, not a very good state of mind in which to trade.
I had a CAL trade to the short side, lower high, overbought. It moved in my favor, but then found very strong support and the L2 got "that look" and I was stopped out for a small gain. Instead of staying focused on CAL, moved on yet again.
I put on an ES long position @ 1102.50, placed my stop too close (shouldâve placed it below the LOD at the time), stopped out for a $42 loss, but couldâve gotten a pt or so out of it. It was bottom picking later in the day and there wasnât much upward impetus, but then you never know, sometimes when weâve had a long down day, the buyers step in hard and that was hope on this one.
Tried POT to the long side. It was a 50/50 sort of setup, but it was off a pivot with buyers coming in and POT can be solid in its trajectories most of the time. Turned out to be a false reversal and took out my stop below the entry barâs low for -$47.
Later on I shorted X again on a solid setup with size, chasing entry like a madwoman to get all 600 shares in it was lifting 100 at a time on the way down. So I had a stop above the entry bar that wouldâve been a tidy loss if it reversed. Because of this I became nervous, trailed my stop too close AGAIN, taking a $66 gain and leavingâ¦well over $700 behind.
After all this, I decided enough was enough, reviewed all my mistakes and called it a day.
My commissions alone were $91, 17,000 shares traded.
Ironically, I thought that focusing on 1 or 2 things and catching nice moves was starting to sink into my psyche. If I had simply ONLY traded one stock today (X for example) AND patiently let the trades work instead of micromanaging, I wouldâve had a very fine dayâs pay on that one alone.
Letâs see if I can NEVER again jump around and overtrade. Itâs NEVER worked for me so why do I get in this mode? I still havenât meditated and practiced visualization. I plan to do that this weekend since all my soccer games are canceled due to rain. Iâm going to especially visualize myself patiently trusting the setup and being willing to accept the initial stop loss until the trade has had time to play out.
I remember having many conversations with Geez about stop management and targets and he told me what he'd found works best through his many years of experience and I just canât get it into my head!
Have a great weekend all!
NoDoji,
I feel your pain. Today should have been a very good day considering the increased vix. On the contrary, I committed the same mistakes similar to yours, and turned a profitable day to a loss. I went to short ES at the wrong time around 1103.5 when suddenly the market found a strong upside momentum and I sat on it for too long and eventually sold at the high of the session. Went to short at 1110 and covered too quickly. So I left more than 20 points on the table. Milked SBUX for a tiny profit and watched the market tanking and did nothing. Gee, newbie's mistake. I am paying for tuition now, I guess. Having read so many posts saying that new traders become busted very soon makes me too risk averse.
I have been reading your posts recently and learned a lot. Keep up the good work.
Happy trading.
I feel your pain. Today should have been a very good day considering the increased vix. On the contrary, I committed the same mistakes similar to yours, and turned a profitable day to a loss. I went to short ES at the wrong time around 1103.5 when suddenly the market found a strong upside momentum and I sat on it for too long and eventually sold at the high of the session. Went to short at 1110 and covered too quickly. So I left more than 20 points on the table. Milked SBUX for a tiny profit and watched the market tanking and did nothing. Gee, newbie's mistake. I am paying for tuition now, I guess. Having read so many posts saying that new traders become busted very soon makes me too risk averse.
I have been reading your posts recently and learned a lot. Keep up the good work.
Happy trading.
Ok, reading your post and frantically using the mute button watching FAST MONEY whenever Joe Jaganova talks. I can not stand that guy, talks with his hands flailing and wears fruity shirts, looks like uses motor oil in his hair. I like Tim Seymore and waiting for Timmy to some day go over and smack "I am in love with myself, Joe". Ok, got that off my chest. 
I am going to give my thought on a couple mistakes you need to work on. I hope it helps. But i am also the guy that understands we all do not have the same brain and we all are different. I read once where a famous neuro brain surgeon, scientist etc said: "I believe every single person learns and uses memory seperate from any other person that ever walked the face of the earth"
With that in mind i and anyone else can only point things out to you as "WE" see them. I do not have the specific answers, just specific ideas that you might consider to improve on or drop completly.
You are a daytrader. Here is my idea of a daytrader. Get up in morning and prepare for another days mission. No special preparations needed, just bring your past experiences and try to improve on what you learned before. The past mistakes are learning tools, not habits.
Forget trailing STOPS, you do not have time for that nonsense. Forget scaling in and out, thats also nonsense at this stage anyway. You need to get the basics down pat before you finesse trades. Trailing STOPS are distractions, worry about profits before trying to prevent small losers or saving a few cents. Do not be penny wise and dollar foolish.
As a daytrader you should be using just MENTAL stops, use the mouse for two items, enter a trade and exit a trade. All in, all out. Place the max stop in your head and concentrate on the price action and not the STOP placement. When you use MENTAL maximum stop loss you reserve the right to just smack the mouse and get out sooner if desired. Using a trail stop in my opinion is not showing confidence in ability to control profits. Heck, if i have profits and see them drifting away............smack the mouse and be done with the trade. That gives you a fresh mind to concentrate on getting back in. Speaking of which...................
I think you lose focus of the instrument you are trading if you get out on a small loss. You should be thinking of getting back in on a retrace. You seem to give up on a trade if it leaves you on the dock. Agree, chasing can be a bummer, but even the best trends retrace and allow more players in. Thats how they feed the bull or bear. You will not always catch the beginning of every move, you will get better at it but thats notyour problem now. You need to concentrate on the TREND and get in on it.
You are not yet advanced enough to be playing this or that one day and this or that the next day. get in a chair and find your knitting and stick to it. Your plan needs to be working on just 1 item. OK, 2 at the most, but be advised even 2 will slow progress down.
Trade on signals only, forget assumptions, hope, etc.
Do not be discouraged. You need to tighten up the plan. You are still confused about trend following and fading. They are two different animals. Trade like a Lion hunts, a lion sits there and waits for a certain type of animal to be his catch. The lion starts the chase and does not get distracted if another juicier animal is spotted running in the other direction. Be consistent in your plan. Decide what type of trader you want to be. A fighter Ace flys his fighter with proven tactics or else he bugs out and decides to fight another day.
Trade like a Lioness and a Ace pilot.
I am going to give my thought on a couple mistakes you need to work on. I hope it helps. But i am also the guy that understands we all do not have the same brain and we all are different. I read once where a famous neuro brain surgeon, scientist etc said: "I believe every single person learns and uses memory seperate from any other person that ever walked the face of the earth"
With that in mind i and anyone else can only point things out to you as "WE" see them. I do not have the specific answers, just specific ideas that you might consider to improve on or drop completly.
You are a daytrader. Here is my idea of a daytrader. Get up in morning and prepare for another days mission. No special preparations needed, just bring your past experiences and try to improve on what you learned before. The past mistakes are learning tools, not habits.
Forget trailing STOPS, you do not have time for that nonsense. Forget scaling in and out, thats also nonsense at this stage anyway. You need to get the basics down pat before you finesse trades. Trailing STOPS are distractions, worry about profits before trying to prevent small losers or saving a few cents. Do not be penny wise and dollar foolish.
As a daytrader you should be using just MENTAL stops, use the mouse for two items, enter a trade and exit a trade. All in, all out. Place the max stop in your head and concentrate on the price action and not the STOP placement. When you use MENTAL maximum stop loss you reserve the right to just smack the mouse and get out sooner if desired. Using a trail stop in my opinion is not showing confidence in ability to control profits. Heck, if i have profits and see them drifting away............smack the mouse and be done with the trade. That gives you a fresh mind to concentrate on getting back in. Speaking of which...................
I think you lose focus of the instrument you are trading if you get out on a small loss. You should be thinking of getting back in on a retrace. You seem to give up on a trade if it leaves you on the dock. Agree, chasing can be a bummer, but even the best trends retrace and allow more players in. Thats how they feed the bull or bear. You will not always catch the beginning of every move, you will get better at it but thats notyour problem now. You need to concentrate on the TREND and get in on it.
You are not yet advanced enough to be playing this or that one day and this or that the next day. get in a chair and find your knitting and stick to it. Your plan needs to be working on just 1 item. OK, 2 at the most, but be advised even 2 will slow progress down.
Trade on signals only, forget assumptions, hope, etc.
Do not be discouraged. You need to tighten up the plan. You are still confused about trend following and fading. They are two different animals. Trade like a Lion hunts, a lion sits there and waits for a certain type of animal to be his catch. The lion starts the chase and does not get distracted if another juicier animal is spotted running in the other direction. Be consistent in your plan. Decide what type of trader you want to be. A fighter Ace flys his fighter with proven tactics or else he bugs out and decides to fight another day.
Trade like a Lioness and a Ace pilot.
As always thank you for your encouragement. I definitely forgot to take my ritalin today
My goal Monday is to focus on one thing from the open. I haven't yet chosen what; I will review my faves in various time frames and decide over the weekend. ES certainly looks ripe for a bounce, but right now I think I'm going to stick with stocks for a while to practice my trust and discipline in the trade because I have more precision with stocks.
I don't like to use mental stops because of occasional crazy moves (and possible power failures). There is nothing wrong with where I place my initial stops. I place them at a price where the setup doesn't follow through and the trade is invalidated.
My problem is not leaving the original stop in place until the trade has moved significantly in my favor. And I need to gauge "significantly" based on the personality of the stock. As an example a whippy $120 stock like AMZN needs time to follow through on the setup. It can jump around .20 or .30 cents in a second or two and it was silly of me to move the stop so quickly. A $20 stock like CAL trades calmly with a tight spread, and I can be less forgiving with it.
I'm just too quick to avoid a possible loss as soon as a bit of green shows, and then as you said, if stopped out I don't stick with it.
So again, this should be resolved by me trading one thing, at least for the opening 90 mins or so, trusting my setup, and trying to capture as much of a move as possible. I've proven I can do it. Now I have to do it more consistently.
NoDoji, ya should print this quote and hang it on the wall. It's truly a classic!
On that note, I should emphasize that you really should learn to specialize and become knowledgeable about the product you trade, be it stocks, forex or futures. I don't mean to demean my colleagues who dilly-dally in stocks but, from what I've been told, the futures players tend to be a bit more sophisticated than the stock players. Here I'm talking about the locals who trade in the pit. Most of them trade the same instrument day after day, year after year. This way, they know the damn thing like the back of their hand. Ya don't find them trading the Spooz (SPX) one day and then move on to Wheat the next!
As bighog said, go after one prey and stick to it until it's completely devoured. The first catch is usually the hardest. However, once you get the hang of it, let alone acquire the taste for blood, it becomes easier over time.
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