No Vaccination, No Welfare Payments

[UsualName]

You do realize that many states in the U.S. have laws that cut off welfare benefits for children if they are not vaccinated. Not following the the medically recommended vaccine schedule is viewed as a form of child neglect that can lead to freezing of any public benefit money — and in more extreme cases the removal of the children from the household. Is this also fascism? Expecting parents/guardians to follow the best medical practices to protect the children?

I find it odd that any rational person would equate not paying tax-payer funds to someone who refuses to follow the best public health practices to protect society with fascism. Anyway — enjoy your time as the latest addition to the GOP party.

Im not arguing the federal and state governments cannot mandate vaccinations, they certainly can. This does not make connecting a vaccine to a punishment not fascist. If you want to remove the connection to welfare benefits and argue a legal mandate under “general welfare” or “health and safety”, go for it.

I’d be against that too but my issue with your original position is it is connected to a public benefit.

 

[gwb-trading]

Im not arguing the federal and state governments cannot mandate vaccinations, they certainly can. This does not make connecting a vaccine to a punishment not fascist. If you want to remove the connection to welfare benefits and argue a legal mandate under “general welfare” or “health and safety”, go for it.

I’d be against that too but my issue with your original position is it is connected to a public benefit.

In summary, you believe connecting welfare benefits with a vaccine mandate is fascist — something that is already done in the U.S. Hence you believe we already live in a fascist country. Good to know.

 

[CaptainObvious]

You’ve taken kind of a dark turn lately but this is spot on. You and I have discussed fascism before and the proposal of the original poster is exactly fascist. This is what a fascist would do.

My position has always been that facism is not exclusive to one political party, it can be practiced by anyone. Typically it's the extremists that employ the tactics as it suits their agenda. Everyone likes a little of it until it circles back around to them, and it always does. The list of enemies always gets larger, the trusted inner circle always smaller. It always starts with a boogeyman filled with half truths. It's been Jews, it's been Blacks, it's been gays, it's been many things. The new boogeymen are white males and anyone who questions the Covid narrative. Nothing new under the sun as the saying goes and this round of fascism ends like it always does, messy and bloody.

 

[Ricter]

The list of enemies always gets larger, the trusted inner circle always smaller.

Wow, that's 45 to a tee.

 

[UsualName]

In summary, you believe connecting welfare benefits with a vaccine mandate is fascist — something that is already done in the U.S. Hence you believe we already live in a fascist country. Good to know.

No. So the government at the state and federal level have extensive powers. That doesn’t mean they should impose those powers in a fascist way.

But I don’t think you’ll ever understand why a punitive approach is fascist while an incentive approach is not so I won’t bother wasting our time with that.

We do run into a legally dubious situation with the proposal you make to tie welfare benefits to Covid vaccinations. It’s established legally the government can use federal funds to coerce behavior. For example, the court’s famously held the federal government can withhold highway funding from states that fail to impose highway safety measures like seatbelts. The legal basis is that there is a logical connection between highway safety and highway funds. Same would be true for welfare funds to drug testing because there’s a logical connection. In America welfare is temporary assistance and an accepted way of getting off welfare is to become employed or better employed, whatever. Drug use can make someone unemployable and therefore a condition of welfare would be not make yourself unemployable by habit and thus a logic connection to the benefit. School and vaccines the same way - group setting, children spread disease -> logical connection. What you’re arguing is no logical connection, just punitive compliance.

Now here’s the kicker, neither the states nor the feds need any other reason to make vaccines mandatory to everyone. Mandatory vaccinations fall under health and safety, and general welfare, respectively.

 

[Cuddles]

Australia can do whatever it wants. It’s their business if they want to be fascist. Obviously, I don’t want that in America.

Submitting to a drug test is different than having a vaccine injected into you. Drug use obviously can make you unemployable and that is the logical connection to the benefit. Although I do disagree with drug testing for a public benefit. But that is neither here nor there is this case.

 

[destriero]

And the "strategy" = COVID-19

It's not about stripping poor of welfare if they don't get the vaccine, it's about... "saving lives"

Looks like you're forced to get the vaccine or no more Wonder bread and menthols for you!

 

[PintoFire]

Looks like you're forced to get the vaccine or no more Wonder bread and menthols for you!

Hahaha religious and medical exemptions read the fine print LOL