NO BS Day Trading (order flow course) - Worthwhile or worthless?

[Howard]

Futures are a zero-sum market. Nothing is created out of nowhere. What you win must come from somewhere. And in the financial markets in general, there is a shift, a transfer in wealth going on all the time. I did not call it stealing. But it is a huge, global game. And in such a game, there are not many winners. There are very few who win big consistenly over a long period of time. That money, the gains of the few, they come, among others, from the many who are losing. Thats a general principle in life, it is a law of nature (Gaussian/ normal distribution): the top of the mountain can never be a crowded place.

Not everyone participating in the futures market are looking to make a profit per se. Remember that the primary function of the futures market is to hedge and control risk from your other positions. Speculation is secondary.

As long as there is liquidity, you're not really competing against anyone.

 

[padutrader]

Yes. do try and you will learn whether it suits you or not.
I tried lots of things , lost tons of money
and finally I narrow down to day trading futures.

All the best mister.

i too have done exactly the same only i trade spot eurusd

 

[SkyChef]

Hi,

Good comments.

Maybe I'm slow, but it's not quite clear to me whether you actually endorse 'order flow analysis' or you're actually saying it's not a worthwhile pursuit.

Thanks.

If you are looking for the whole deal of order flow analysis, there are tools available from Sierra Chart (I'm using it & I heard that Jigsaw also has substantial chunks) and you have to assemble them to make it works. Information about market depth is available here & there on the web. You just have to dig. Other than that, all of the peddling software don't show a thing but the shiny surfaces. Does it work for you? Maybe & it's all depending on what you are truly looking for. Good luck.

 

[CALLumbus]

Not everyone participating in the futures market are looking to make a profit per se. Remember that the primary function of the futures market is to hedge and control risk from your other positions. Speculation is secondary.

As long as there is liquidity, you're not really competing against anyone.

The intention, ideas, feelings and emotions do not matter. For a given futures position, if the long holder is in profit, his gains come from the shorts of the counterparty. 1-1 = 0. Plain and simple.

 

[Howard]

The intention, ideas, feelings and emotions do not matter. For a given futures position, if the long holder is in profit, his gains come from the shorts of the counterparty. 1-1 = 0. Plain and simple.

Sure. The futures markets are zero sum. I don't think anyone would argue that fact.

But, you're assuming that every operator is looking to make a profit in the futures market which simply isn't the case. At any given point in time there's people trading on different time frames and with very different agendas. My point is that you're not really competing against anyone in a liquid market such as the ES. You can buy and sell pretty much wherever you want.

You do of course need a methodology and market knowledge, but you're not dependent on other people 'losing' money to you. The only thing you're dependent on is liquidity.

 

[Howard]

...(I'm using it & I heard that Jigsaw also has substantial chunks) and you have to assemble them to make it works.

Good luck.

Thank you, SkyChef.

Can you elaborate a bit on that comment?

 

[Howard]

So, I actually bought the basic course. I think I paid 85$ which isn't a big investment to me. The biggest investment is the time spent learning this material.

Having spent a long time on other parts of my methodology, I now have more time for this and I think it will be a nice addition to my arsenal. Hopefully, I can fine tune my entries and exits which arises out of my existing methodology. I am not interested in becoming a scalper. I trade the longer intraday swings...

 

[CALLumbus]

Sure. The futures markets are zero sum. I don't think anyone would argue that fact.

But, you're assuming that every operator is looking to make a profit in the futures market which simply isn't the case. At any given point in time there's people trading on different time frames and with very different agendas. My point is that you're not really competing against anyone in a liquid market such as the ES. You can buy and sell pretty much wherever you want.

You do of course need a methodology and market knowledge, but you're not dependent on other people 'losing' money to you. The only thing you're dependent on is liquidity.

The money that goes into your pocket comes from the pocket of somebody else. That is all I say.

 

[SkyChef]

So, I actually bought the basic course. I think I paid 85$ which isn't a big investment to me. The biggest investment is the time spent learning this material.

Having spent a long time on other parts of my methodology, I now have more time for this and I think it will be a nice addition to my arsenal. Hopefully, I can fine tune my entries and exits which arises out of my existing methodology. I am not interested in becoming a scalper. I trade the longer intraday swings...

How long is long?

 

[Howard]

How long is long?

Roughly 6 years on this specific methodology, but have been following and studying the markets on/off for well over 10 years now.