Niederhoffer & REFCO
- Thread starter CPTrader
- Start date
As indicated in previous posts, I have knowledge of that horse's ass Niederhoffer from being a past customer of his fund. I am particularly interested in the results of funds and have access to daily returns reported on Bloomberg for a purchasable index of 7 of the biggest hedge funds as well as a subscriber to the ratings services that receive results on returns from all the independent accountants. I note some reasonable serial correlations in the daily results of the hedge funds cited above which I would be pleased to share if it seems of interest . I can also answer most questions of a reasoned nature about the various charges going back and forth since I follow them as a student and customer. Let me point out for starters that numerous news sources have reported that Refco had enough liquidity and profits and capital on their books to pay out some 2 billion in bonuses and dividends in 2004. to 4 lucky executives. I would hope that if I were the owner of a firm such as Refco, I could be associated with someone in 1997 who I had losses with that still allowed such a 2 billion payment.Please how could transactions with him in 1997 , and bookkeeping events after have been so heinous and still allow such a payout. The media such as Bloomberg that I read who apparently have an anonymous source close to the investigation report that the losses Refco suffered from their exposure to him were in the 35 million to 45 million range, but that they hid these on their books unbeknownst to the exchanges, accountants, and investors and Niederhoffer for 8 years.But that doesnt take account of assets turned over to them. Jon Markman's article on MoneyCentral A Hedge Fund Meltdown covers all the details, denials , and debts( or lack thereof ) in a very reasonable way although I think he may be a bit more favorable to the horse's asses role in it than might be hoped by some of his detractors and myself profturf
thank you for the indepth info, proturf. would like to see more of you here on the said topic.
having access to returns data, something that someone of my meager status cant readily access, i often queried--- how are the large trend funds doing lately? any light you could shed on this would be apprieciated.
best,
surfer
having access to returns data, something that someone of my meager status cant readily access, i often queried--- how are the large trend funds doing lately? any light you could shed on this would be apprieciated.
best,
surfer
That's right ... only Victor himself would actually be able to spell that monstrosity of a last name right so consistently. Gave himself away I'm afraid ... or we have a rather zealous impersonator on board. Either way ...
The main reason I haven't read any of his books - the pompous tone would make the going too painful. He's masking something - to himself more than anyone else, and that's not a good sign.
And there hasn't been any indication that he could impart anything that others haven't. (Just completed Cramer's 'Confessions' by the way, which shows I'll read just about anything.)
Not if you are native to a country where this name is pretty common.
I do not see many spelling mistakes either which leads me to believe that the posting was first compiled in word etc. and then the name could easily have been automatically corrected.
And the poster claims to have had some form of a run in and having had legal people involved. Then one can remember a name too.
I am always suprised at how one lot of people seem never to get my name right and another lot seem always to get it right. Must be the generation gap: in my younger days it was considered as the ultimate insult to get someones name wrong. Even today I am embarrassed if I forget someone's name.
So do not be too quick with drawing conclusions.
Best
vital-analitics
really?! i think tony crabel and the other dozen or so centi-millionaires, billionaire trading wizards from niederhoffer's trading stable would beg to differ with you.
sorry,
surfer :eek:
I can't help but contrast the fortunes of John Meriwether and Vic. While JWM Partners "only" returns about 15% per annum they have raised over one billion dollars. Niederhoffer has garnered substantially higher returns than JWM yet he's trading with about 1/6th the capital of the former LTCM partners.
It would thus appear investers feel that despite LTCM's 1998 blow up, Meriwether & Co can achieve solid returns with less risk than Vic.
Surfer. Is a strategy like Vics, selling puts, not a quasi- trend following strategy? Does he not get SMOKED on hard market declines?
words, words, words.
ceo, cfo, and staff, auditor, investment banker, NOT customers, responsible for the disaster of the Refco IPO. And what about Thomas Lee buying pre-IPO stock?
Ludicrous to entertain other notions. It was these people who sold this company, debts and all, to the public, not the customers.
ceo, cfo, and staff, auditor, investment banker, NOT customers, responsible for the disaster of the Refco IPO. And what about Thomas Lee buying pre-IPO stock?
Ludicrous to entertain other notions. It was these people who sold this company, debts and all, to the public, not the customers.