Need Help on Prop Shops
- Thread starter Equity Trader
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Wow, Jeff, weird comments (not the first, just more weird than I have seen from you).
If and when you would like to discuss any of the above, I would be glad to.
We do our best to help traders stay in business when we can. If you call that "riding coat tails" then fine.... And, yes, we fall for the "begging" from traders from time to time.
I really thought that the attempt at some sort of "competition" had faded away...I have not heard anything about that firm you aligned with in months.
I have nothing against you or your latest venture(s), I just feel compelled to sort out the truth from fiction.
Things change, in trading, with the industry, nothing more - nothing less.
Good Luck....keep it real!
Don
If and when you would like to discuss any of the above, I would be glad to.
We do our best to help traders stay in business when we can. If you call that "riding coat tails" then fine.... And, yes, we fall for the "begging" from traders from time to time.
I really thought that the attempt at some sort of "competition" had faded away...I have not heard anything about that firm you aligned with in months.
I have nothing against you or your latest venture(s), I just feel compelled to sort out the truth from fiction.
Things change, in trading, with the industry, nothing more - nothing less.
Good Luck....keep it real!
Don
Why would anyone pay $100K for a 4 year education...? Because they think they are going to be able to learn something from those who know more.
We have a 1 time fee for those who are serious about trading. Those with ego's end up with nothing more, more ego than money.
If you really think you know it all, then compare tax returns with those who have taken advanced training.
$1,000 lifetime fee....actually, you're right, I should charge a lot more...lol
Our traders are thankful that so many don't come here for education, more $$ for us. Our (lifetime) free classes to Bright Traders give our people a tremendous edge. If that were not the case, why do we fill up with (already trading professionals) every free class?
Not the best "Naysay"...but thanks for asking...I assume you hanging with Jeff.
Don
You are absolutely right about a couple of things, Jeff. We are allowing our leases to expire in some of the office locations so we can continue to add traders (remote) to our "Super WalMart" locations. We are making room for an additional 55 traders in Vegas, have a couple of hundred remotes, and sit by (smiling) as newer firms get sucked into long leases on offices.
The other firm's that we have absorbed have come to us since they are stuck in these leases.
We have a solid base of few billion shares per year that will keep us competitive, and we get to experiment with other business models.
We are adapting and expanding by diversification and remote trading.
Facts: 1.We offer futures and options. 2. We offer options. 3. We have multiple platforms. 4. We don't charge for capital usage. 5. Bright Securities has been around a long time. 6. Our new global models are looking promising. 7. We train traders at an excellent rate via our boot camp, great results. 8. 10 pennies per day x 5,000 shares still equals $100,000 per year.
More facts: We've tried most of the "cool" platforms....some are ok, some are not...P&L of traders is paramount to our business model, and we allow free use of capital.
Don
The other firm's that we have absorbed have come to us since they are stuck in these leases.
We have a solid base of few billion shares per year that will keep us competitive, and we get to experiment with other business models.
We are adapting and expanding by diversification and remote trading.
Facts: 1.We offer futures and options. 2. We offer options. 3. We have multiple platforms. 4. We don't charge for capital usage. 5. Bright Securities has been around a long time. 6. Our new global models are looking promising. 7. We train traders at an excellent rate via our boot camp, great results. 8. 10 pennies per day x 5,000 shares still equals $100,000 per year.
More facts: We've tried most of the "cool" platforms....some are ok, some are not...P&L of traders is paramount to our business model, and we allow free use of capital.
Don
Don, you have deeper pockets, more traders, more operational experience and much more market experience than me.
One thing that you don't have is people skills and the ability to work with all types of traders. I have heard some great stories about you and did not believe them all, but no I see the light.
I will end this with three words. "Quality over Quantity"
One thing that you don't have is people skills and the ability to work with all types of traders. I have heard some great stories about you and did not believe them all, but no I see the light.
I will end this with three words. "Quality over Quantity"
With your business, I was actually on your side if you would take the time to be less defensive about what this Jeff guy is saying about you and your brother and rest of your family. I was also taking the free shot at Goldman Suchs. Apologies to Mr. Paulsen.
I was laying the blame (although sarcastically) for this industry's woes on the traders themselves and the firms like Worldco that gave such high payouts and low commissions that they "forced" other firms that were trying to make a living while also treating the trader reasonably out of business. A business relationship needs to be TWO sided or it will fail in the long run.
In the late 90's the trader had too much of the upper hand in the relationship and the owners caved because the smaller margins both commission and payout were still large enough because the trader was making money, lots of it.
When a trader can make money relatively easily, he does larger volume and it feeds on itself. I know I did. It is now back down. A trading firm is only profitable if its traders can make money even if they payout 100% and get none of the profits or if keeps on bringing in new traders. If a trader is not making money, then he will do less and less volume. Now, in the early 00's the margins are too thin to operate without the firm being of significant size. I think what is going on here is a classic business school case study of how an industry matures. Consolidation and lower margins. Hopefully, my six years of college weren't wasted.
If a firm pays out 100% of the P&L, no matter how you market it, either the firm doesn't want the risk-reward of its own traders or it is a customer in disguise relationship. Both are fine if everybody understands that, regulators included.
I for one am impressed with your firm doing so well with the 40 office leases and the 100% payout and the thin margins on which you are forced to operate. Everyone here loves to take potshots at you, but you are still standing. That must count for something!
New
...but tired.
I was laying the blame (although sarcastically) for this industry's woes on the traders themselves and the firms like Worldco that gave such high payouts and low commissions that they "forced" other firms that were trying to make a living while also treating the trader reasonably out of business. A business relationship needs to be TWO sided or it will fail in the long run.
In the late 90's the trader had too much of the upper hand in the relationship and the owners caved because the smaller margins both commission and payout were still large enough because the trader was making money, lots of it.
When a trader can make money relatively easily, he does larger volume and it feeds on itself. I know I did. It is now back down. A trading firm is only profitable if its traders can make money even if they payout 100% and get none of the profits or if keeps on bringing in new traders. If a trader is not making money, then he will do less and less volume. Now, in the early 00's the margins are too thin to operate without the firm being of significant size. I think what is going on here is a classic business school case study of how an industry matures. Consolidation and lower margins. Hopefully, my six years of college weren't wasted.
If a firm pays out 100% of the P&L, no matter how you market it, either the firm doesn't want the risk-reward of its own traders or it is a customer in disguise relationship. Both are fine if everybody understands that, regulators included.
I for one am impressed with your firm doing so well with the 40 office leases and the 100% payout and the thin margins on which you are forced to operate. Everyone here loves to take potshots at you, but you are still standing. That must count for something!
New
...but tired.
Thanks for the post....I guess I do get a bit defensive at times, especially with ex-Bright Traders that we have worked with in the past.
It's funny that you mentioned the leases for the 40 offices. The newer firms are falling into a potential trap of attempting to expand like this with the super low rates that are necessary to keep solid "alpha" traders. Perhaps not the best timing. We are doing the exact opposite. Continuing to make money with good traders, yet lowering the overhead from the smaller locations.
It's working out great for us, since many of our leases are ending. We can build up the big offices (mega locations like Vegas, with room for 100 plus traders(soon), (perhaps 10-15 big locations), and continue to grow the remote contingent.
This wasn't exactly planned, but sometimes a little luck helps.
I'm not really upset with Jeff, it is just that I get a bit tired of the negativity on the board. BT is what it is, a strong viable enterprise that is diversifying and continuing to grow, with the help of our traders and our business/training model. As a family, we try really hard, and work 70 hour weeks to see that BT will continue for years to come.
(thanks again!!)
Don
It's funny that you mentioned the leases for the 40 offices. The newer firms are falling into a potential trap of attempting to expand like this with the super low rates that are necessary to keep solid "alpha" traders. Perhaps not the best timing. We are doing the exact opposite. Continuing to make money with good traders, yet lowering the overhead from the smaller locations.
It's working out great for us, since many of our leases are ending. We can build up the big offices (mega locations like Vegas, with room for 100 plus traders(soon), (perhaps 10-15 big locations), and continue to grow the remote contingent.
This wasn't exactly planned, but sometimes a little luck helps.
I'm not really upset with Jeff, it is just that I get a bit tired of the negativity on the board. BT is what it is, a strong viable enterprise that is diversifying and continuing to grow, with the help of our traders and our business/training model. As a family, we try really hard, and work 70 hour weeks to see that BT will continue for years to come.
(thanks again!!)
Don
Quote from Don Bright:
It's working out great for us, since many of our leases are ending. We can build up the big offices (mega locations like Vegas, with room for 100 plus traders(soon), (perhaps 10-15 big locations), and continue to grow the remote contingent.........
(thanks again!!)
Don
the times they are a changin'
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