my last 7 trades
- Thread starter Gordon Gekko
- Start date
lobster, you're trading style sounds very similar to mine. the 'holding losers' problem isn't something i have to worry about, but the i'm not doing nearly as well with the style this year as i was last.
well, i'm actually down for the year. having a few down months isn't a problem at all for other trading styles, but it is for day trading.
i'm starting to think that i don't really know anywhere near as much as i thought i did. that would be obvious to guys who've been at this for more than five years. but i was making money and i though i'd 'cracked it'. perhaps i just got lucky.
in any case, i'm taking a hiatus from day trading. overall, i think it is definitely the poorest of all trading styles. especially if you're not making money.
ANY trading is hard enough, but with day trading, NOT ONLY is it hard in and of itself, but there's EXTRA pressure because it's your only source of income.
i knew that from the first day i got interested in trading, but i was drawn in by the high frequency of trades (an important variable) that it offers. well, 'sucked in' would be a better way to put it.
even if the kind of trading lobster was talking about (and i do) DOES work, and you DO make money, BIG DEAL. about the best you can expect from that is the equivalent of a high paying job, and, more realistically, about $50-$80k. to me that's bullshit.
the big money day trading was possible in a few golden years and that was it. there's a reason that out of all the big name traders (mult millions) they made it as multi day traders, not as "professional traders 'doing size' " LOL.
having said that, i think there are some viable day trading methodologies that hold for 30min+(nimimum), taking 1 or two trades a day (if that), for which it is possible to slowly increase position size. those are ok. but you need to find the time to be able to do them. i would not recommend to anyone to quit their job and try their hand at it. no way. not at least with a solid, backtested system that they've spent a year or two (or three) developing. otherwise it's just a crap shoot.
gekko, my honest, bottom of my heart advice to you dude would be to say 'fuck it' to day trading. seriously man, i can't believe that you've been aroudn trading for a few years and STILL think you're gonna get away with trading the chop (1.75pt stops, LOL) on the ES. get a grip dude! that's a quick way to the poor house.
you'd be so much better off gettting yourself a job and spending the afterhours developing a sound trading system that you can then test forward on a simulator. you've shown that you don't have problems taking stops, so it won't be a waste of time. once you've got some capital together, then you can go live again.
you've said you've got the patience to keep trying for as long as it takes, so prove it to yourself. make the wise, LONG TERM decision. fuck this scalp half a point, lose two bullshit. even if you become half decent at it, the market is most likely going to get a lot worse through the coming year, not better (despite all the "second half turn around" predicitions we keep getting bombarded with), so that's something to keep in mind.
in short, i couldn't think of a worse career decision for ANYBODY, at this point in time, than to take up day trading.
well, i'm actually down for the year. having a few down months isn't a problem at all for other trading styles, but it is for day trading.
i'm starting to think that i don't really know anywhere near as much as i thought i did. that would be obvious to guys who've been at this for more than five years. but i was making money and i though i'd 'cracked it'. perhaps i just got lucky.
in any case, i'm taking a hiatus from day trading. overall, i think it is definitely the poorest of all trading styles. especially if you're not making money.
ANY trading is hard enough, but with day trading, NOT ONLY is it hard in and of itself, but there's EXTRA pressure because it's your only source of income.
i knew that from the first day i got interested in trading, but i was drawn in by the high frequency of trades (an important variable) that it offers. well, 'sucked in' would be a better way to put it.
even if the kind of trading lobster was talking about (and i do) DOES work, and you DO make money, BIG DEAL. about the best you can expect from that is the equivalent of a high paying job, and, more realistically, about $50-$80k. to me that's bullshit.
the big money day trading was possible in a few golden years and that was it. there's a reason that out of all the big name traders (mult millions) they made it as multi day traders, not as "professional traders 'doing size' " LOL.
having said that, i think there are some viable day trading methodologies that hold for 30min+(nimimum), taking 1 or two trades a day (if that), for which it is possible to slowly increase position size. those are ok. but you need to find the time to be able to do them. i would not recommend to anyone to quit their job and try their hand at it. no way. not at least with a solid, backtested system that they've spent a year or two (or three) developing. otherwise it's just a crap shoot.
gekko, my honest, bottom of my heart advice to you dude would be to say 'fuck it' to day trading. seriously man, i can't believe that you've been aroudn trading for a few years and STILL think you're gonna get away with trading the chop (1.75pt stops, LOL) on the ES. get a grip dude! that's a quick way to the poor house.
you'd be so much better off gettting yourself a job and spending the afterhours developing a sound trading system that you can then test forward on a simulator. you've shown that you don't have problems taking stops, so it won't be a waste of time. once you've got some capital together, then you can go live again.
you've said you've got the patience to keep trying for as long as it takes, so prove it to yourself. make the wise, LONG TERM decision. fuck this scalp half a point, lose two bullshit. even if you become half decent at it, the market is most likely going to get a lot worse through the coming year, not better (despite all the "second half turn around" predicitions we keep getting bombarded with), so that's something to keep in mind.
in short, i couldn't think of a worse career decision for ANYBODY, at this point in time, than to take up day trading.
I've had a few beers tonight and I would just like to say thank you to everyone. I apologize if my threads are getting to the point of annoyance. I really do hesitate to start my "loser" threads because I know people will reach out and I don't do my part. People are right when they say that people try to help but I don't post my trades; then a few months later it all repeats. I don't deny that. It's a flaw on my part.
A part of me wants to respond to every single post that was made in this thread, but I would have to make like 60 posts. I sincerely appreciate everyone's response, even if I didn't reply to you. I really do feel sad right now that so many people try to help me, but I'm just such a damn loser. Maybe if I was a girl it wouldn't affect me so much, but a bunch of grown men tried to help another guy that they don't even know for nothing in return. THANK YOU.
I am at a major life crossroad right now and I don't know what I'm going to do. I know I will never be able to abandon trading; that's for sure. I don't even think about giving it up, but if I did, I know I'd see some market quotes on TV and it would make me want to try to figure it out again. It will never end. I'm sure others know what I mean.
That said, I must say that the last few years of my life while trading have probably been the most stressful, toughest, and most unhappy. A lot of it has been due to the never ending day to day struggle to finally "get it", but it just never seems to happen. Another aspect really is the social part. Yeah, I still have my friends, but I have noticeably met less new people the last few years. Some of my best friends are people I met from previous jobs. It's funny how when you have a job, you hate it, but then when you don't have one, you miss it; well, parts of it anyway. Maybe if I made some nice money this would change, but since I haven't, I'm really not someone who can say.
I'm going to do a lot of thinking over the next few days/weeks. I really don't even have many choices. If I trade miserably just a few more days, it's possible I could get my account below IB's minimum margin requirements and I won't be able to trade too much anyway. I don't know if I'm going to sell the car and try again immediately or keep the car and get a job and give it a rest. The smartest thing to do would probably be to sell the car, put the money in the bank, get a job to take some pressure off, meet some new people, and if the day comes that I do figure this out, I'd have a little bit of money to play with again. I really have not made any decision yet though.
The worst part of all this is dealing with the people who know me. No one knows I've been doing shitty lately. They all think I'm some market genius. Not one friend or family member knows how it really is. Everyone thinks I'm doing fine since I don't talk about my trading to anyone. If I do get a job, I will probably just say that I'm getting one to pay for health insurance, etc., since I don't have any. I'll just say that I don't like withdrawing from my account to pay bills. They'd buy it. Admitting the truth is a possibility as well. It wouldn't be an easy thing to do, but people respect honesty.
Well this isn't really a farewell or anything. I just wanted to get a few things off my chest. Thank you again, everyone.
A part of me wants to respond to every single post that was made in this thread, but I would have to make like 60 posts. I sincerely appreciate everyone's response, even if I didn't reply to you. I really do feel sad right now that so many people try to help me, but I'm just such a damn loser. Maybe if I was a girl it wouldn't affect me so much, but a bunch of grown men tried to help another guy that they don't even know for nothing in return. THANK YOU.
I am at a major life crossroad right now and I don't know what I'm going to do. I know I will never be able to abandon trading; that's for sure. I don't even think about giving it up, but if I did, I know I'd see some market quotes on TV and it would make me want to try to figure it out again. It will never end. I'm sure others know what I mean.
That said, I must say that the last few years of my life while trading have probably been the most stressful, toughest, and most unhappy. A lot of it has been due to the never ending day to day struggle to finally "get it", but it just never seems to happen. Another aspect really is the social part. Yeah, I still have my friends, but I have noticeably met less new people the last few years. Some of my best friends are people I met from previous jobs. It's funny how when you have a job, you hate it, but then when you don't have one, you miss it; well, parts of it anyway. Maybe if I made some nice money this would change, but since I haven't, I'm really not someone who can say.
I'm going to do a lot of thinking over the next few days/weeks. I really don't even have many choices. If I trade miserably just a few more days, it's possible I could get my account below IB's minimum margin requirements and I won't be able to trade too much anyway. I don't know if I'm going to sell the car and try again immediately or keep the car and get a job and give it a rest. The smartest thing to do would probably be to sell the car, put the money in the bank, get a job to take some pressure off, meet some new people, and if the day comes that I do figure this out, I'd have a little bit of money to play with again. I really have not made any decision yet though.
The worst part of all this is dealing with the people who know me. No one knows I've been doing shitty lately. They all think I'm some market genius. Not one friend or family member knows how it really is. Everyone thinks I'm doing fine since I don't talk about my trading to anyone. If I do get a job, I will probably just say that I'm getting one to pay for health insurance, etc., since I don't have any. I'll just say that I don't like withdrawing from my account to pay bills. They'd buy it. Admitting the truth is a possibility as well. It wouldn't be an easy thing to do, but people respect honesty.
Well this isn't really a farewell or anything. I just wanted to get a few things off my chest. Thank you again, everyone.
JUST FOLLOW A SYSTEM AND YOU WILL MAKE IT IN THE LONG RUN
JUST FOLLOW A SYSTEM AND YOU WILL MAKE IT IN THE LONG RUN
JUST FOLLOW A SYSTEM AND YOU WILL MAKE IT IN THE LONG RUN
JUST FOLLOW A SYSTEM AND YOU WILL MAKE IT IN THE LONG RUN
JUST FOLLOW A SYSTEM AND YOU WILL MAKE IT IN THE LONG RUN
JUST FOLLOW A SYSTEM AND YOU WILL MAKE IT IN THE LONG RUN
JUST FOLLOW A SYSTEM AND YOU WILL MAKE IT IN THE LONG RUN
JUST FOLLOW A SYSTEM AND YOU WILL MAKE IT IN THE LONG RUN
JUST FOLLOW A SYSTEM AND YOU WILL MAKE IT IN THE LONG RUN
JUST FOLLOW A SYSTEM AND YOU WILL MAKE IT IN THE LONG RUN
JUST FOLLOW A SYSTEM AND YOU WILL MAKE IT IN THE LONG RUN
JUST FOLLOW A SYSTEM AND YOU WILL MAKE IT IN THE LONG RUN
JUST FOLLOW A SYSTEM AND YOU WILL MAKE IT IN THE LONG RUN
JUST FOLLOW A SYSTEM AND YOU WILL MAKE IT IN THE LONG RUN
JUST FOLLOW A SYSTEM AND YOU WILL MAKE IT IN THE LONG RUN
GG, u need to step back, reassess, eat some humble pie, get your shit together: skills, method, money mngt, head, a/c funds, go to a mentor, trading sim, whatever - otherwise its wipeout city, pal.
*** SCARED $$$ ALWAYS LOSES. ***
That said, honestly, who doesn't feel a sense of schaudenfreude at this loser (in the monetary sense?) LOL. Such is human nature.
U all know the 80%/20% idea - 20% of participants make $$$ from the losing 80% majority (exc comms etc).
Survival of the fitttest, just as Darwin would have liked it.
GG youre the public face of the 80% losers, no offence pal.
MMs, big speculators, and winners love you!!
Keep these suckas coming up to the line, baby.
Daniel_M, you took the words out of my mouth about GG, pal.
Say no more about this classic whinger.
Further, as u state, DTrading it sure as fuck NOT for everybody (esp. these days) - takes a special sort. And yep the big $$$ is in swing trading (not defining the duration) NOT hunting for nickels 10 times a day, whatever. Not talking 'bout once in a while doing a short the gap type of i-day trade for easy $$$ but everyday too stressful. I'm talking about for the 80% losers who would do better swinging, not the 5% studs who make $100k+ DTrading.
What people dont f'kin realise is that all markets go from squeeze to squeeze, in cycles, and that all u have to do is catch the meat of that cycle. Look up any chart, weekly, daily, even intraday. How difficult is can that be? Its YOU (the individual) who makes it difficult.
With tough love
RunningBare
ps There was other shit i could have added but this was more of a stream of consciousness thing.....zzz
*** SCARED $$$ ALWAYS LOSES. ***
That said, honestly, who doesn't feel a sense of schaudenfreude at this loser (in the monetary sense?) LOL. Such is human nature.
U all know the 80%/20% idea - 20% of participants make $$$ from the losing 80% majority (exc comms etc).
Survival of the fitttest, just as Darwin would have liked it.
GG youre the public face of the 80% losers, no offence pal.
MMs, big speculators, and winners love you!!
Keep these suckas coming up to the line, baby.
Daniel_M, you took the words out of my mouth about GG, pal.
Say no more about this classic whinger.
Further, as u state, DTrading it sure as fuck NOT for everybody (esp. these days) - takes a special sort. And yep the big $$$ is in swing trading (not defining the duration) NOT hunting for nickels 10 times a day, whatever. Not talking 'bout once in a while doing a short the gap type of i-day trade for easy $$$ but everyday too stressful. I'm talking about for the 80% losers who would do better swinging, not the 5% studs who make $100k+ DTrading.
What people dont f'kin realise is that all markets go from squeeze to squeeze, in cycles, and that all u have to do is catch the meat of that cycle. Look up any chart, weekly, daily, even intraday. How difficult is can that be? Its YOU (the individual) who makes it difficult.
With tough love
RunningBare
ps There was other shit i could have added but this was more of a stream of consciousness thing.....zzz
Gekko... you are living a lie, you are lying to yourself, you are lying to your family, you are lying to your friends. But the only way you see it is if you have a few beers in you, and let down the defenses a little.
You are like an alcoholic who lies about his drinking, or more apropos, a gambler who lies about his gambling. In the pits of despair, or looking up from the gutter, you see you have a problem, but you sober up, spend a day recovering from losses, and you are like the dog/fool in Proverbs 26:11 (look it up) and jump right back in.
Sure, it's safe to spill your guts behind a screen name on a public board, but do it to family and friends and others who care about you. Too risky. What will they think?
You find it better to live the lie, then live the truth, and as long as you do, you will never become a successful trader. Trading takes looking at the truth, no matter how revealing it is, or how much it hurts. Ayn Rands definition of a trader: A man of justice. You do no justice to your friends, family, and especially yourself by living the lie.
So how do I know this... this is the reason I quit trading the end of December. My mentor told me that I was trying to prove something to somebody, and i would never be profitable in this game till i resolved that issue. I believed him and went on a search. Well, for me that person was my dad, who has been dead for a long time. (lol, and i thought i resolved my dad issues years ago)
Gekko... hell, look at your username... you picked a user name from a character whose whole life was a lie. He didn't make money by trading, he did it by cheating.
What are you trying to prove, and to whom?
That is the question you need to research.
H
There is truth in this... it is my reckoning that fewer blow out in swingtrading than in daytrading, since the decision process is slowed down and there is much more time to take a clearer view of things... moreover, there is no need for precise and speedy execution when swingtrading... the downside is, of course, the overnight risk involved in swingtrading, which means you gotta do MUCH smaller size when swingtrading to keep risk in check...
How true. Just when I started to really get into it...
I have to agree on that point as well. If you are able enough to make $50-80k as a scalper, then you could very likely make a lot more money in a "real" job.
My personal reason why I would still not chose a real job is it's not about how much you make, it's how you feel making it.
And GGs reason might be to pay the bills while honing his execution skills.
And one last thing: I don't have much experience, but isn't it true that there are always new opportunities, some people make a lot of money by exploiting them, and soon after that those opportunities disappear again? So if you get lucky, and yes I believe to make it big (more than a few hundred thousand) you have to be lucky in some way, you might just be the one who finds and exploits the next opportunity fo all it's worth.
Also, who says we can't have another daytrading boom? I hate to sound like one of those "idiots" we saw on TV the other day, but do we really know that the whole "bubble" wasn't just the first, minor one of a "two-spike sequence"?
All we really need is a few lucky coincidences, and watch how fast the average Joe will start overtrading his e-trade account as soon as the DJIA hits 11000 again. I'm not saying it's going to happen, but I wouldn't call someone who thinks it might happen any more of an idiot than someone who is convinced we'll see Dow 5000 soon.