My auto trading system generate hundreds of trades a day, but...

Often people make the big mistake to think that something doesn't exist or cannot be done because they don't know it or cannot achieve the same.
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Dude, common! Go tell that to a newbie. The reason I've had so many arguments with swing traders in other forums is because they don't know how to scalp. It's not the other way around.

I know exactly what swing trading entails. It requires working under the false pretext that one is not taking much risk doing so.

The reality is that your market exposure risk is HUGE because you have open positions almost constantly or for very long periods of time. This false sense of security is what makes swing traders, IMHO, the real gamblers in the market.

That's why I only fund scalpers and active day traders. I've rejected so many swing traders that want funding that is not even funny. I always get criticized by frustrated swing traders because of this, but I don't care. The more swing traders, the better for me - because there's less competition for scalpers.

Also the compounding example is misleading as you will face more and more slippage the bigger the position size is.
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This is obvious. That's why I gave you the other figure without compounding. It just shows that even the lower end of the range is too high. No swing trader is going to earn a 600% return a month consistently. Is it impossible? No; but it's highly improbable.

Good luck with your scalping, osorico.
 
Quote from danger66:

Dude, common! Go tell that to a newbie. The reason I've had so many arguments with swing traders in other forums is because they don't know how to scalp. It's not the other way around.

I know exactly what swing trading entails. It requires working under the false pretext that one is not taking much risk doing so.

The reality is that your market exposure risk is HUGE because you have open positions almost constantly or for very long periods of time. This false sense of security is what makes swing traders, IMHO, the real gamblers in the market.

That's why I only fund scalpers and active day traders. I've rejected so many swing traders that want funding that is not even funny. I always get criticized by frustrated swing traders because of this, but I don't care. The more swing traders, the better for me - because there's less competition for scalpers.


This is obvious. That's why I gave you the other figure without compounding. It just shows that even the lower end of the range is too high. No swing trader is going to earn a 600% return a month consistently. Is it impossible? No; but it's highly improbable.

Good luck with your scalping, osorico.
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Some people defend my opinion; they know why, as well as i do.
I never discuss with people who are sure that they know all, and say that what others tell is impossible.
Leave the dum dum especially if they are not interested in learning. But as they are sure to know everything they don't have to learn anything at all.
There are sometimes very good ideas that can be found on the internet; but if you are so fulfilled of your own wisdom you will surely never even look at these ideas.

I make in the long run on average 100% a week net, i do not compound and i have a limit amount of money that i trade. It means 4 points net a day. On february 27 i made 40 points. The best trade since i started trading 16 years ago. Before i told anyone of this trade i received PM's from people who told me that i probably went short and they even knew more or less when.
40 points at 50$ a piece make 2000$ per contract. I trade with a margin of 1000$ per contract. So i tripled my account in 1 day.
I know it is impossible but i don't care. Your opinion will not make me money, my trading will.

Discussion is closed, there is no added value in it anymore.

PS: it was not 600% in a month; it was 595% between march 08 and march 23, so in less than a month. I must admit that this month was exceptional; that's why i said in the long run 100% a week.
 
this is a strange and unnnecessary discussion. strategies with
up to 5 trades per day per market will tend to have lower sharpe
ratios than strategies that trade 100+ trades per day per market.
the first will be able to manage more money since their return per
trade can offset a higher market impact than the second category.
and some point in between, maybe at 50 trades epr day per market,
will be the flip point. from there on, if you move to lower frequency
and you want to earn the same absolute dollar sharpe you need to
manage more money. in contrast if you trade at higher freq, you
can only trade less money. your absolute dollar sharpe remains
the same. since now you have less risk, but less return either,
as you must decrease the amount you can manage.

now that is the situation for a specific scalping system and a
specific swing system. if you want to increase your dollar sharpe
you must make the systems themselves better. seemingly you
are comparing here and exceptionally good swing system with
relatively normal scalping systems (no offense intended). i would
think that spike trades a sharpe of around 5, which is exceptionally
good. especially for swing. it is probably among the top 0.01%
of profitable swing systems. i think the average profitable scalper
will trade a sharpe of 3, but the 0.01% trade in excess of 8 or 9.

so, to sum up, you are wasting tissue of your fingertips comparing
apples and condomes. IMHO.
 
Spike500,



I worked at a prop shop and the best results (I have seen this with my own eyes in the software of the risk manager) in terms of % of the daily range came from the guys all doing on average +20 trades a day and averaging over minimum 100 trading days more than 100 % of the range.

I invite you to post your calls in the chatroom here in ET, I just started today because I was invited,challenged by austinp.
Then you can convince Danger66 (and me also because I only believe what I see :real-time calls and track records) no offense but the internet is full of posers as you probably know :cool:

If you take only 1 trade a day, the max you can make is 100 % of the range, high minus low, so you need at least 2 trades to go over 100 % of the range....
 
Considering only the profitable traders; there was a high correlation between the number of trades and the % of range captured...

Conclusion ; the hypothetical theory is confirmed by real world numbers.

Doesn't mean you can capture 50% of the range with only 1 to 2 trades, the exception makes the rule but I need to see the exception before I believe the exception:cool:
 
I worked at a prop shop and the best results (I have seen this with my own eyes in the software of the risk manager) in terms of % of the daily range came from the guys all doing on average +20 trades a day and averaging over minimum 100 trading days more than 100 % of the range.

As you say the best you ever saw, so not really the average scalper. How much return does he make on his capital invested? Because that’s the ultimate proof of a system: the combination of all elements to make the biggest return on the amount invested.


I invite you to post your calls in the chatroom here in ET, I just started today because I was invited,challenged by austinp.
Then you can convince Danger66 (and me also because I only believe what I see :real-time calls and track records) no offense but the internet is full of posers as you probably know

That’s the typical, always coming back, question. Well, I made several attempts to proof it although it brings no advantages to me. A proof of those attempts can be found in the Journal: Can Spikey make 1 point a day in the ES?
This is probably the shortest thread ever made on ET. I wanted to proof after an eternal discussion that it is possible to make consistently 1 point in the ES a day. I can make more but why bet on 4 if i could get right by proving i can make 1 point? Even before the first real time posting was made, bashers were trying to proof that no matter what would happen my proof would never be a proof. After that attempt I was fed up with all the “experts” on ET and decided to never again post any trades. Just read the thread (it will take less than a minute), so that you can see with your own eyes.


If you take only 1 trade a day, the max you can make is 100 % of the range, high minus low, so you need at least 2 trades to go over 100 % of the range....

I never said I made 100% of the daily range; I said I make more than 50% of the daily range. My long term average number of trades a day is about 2.5 trades. In my setup I make normally 100% a week, net included deduction of slippage, spread, commission or whatever you can think of. I get in and out in seconds, so experts in the ES can tell how big a position can be before the size becomes a problem. On 200 contracts it makes 1 million dollars a month. If the market can handle 500 contracts with almost flash fills, than the system can generate over 2.5 million dollars a month. If I read well that would be much more than Tradebot does with dozens of traders and hundreds of screens in gazillion trades.

And when we talk about a "trend", we must first make an exact definition of what a trend is.
There are several threads on ET with thousands of pages filled with attempts to define “trend”. For as far as I know they still didn't’t figure it out. I wonder what the importance of that definition is? If you have another definition of trend would that change my performance? I hope your answer is no, because I cannot see how a definition can influence performances (but if that is possible I’m always interested to know). I follow the intraday trend.

I always get caught in useless discussions because I’m passionate about trading. I should have kept my mouth, because at the end i have to proof something that will never be accepted by people who do not share your opinion. They will always find excuses as was clearly demonstrated in the thread I started a while ago. And if you don’t want to proof it i'm classified as a poser. So I will always loose. And finally: what have I to win?
That’s what I was thinking about when I said yesterday: discussion closed.
I prefer not to show anything, because i will be the loser anyhow, but at least i won't give away secrets to my opponents.
 
Just want to give a big thanks...

1/2 hour into the trading day, I've already eclipsed my average number of trades, and have surpassed my average daily profit.

Thanks for the motivation to clear out the fog!

Tiddlywinks... get em in the cup.
Osorico :)

BTW; danger, thanks for the "luck" but luck isn't involved... Just living up to my potential. :cool:
 
I get in and out in seconds
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I consider that a scalp. I thought you were a swing trader. Scalping doesn't just mean executing a gazillion transactions a day. Not every scalper does that. Some just trade a few times, but the trades are quickly entered and closed.

How much return does he make on his capital invested? Because that’s the ultimate proof of a system: the combination of all elements to make the biggest return on the amount invested.
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It's not just about the return. I care more about how that return is obtained. I would rather settle for half the return if it means being out of the market more than in via trades that only last a short amount of time. Risk control is the key. High return and low exposure risk is better than very high return and a lot of market exposure.

BTW; danger, thanks for the "luck" but luck isn't involved... Just living up to my potential.
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osorico, you're absolutely right. Luck is for Las Vegas - skill is for trading.
 
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