that is some entertaining reading. thanks for posting it. this is an example of what i call the "gann cult". these people are off the wall and in no way represents how i use gann analysis to trade.
best,
surf
best,
surf
MurreyMath
- Thread starter traderbambu
- Start date
I can make a perfectly square chart with CQG and still accidentally manipulate the price axis simply by switching from bar to candlestick, or changing the width of the candlesticks. Angles also change as the chart formats itself to fit the high and low extremes on the screen.
For an extreme example of how a chart changes its own angles as new action emerges, check out a daily chart of THC. Before the huge gap down, there were rich angles in the ups and downs. After the gap down, all the preceding action becomes severely flattened out as a necessity of fitting that fat gap move into the chart. What you are viewing is regularly distorted by the mundane requirement of fitting the available price action into a specificed window, in lots of different ways, regardless of whether you have a rectangle or a square. Is there an optimal Gann setting for the width of the bars or candlesticks?? As Tharp notes, bar charts in many ways aren't really what's happening at all, they are an extremely limited abstract representation of what's happening- and thus prone to distortion and woefully incomplete.
A square chart still has arbitrary X and Y denominations. What is special about a man made unit of measurement, as measure of time and distance both are? We probably have a ten base number system because we have ten fingers and ten toes. We have a 24 hour/ 365 day system based on the rotation of the earth and orbit of the sun. What if we had eight fingers, or what if the earth was smaller and rotated faster, or larger and rotated slower, or took more/less time to circle the sun? How does squaring an arbitrary against an arbitrary create a meaningful statistical result?
Finally what does "equivalent" in terms of units mean? How do you match up price and time when both contain a series of potential infinites (both price and time can theoretically be divided into smaller and smaller units for eternity, or agglomerated into larger and larger units for eternity). Thus what is "one?" One to one of what? One second to one cent? One day to one point? One 6.5 hour trading session to one unit of average daily volatility?
Have a good weekend, and don't take me too seriously
You say: I can make a perfectly square chart with CQG and still accidentally manipulate the price axis simply by switching from bar to candlestick, or changing the width of the candlesticks. Angles also change as the chart formats itself to fit the highs and lows.
I say: Correct again, now, with TradeStation you can disable this automatic formatting to keep the measurements intact. Remember that Gann didn't have this problem. Same with candlesticks and bars, this will affect the integrity of the chart and will throw the angles off. Initial measurements must be maintained for the duration of the square in question.
Insomuch as our number system being arbitrary, you are right yet again, but as we use this same arbitrary system to trade with (base 10), then the controls remain stable and measurements can be taken with accuracy.
All the Gann-ese is nothing more than a smoke screen to a few methods that Gann used to take price time measurements, and trade against those.
As long that the conditions for the initial measurements remain, then the measurements can be projected into the future with a very good degree of accuracy.
I say: Correct again, now, with TradeStation you can disable this automatic formatting to keep the measurements intact. Remember that Gann didn't have this problem. Same with candlesticks and bars, this will affect the integrity of the chart and will throw the angles off. Initial measurements must be maintained for the duration of the square in question.
Insomuch as our number system being arbitrary, you are right yet again, but as we use this same arbitrary system to trade with (base 10), then the controls remain stable and measurements can be taken with accuracy.
All the Gann-ese is nothing more than a smoke screen to a few methods that Gann used to take price time measurements, and trade against those.
As long that the conditions for the initial measurements remain, then the measurements can be projected into the future with a very good degree of accuracy.
Quote from marketsurfer:
darkhorse,
those are indeed giants in the field that you qoute. however, they are misinformed concerning gann.
best,
surf
It is amazing how a simple misperception can cause one to dismiss an entire methodology. I remember reading those quotes by Schwager et al. many years ago and falling into the mind trap of dismissing Gann, accepting those comments and thinking oh good I don't have to bother. Circle back ten years later, and now you'll have to pry the Gann Wheel from my hands.
MC