Multicharts User Thread
- Thread starter GaryN
- Start date
I just found out strategies with the keyword "stop" slows down drammatically with multichart. With other strategies I was actually able to speed up optimization ~4x with a quad core machine using multichart when compared to TS that only uses a single core.
I reported the problem to tssupport and the bug is confirmed. Hopefully they will have a fix soon.
Hello,
I build trading system since 10 years and I trade on Forex, Futures, stocks and derivative (mainly on crude oil, gold and other commodities).
I'm a long time user of Amibroker, Wealth-Lab and Tradestation. I recently bought Multichart after 1 year ... waiting stability ... Now I think it's a stable platform but the only reason I bought it is "Easy Langage" ...
I built a lot of complex trading system on Amibroker (building my own AFL order liv=brary implementing Stop, Limit, etc ... which are not native in the langage) and switch to WL to manage position sizing (Amibroker position sizing management is unusable in the real world) then I switched to TS 8.1 to get the better compromise between : Langage/Speed/Features.
TS is the best only for the "Langage" feature but the rest of the application is only in the average ... The top of the top for langage power is WL but catastrophic perfomance made it unusable when you have to test a lot of new ideas each days.
Easy Langage is the best to implement new ideas very quickly. So MC made the good choice ... this langage have no competitor.
I switched from TS 8.1 to Multichart + eSignal 3 months ago after having performed some benchmark and comparison. Ok MC is a good tool to build trading system but the problem is the same I encounter with WL: Too slow to be really used by professional traders.
Explanation:
MC is very fast in calculation (indicators, trading systems, optimization, especially in my dual core). But the Backfill, chart display, time frame changes are simply catastrophic. I agree with Tomasz, the most important for a customer which really work every day with a tool is to switch fast from a chart to another, from a 5 minutes to a 15 minutes, etc ... And the top of the top in this area is Amibroker.
I think MC is ok on the CPU side ... very efficient. But now keeps all your effort on the Database side wich is THE weak point of MC.
The portfolio backtest engine is less important than a very efficient database management which allow to display instantly any chart or trading system signals. This is the reason why Amibroker is so popular ... Professional priority is not sophistication but : "never wait for information".
Sophistication is the second step after the performance issues are ok.
Now this is my point of view about the Amibroker and MC road map :
Amibroker :
- Change your backtest engine to allow to place orders : Stop and Limit are the minimum to add
- Add a usable position sizing feature to allow 1 entry / 5 exits every 10 points profits for example (impossible to program it for the moment) : Buy Stop 10 lots @ N, Sell Limit 2 lots @ N+10 points , Sell Limit 2 lots @ N+20 points, Sell Limit 2 lots @ N+30 points, etc ...
MC :
- Improve your database management to switch charts nearly as fast as Amibroker (and not 100 times slower)
- Portfolio Backtest is really secondary compared to database performance
- Testing on a 16 core is ridiculous, it makes no sense ... except loosing your time ... you customer will never buy such a computer ... and they will never understand how you could use your time doing such "marketing" benchmark instead of improving THE most important weak point of MC. So please be focused on the real customer requirements. Not on Marketing.
http://www.addictfx.biz
I build trading system since 10 years and I trade on Forex, Futures, stocks and derivative (mainly on crude oil, gold and other commodities).
I'm a long time user of Amibroker, Wealth-Lab and Tradestation. I recently bought Multichart after 1 year ... waiting stability ... Now I think it's a stable platform but the only reason I bought it is "Easy Langage" ...
I built a lot of complex trading system on Amibroker (building my own AFL order liv=brary implementing Stop, Limit, etc ... which are not native in the langage) and switch to WL to manage position sizing (Amibroker position sizing management is unusable in the real world) then I switched to TS 8.1 to get the better compromise between : Langage/Speed/Features.
TS is the best only for the "Langage" feature but the rest of the application is only in the average ... The top of the top for langage power is WL but catastrophic perfomance made it unusable when you have to test a lot of new ideas each days.
Easy Langage is the best to implement new ideas very quickly. So MC made the good choice ... this langage have no competitor.
I switched from TS 8.1 to Multichart + eSignal 3 months ago after having performed some benchmark and comparison. Ok MC is a good tool to build trading system but the problem is the same I encounter with WL: Too slow to be really used by professional traders.
Explanation:
MC is very fast in calculation (indicators, trading systems, optimization, especially in my dual core). But the Backfill, chart display, time frame changes are simply catastrophic. I agree with Tomasz, the most important for a customer which really work every day with a tool is to switch fast from a chart to another, from a 5 minutes to a 15 minutes, etc ... And the top of the top in this area is Amibroker.
I think MC is ok on the CPU side ... very efficient. But now keeps all your effort on the Database side wich is THE weak point of MC.
The portfolio backtest engine is less important than a very efficient database management which allow to display instantly any chart or trading system signals. This is the reason why Amibroker is so popular ... Professional priority is not sophistication but : "never wait for information".
Sophistication is the second step after the performance issues are ok.
Now this is my point of view about the Amibroker and MC road map :
Amibroker :
- Change your backtest engine to allow to place orders : Stop and Limit are the minimum to add
- Add a usable position sizing feature to allow 1 entry / 5 exits every 10 points profits for example (impossible to program it for the moment) : Buy Stop 10 lots @ N, Sell Limit 2 lots @ N+10 points , Sell Limit 2 lots @ N+20 points, Sell Limit 2 lots @ N+30 points, etc ...
MC :
- Improve your database management to switch charts nearly as fast as Amibroker (and not 100 times slower)
- Portfolio Backtest is really secondary compared to database performance
- Testing on a 16 core is ridiculous, it makes no sense ... except loosing your time ... you customer will never buy such a computer ... and they will never understand how you could use your time doing such "marketing" benchmark instead of improving THE most important weak point of MC. So please be focused on the real customer requirements. Not on Marketing.
http://www.addictfx.biz
C
Candara
Wow! First post since 2004 
@pricerxl :
BOTH your "roadmap" points are already possible with AB. Limit / stop orders are 2 lines. For example limit:
BuyPrice = Min( Open, LimitPrice );
Buy = EnterLong AND Low < LimitPrice;
Scaling is possible too (Did you see http://www.amibroker.com/guide/h_pyramid.html )
Actually everything imaginable is possible.
Did you see custom backtester ?
http://www.amibroker.com/guide/a_custombacktest.html
Did you see our rebalancing examples?
http://www.amibroker.com/kb/2006/03/06/re-balancing-open-positions/
PositionSizing: that's as easy as it gets - one liner - see
SetPositionSize function
http://www.amibroker.com/f?setpositionsize
BOTH your "roadmap" points are already possible with AB. Limit / stop orders are 2 lines. For example limit:
BuyPrice = Min( Open, LimitPrice );
Buy = EnterLong AND Low < LimitPrice;
Scaling is possible too (Did you see http://www.amibroker.com/guide/h_pyramid.html )
Actually everything imaginable is possible.
Did you see custom backtester ?
http://www.amibroker.com/guide/a_custombacktest.html
Did you see our rebalancing examples?
http://www.amibroker.com/kb/2006/03/06/re-balancing-open-positions/
PositionSizing: that's as easy as it gets - one liner - see
SetPositionSize function
http://www.amibroker.com/f?setpositionsize
Thank you Tomasz, I know I can build Limit and Stop with code, but "Built orders Function" could be better. I had already developped my own "Built In" Order library with position sizing 3 years ago (single position size for the moment) ... But I didn't know I could exit a position at any given price, I stoped working with Amibroker just after the first release allowing multiple exits (what you called pyramiding) because only the first exit could be setting up at a given price, the rest of position could only be exit at the close of signal bar.
You send me links showing a better control of the execution prices ... so multiple exist seems to be possible ... But It's only usable If I can include it in my "Fast System Developpement" Famework ... I will check it out and if everything is Ok, I will leave Multicharts until they solve their database performance issue.
Another very important suggestion (or question if you already have the answer) :
- I had saved a lot of Tradestation Historical data before to cancel my subscription to switch to eSignal
- TS Bars Date/Time is based on Close
- eSignal Bars Bars Date/Time is based on Open
- Amibroker use the native eSignal Mode so if I import my existing long intraday historical TS data into Amibroker then connect my eSignal data feed to complete missing recent datas ... the Time Stamp of recent data comming from eSignal is not the same as the old datas coming from TS
- Multichart transform the eSignal Timestamp reference into a TS TimeStamp reference, so Historicals and Recent datas matches perfectly
- With Amibroker that's a very big problem for Backtest :
Example : Non Farm Payroll is at 12h30 GMT : If I want to enter at the close just before the NFP on a 5 minutes based char: on TS data I will enter at the close of the 12h30 bar, on the eSignal data I will enter at the Open of the 12h30 bar or at the close of the 12h25 bar.
Precision : I don't want to use Excel or any script to convert my hudge amount of data ... It's much better to add a "TimeStamp Reference Tuning" capability to Amibroker.
Is it possible to add the capability to set up the TimeStamp reference for eSignal Backfill ? So imports and realtime will match perfectly ...
Thank You