Moral support and confirmation needed about starting trading for a living

Quote from ozzy:

Here's my advice:

** Start small.
** Be cautiously confident.
** Swing Trade at first.
** Test all your ideas. Then test them some more.
** Take time off from work and trade fulltime to get an idea of what trading is all about.

I have committed every trading sin possible and lost money in more ways than imaginable. My over sized ego and un-ending self belief led to a lot of unnecessary trouble. It is possible to make money but it takes time to get the experience and knowledge necessary to make it big.

ozzy
More...
Ozzy offers good advice, except for maybe the bit about swing trading. Not sure on that one. That same advice has been offered to numerous traders who have still managed to blow their accounts.

So let me offer this same advice a bit stronger.

You cannot and will not start too small and too cautious. 2 years from now, you will look back and say "I shoulda been trading in less size and with more caution."

You will not test your ideas enough. 5 years from now you'll say "I cannot believe how naive I was about the markets. I was a babe in the woods something awful. It's a wonder I survived." If you somehow survive, that is.

You will quit your job too soon. 6 months from now you'll say "I shoulda stayed employed and figured out some way to learn while I had an income."

I know, everybody comes at you with the negatives, everybody talks about how hard it is, but there's all that money, and crap the spread is tight, surely taking the ask or hitting the bid is a sweet move. I've been going at this full time hammer & tongs for just a couple weeks over three years full time. I'm bright, IQ of 140 - near genius. I'm also net down for those three years. Three years, every day sitting down here at my computer (except for vacations). NihabaAshi can confirm this, although I do not follow his trading style. Three years. Right now, I'd be better off if I had flipped burgers at McDonald's. Fatter, but I'd have more money. Plus getting sick of fast food is probably a health bonus for me. ;)

(as an aside, I finally figured out what is so great about a fast food burger - it's the really thin patty! Make a burger with as thin a patty as you can, tastes great! Man, I hate those meatloaf sandwiches some folks make at parties, bleah. Give me the thin slab of greasy meat with lots of veggies and sauce.)

Anyway, you'll never embark on a harder career than being a trader. That fact might make you smile and ready to work hard. If so, maybe it's the career for you. OTOH, if you think trading is about punching buttons and letting wealth roll into your account, you might be in for a serious wake-up call.
 
Quote from tsmithyAussie:

Guys, my 1st post ever on this forum. Hope its in the right place. If its not please let me know and I will repost.

I want to go part time/quit in my sole destroying call centre bank job and trade for a living. Have saved over $150000 US and plan to start using V small trades of $3000 US or less and buy 5 or 6 stocks max at any one time..dont expect to make much for the 1st year, would be happy to break even and will use $30000 or so as total capital unless my mental maturity for risk allows me to use more. Will be trading on ASX.

Have read over 2000 pages of books and like Dr Alexander Elders aproach trading for a living, even went part time to do all this study before retreating back to full time. I understand money management and psychology are more important than stock selection.

I use metastock and end of day prices and tech analysis.

Problem is I am totally isolated over here in Australia and have no one to talk too. The books all make it sound possible but is my dream realistic? I am aware traing is harder than being a surgeon or airline pilot.

I have a trouble believing in myself and need a push. I have no one to talk to who can understand my position and ambition.

Am I being realistic or a dreamer?
More...

skalpz - is that you? :D
 
Quote from tsmithyAussie:

Guys, my 1st post ever on this forum. Hope its in the right place. If its not please let me know and I will repost.

I want to go part time/quit in my sole destroying call centre bank job and trade for a living. Have saved over $150000 US and plan to start using V small trades of $3000 US or less and buy 5 or 6 stocks max at any one time..dont expect to make much for the 1st year, would be happy to break even and will use $30000 or so as total capital unless my mental maturity for risk allows me to use more. Will be trading on ASX.

Have read over 2000 pages of books and like Dr Alexander Elders aproach trading for a living, even went part time to do all this study before retreating back to full time. I understand money management and psychology are more important than stock selection.

I use metastock and end of day prices and tech analysis.

Problem is I am totally isolated over here in Australia and have no one to talk too. The books all make it sound possible but is my dream realistic? I am aware traing is harder than being a surgeon or airline pilot.

I have a trouble believing in myself and need a push. I have no one to talk to who can understand my position and ambition.

Am I being realistic or a dreamer?
More...

It's entirely possible.
If you can ever find someone you trust that can mentor you, maybe not completely full time, but can help you on your way, that would be excellent. I'm the same exact position you are in almost, except you take away some of those zeros on the money I have to use in the market, and I didn't have a job at a bank. I'm only 18. So, it is entirely possible. Swing trading would be a smart idea at first.

You just have to be willing to dedicate time and effort. I currently put in over 70 hours a week, more even for trading. I'm still new and learning, and have yet to be consistantly profitable. I like others have blown away money, but you have to keep trying... just don't lose all your money. I have heard people lose 10k trading easily. So it is entirely possible to lose all of that 150k, so make sure to not put any money in the market that you can't afford to lose.

May the skills hopefully be with you!
 
Quote from tsmithyAussie:

Guys, my 1st post ever on this forum. Hope its in the right place. If its not please let me know and I will repost.

I want to go part time/quit in my sole destroying call centre bank job and trade for a living. Have saved over $150000 US and plan to start using V small trades of $3000 US or less and buy 5 or 6 stocks max at any one time..dont expect to make much for the 1st year, would be happy to break even and will use $30000 or so as total capital unless my mental maturity for risk allows me to use more. Will be trading on ASX.

Have read over 2000 pages of books and like Dr Alexander Elders aproach trading for a living, even went part time to do all this study before retreating back to full time. I understand money management and psychology are more important than stock selection.

I use metastock and end of day prices and tech analysis.

Problem is I am totally isolated over here in Australia and have no one to talk too. The books all make it sound possible but is my dream realistic? I am aware traing is harder than being a surgeon or airline pilot.

I have a trouble believing in myself and need a push. I have no one to talk to who can understand my position and ambition.

Am I being realistic or a dreamer?
More...

You come across as a very sensible and suitably conservative newbie... if more newbies were like you, the failure rate would not be as high as 90%...

From the outset, your over-riding assumption must be that you will fail... with this assumption in place, you must plan to make your failure as painless as possible... your capped allocation of $15000-$18000 risk capital is therefore an excellent starting point...

If you can stay above water with most of that $18000 intact after a few months, your odds of success will have shot up... if you blow up, well it's only $18000...

In Australia, you are very fortunate to have a great trader, who is also an EOD metastock user... you can find him via:
http://www.guppytraders.com/

He may be able to refer you on to Australian networks whom you can hook up with...

Candle
 
you mean to say there are no prop equity firms in Aussieville , not even BRIGHT TRADING ?

ps whatever you do ... don't trade futures or forex

at first ... usually too much leverage there ...

:p
 
You want to trade ? then you must understand first!

Take a hanfull of bread and throw into the garden and watch...observe...what do you see?

Look at the behaviour of the birds, the large birds, Crows, Blackbirds and Starlings,. They squabble and fight over the biggest slices of bread , they FEAR they will miss out, they need to get the biggest piece, their GREED overwhelms them as they squabble and fight over the spoils.
Now, observe the humble sparrow, he flies in..and out..and in ...and out.. taking just enough bread to feed on, enough to live off, nimble and healthy.

And the moral of this story is....CRUMBS!



Quote from tsmithyAussie:

Guys, my 1st post ever on this forum. Hope its in the right place. If its not please let me know and I will repost.

I want to go part time/quit in my sole destroying call centre bank job and trade for a living. Have saved over $150000 US and plan to start using V small trades of $3000 US or less and buy 5 or 6 stocks max at any one time..dont expect to make much for the 1st year, would be happy to break even and will use $30000 or so as total capital unless my mental maturity for risk allows me to use more. Will be trading on ASX.

Have read over 2000 pages of books and like Dr Alexander Elders aproach trading for a living, even went part time to do all this study before retreating back to full time. I understand money management and psychology are more important than stock selection.

I use metastock and end of day prices and tech analysis.

Problem is I am totally isolated over here in Australia and have no one to talk too. The books all make it sound possible but is my dream realistic? I am aware traing is harder than being a surgeon or airline pilot.

I have a trouble believing in myself and need a push. I have no one to talk to who can understand my position and ambition.

Am I being realistic or a dreamer?
More...
 
Quote from wee man:

You want to trade ? then you must understand first!

Take a hanfull of bread and throw into the garden and watch...observe...what do you see?

Look at the behaviour of the birds, the large birds, Crows, Blackbirds and Starlings,. They squabble and fight over the biggest slices of bread , they FEAR they will miss out, they need to get the biggest piece, their GREED overwhelms them as they squabble and fight over the spoils.
Now, observe the humble sparrow, he flies in..and out..and in ...and out.. taking just enough bread to feed on, enough to live off, nimble and healthy.

And the moral of this story is....CRUMBS!
More...

Fantastic!
 
sent rambling pm, forgot to mention, DUMP METASTOCK, do it now, before its too late. You will not get better advice. Anything but metastock.
 
Quote from TGregg:

[B... I've been going at this full time hammer & tongs for just a couple weeks over three years full time. I'm bright, IQ of 140 - near genius. I'm also net down for those three years. ....

... if you think trading is about punching buttons and letting wealth roll into your account, you might be in for a serious wake-up call. [/B]
More...

Three years net negative is a long time to not be seeing net positive ... but, like you said this might be because you simply traded too much size initially....

The biggest problem that new traders have is not adjusting their position size - basically for the first year you just trade very small until you are consistently profitable.

The primary issues new traders face are those related to position management and risk management, and to the development of their trading strategy - most start without one.

Not much has changed in trading over the years: you have to have the right personality to deal with taking losses when required and occasionally being under water on a trade and not bailing out due to fear. You also have to be agressive on both cutting losses and adding to winning positions to maximize your profits in those circumstances where the market is moving to your advantage.

All of these attributes can really only be optimized through real trading experience.
 
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