Miserable trading market

U can do day trading in one acct, swing trading in another, longer term stuff in another, etc. No need to restrict oneself.

...I try to change my style (of investing) to fit the conditions
~ George Soros
 
MarketOwl said:
I have no problem with people having a different viewpoint, its just your wrong interpretation of my post that is annoying. I never said no one can make money daytrading. I said most can't. I am talking about reality, in which a very small minority are long term profitable. There is even a smaller minority of traders that make a lot of money from trading, and most are trading longer time frames. You think George Soros is daytrading? Warren Buffett? David Tepper? Bruce Kovner? The only ones I know that are daytrading successfully are using HFT, like Jim Simons, And other big time successful daytrading operations are HFT run like Citadel, Virtu, Jump, Hudson River,....

What people who just start don't realize is that the more you trade, the bigger you trade, the more slippage you get and have to pay. If you are trading small size, sure you can daytrade efficiently if you have the skills, but most people here don't have those skills. And no, making money for a few months in a row dont make you a successful daytrader. If you are trading large size, HFTs will sniff out your activities and front run you. Learn about how HFTs make money off order flow before you come here claiming so many people make money daytrading.
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You do understand that to daytrade with large positions one can split those positions up, right? No-one in their right mind will send a big order as whole. Daytrading doesn't have to mean you're competing with HFT.
Saying most can't make money daytrading, is that even worth mentioning? That's like saying the sea is blue, obvious.
Do you think most people make money swing trading? I don't.
 
d08 said:
You do understand that to daytrade with large positions one can split those positions up, right? No-one in their right mind will send a big order as whole. Daytrading doesn't have to mean you're competing with HFT.
Saying most can't make money daytrading, is that even worth mentioning? That's like saying the sea is blue, obvious.
Do you think most people make money swing trading? I don't.
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Right, you can split up positions and trade multiple time frames, but that isn't what most people do here. The big time successful traders and fund managers are not daytrading ES, EURUSD, or AAPL. They are taking positions to try to make large gains over weeks and months, not hours.

I bet there are a much higher percentage of swing traders making money than daytraders. Still a minority, but definitely better odds than daytrading.
 
Well, fund managers and traders are completely different animals. One manages very large amounts of money, has relatively low returns and is also a salesman - the other is the opposite, a guy in boxer shorts who answers to nobody and suffers with the results.
One reason the big guys swing trade is because they are...big. You cannot get in and out of trades in stocks within minutes if your position is in the hundreds of millions, without slippage.

Why is swing trading special? There's nothing to indicate this.
 
Best to just stick with the typical comparison of ET retail day trader versus ET retail swing trading. If you do that, most traders are losing regardless if day trading or swing trading.

Yet, anyone worrying about which one is prettier than the other...you're already behind and worrying about the wrong things. Simply, don't lower yourself to kindergarten like comparisons.

Just trade (position, swing, day trading, scalping) and try to be one of the few making it.

Yep, some trading days are miserable and some are great.
 
MarketOwl said:
I have no problem with people having a different viewpoint, its just your wrong interpretation of my post that is annoying. I never said no one can make money daytrading. I said most can't. I am talking about reality, in which a very small minority are long term profitable. There is even a smaller minority of traders that make a lot of money from trading, and most are trading longer time frames. You think George Soros is daytrading? Warren Buffett? David Tepper? Bruce Kovner? The only ones I know that are daytrading successfully are using HFT, like Jim Simons, And other big time successful daytrading operations are HFT run like Citadel, Virtu, Jump, Hudson River,....

What people who just start don't realize is that the more you trade, the bigger you trade, the more slippage you get and have to pay. If you are trading small size, sure you can daytrade efficiently if you have the skills, but most people here don't have those skills. And no, making money for a few months in a row dont make you a successful daytrader. If you are trading large size, HFTs will sniff out your activities and front run you. Learn about how HFTs make money off order flow before you come here claiming so many people make money daytrading.
More...

Most people cannot make money trading daily charts on fundamentals which are often disconnected from what is actually happening in the market. Despite the relatively low VIX the market has had some nice swings even on daily time frames. Not sure why it is so crappy...
 
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