Mental Ceilings and self fulfilling prophesies
- Thread starter Girlpower
- Start date
Very well said, Damir.
However we could still learn something useful and practical from others' writings and sayings to improve our knowledge of trading for our own success (profits and else), I would believe.
Sometimes, we might even learn from others' mistakes or their wrong concepts/principles by disproving them, whether through open discussion, or merely our own logics/experiences.
Then we may (or may not) share our updated knowledge afterwards, with some others for enjoyment or confirmation.
Just a thought!
Moving this thread on, I want to propose a practical thing to do.
Design a method between us.
The first thing is, it has to be simple, not use too many indicators,
Needs to take smallish targets, and needs to trade a few times a day but not excessively.
Using all the combined skill and intelligence of everyone here it should be possible to do something along those lines.
Can use MA, RSI, Stochastics, Candle patterns etc. or any other indicator needed.
Basically the idea is to put something together that can be used or taken away and modified, junked, improved, or even used. I'm sure it would help some here to do it and probably wouldn't hurt all...
Any takers?
Best Natalie
p.s. I already have methods that do this (not necessarily using any of the above indicators though) so I know it is possible...
Design a method between us.
The first thing is, it has to be simple, not use too many indicators,
Needs to take smallish targets, and needs to trade a few times a day but not excessively.
Using all the combined skill and intelligence of everyone here it should be possible to do something along those lines.
Can use MA, RSI, Stochastics, Candle patterns etc. or any other indicator needed.
Basically the idea is to put something together that can be used or taken away and modified, junked, improved, or even used. I'm sure it would help some here to do it and probably wouldn't hurt all...
Any takers?
Best Natalie
p.s. I already have methods that do this (not necessarily using any of the above indicators though) so I know it is possible...
Quote from Girlpower:
Moving this thread on, I want to propose a practical thing to do.
Design a method between us.
The first thing is, it has to be simple, not use too many indicators,
Needs to take smallish targets, and needs to trade a few times a day but not excessively.
Using all the combined skill and intelligence of everyone here it should be possible to do something along those lines.
Can use MA, RSI, Stochastics, Candle patterns etc. or any other indicator needed.
Basically the idea is to put something together that can be used or taken away and modified, junked, improved, or even used. I'm sure it would help some here to do it and probably wouldn't hurt all...
Any takers?
Best Natalie
p.s. I already have methods that do this (not necessarily using any of the above indicators though) so I know it is possible...
Here is a simple idea to get htings started.
Draw a line across the page at the open price i.e. 0930EST.
If the price runs above this line buy it with a small target and equivalent stop, below do the same.
Repeat the exercise by redrawing the line every 60 mins... (or 30 mins if you wish)
Basically playing out of price levels with the flow...
If a trend can be identified at the lines subsequent lines, go with the trend picking off the small target as before.
This is not tested and just a quick thought from looking through a couple of days of charts...
Best
Natalie
Basically the idea is to put something together that can be used or taken away and modified, junked, improved, or even used. I'm sure it would help some here to do it and probably wouldn't hurt all...
Any takers?
Hi Natalie,
I've already shown an example day of chipping. Yes, it was my best day ever at this style of play. Last night I received a PM requesting a look at my screens. As there has already been a small sidebar discussion about privacy of information I don't think it necessary to either post or transmit my screens by e-mail to anyone. I did, however, learn this technique from a fellow trader and he has made his variation of the technique public information. Below is copied the technique of Alexander Mackintosh II:
"The Chip - By Sandy Mack
Everyone knows the Market dictum, âBuy low, sell highâ, but I hadn't consciously considered until this morning (was that you, Jules, with the real estate past?) that, in the process of making money in the Market, it is the entry point of a trade that is absolutely of paramount importance in determining the success of that trade. âWell, duh!â, you might sayâ¦but how many of us merely go for âsome pointâ during a pullback as opposed to aiming for the bottom of that pullback?â¦and if you can hit the bottom, how much easier is it to set a tighter stop that won't get taken out by a continuing fall in price?â¦and if you get that bottom price, how much easier is it to find a profitable exit point?
Before I continue, let me qualify a few things. First, my favored trading style is chippingâ¦a quick in-and-out for ¼, ½, or whatever comes from a lucky run once I'm in so long as I can close the trade that day. I know that's not for everyone, but what follows is applicable for all DT and ST styles. Second, I'm still very new to direct access trading and what I'm about to cover may just be âold hatâ for most everyone. I do know, though, that I wasn't able to do it through a Web-based OLB due to the time required to place an order, so be kind in your criticism and your ridicule. Third, I've been using this technique for only 4 days and maybe I've just been luckyâ¦but even today, when the Naz was down ~97 points, I was still 7-for-8 in all-long tech trades. Finally, this is one man's style, one man's opinionâ¦not necessarily recommended for everyone, or anyone. Treat it merely as a âcase historyâ, though that's probably glamorizing it way beyond its merit.
Okayâ¦some background. One of my favorite tools has always been myTrack's the id âDynamic AIQâ chart, and my technical indicators of choice are volume, Obv, money flow, stochastics, ADX, Bollinger bands and RSI. Don't ask me what they all mean, or how the relative lines are derivedâ¦I just know that âupâ is good and âdownâ is bad, and I don't rely on any one indicator. I review them all, all the time. Well, last week while monitoring one of myTrack's chat rooms, I followed a discussion that keyed on the use of another indicatorâ¦one that I had never invoked: MACD. Again, I have no idea how the line is calculated, but allow me to describe a typical scenarioâ¦one that I have played out at least 2 dozen times in the past week and almost always with success.
The first step is to find a stock that is in decline, or a pullback to whatever degree. With L2 and the AIQ chart on the screen, my attention is on the MACD line as it declines. When it crosses zero into negative numbers, close attention is paid to its bottoming, or even a slight upturn. Sometimes other indicators will mimic MACDA, but not always. I've seen the mf turn up way in advance, for example, or continue to fall long after MACD has turned. Anyway, as MACD bottoms, or starts back up, my eye goes to L2 to watch for a shift in the rotation from clockwise to counter-clockwise. This is usually marked in advance when the MMs names (in myTrack) start turning from red to greenâ¦and the process can happen in a few short seconds, or take several minutes depending on the volume. First, a preponderance of redâ¦patience, patienceâ¦then, more greens 'til they're about evenly splitâ¦more patience, and keeping an eye in the MACD to see that it's still up, or at the very least, flatâ¦then, a preponderance of greenâ¦and at that point I slam in an order at the inside bid!â¦and now the counter-clockwise rotation is clearly evident. Thankfully, myTrack diverts orders to NITE (my default), or the Island who are almost always on the inside bid and my order is filled immediately. I then place the stop loss, usually 1-3 teenies below my buy pointâ¦and I sit back to watch the numbers go up. By now, all the indicators are looking âgoodââ¦assurance that I have, indeed, found the bottom and have only a rise to come. If, however, other indicators are contradictory, coupled with the price perhaps not doing as planned, I cancel the stop and slam a sell at the inside askâ¦just getting out to break evenâ¦but that has happened only once so far and I still made a teeny on the deal. Mostly, the price rises and I raise my stops accordinglyâ¦and keep doing so until I'm stopped out with a neat and tidy ¼, ½, or maybe even a whole apple to show for it.
Like I said, this isn't everyone's style, nor should it be. You've got to play in a fashion that's comfortable for youâ¦this just happens to be it for me. One of these days I'm sure to get in at the bottom of a long runâ¦until then, I'll be just be happy to be on the plus side of my trades."
Bruce
Any takers?
Hi Natalie,
I've already shown an example day of chipping. Yes, it was my best day ever at this style of play. Last night I received a PM requesting a look at my screens. As there has already been a small sidebar discussion about privacy of information I don't think it necessary to either post or transmit my screens by e-mail to anyone. I did, however, learn this technique from a fellow trader and he has made his variation of the technique public information. Below is copied the technique of Alexander Mackintosh II:
"The Chip - By Sandy Mack
Everyone knows the Market dictum, âBuy low, sell highâ, but I hadn't consciously considered until this morning (was that you, Jules, with the real estate past?) that, in the process of making money in the Market, it is the entry point of a trade that is absolutely of paramount importance in determining the success of that trade. âWell, duh!â, you might sayâ¦but how many of us merely go for âsome pointâ during a pullback as opposed to aiming for the bottom of that pullback?â¦and if you can hit the bottom, how much easier is it to set a tighter stop that won't get taken out by a continuing fall in price?â¦and if you get that bottom price, how much easier is it to find a profitable exit point?
Before I continue, let me qualify a few things. First, my favored trading style is chippingâ¦a quick in-and-out for ¼, ½, or whatever comes from a lucky run once I'm in so long as I can close the trade that day. I know that's not for everyone, but what follows is applicable for all DT and ST styles. Second, I'm still very new to direct access trading and what I'm about to cover may just be âold hatâ for most everyone. I do know, though, that I wasn't able to do it through a Web-based OLB due to the time required to place an order, so be kind in your criticism and your ridicule. Third, I've been using this technique for only 4 days and maybe I've just been luckyâ¦but even today, when the Naz was down ~97 points, I was still 7-for-8 in all-long tech trades. Finally, this is one man's style, one man's opinionâ¦not necessarily recommended for everyone, or anyone. Treat it merely as a âcase historyâ, though that's probably glamorizing it way beyond its merit.
Okayâ¦some background. One of my favorite tools has always been myTrack's the id âDynamic AIQâ chart, and my technical indicators of choice are volume, Obv, money flow, stochastics, ADX, Bollinger bands and RSI. Don't ask me what they all mean, or how the relative lines are derivedâ¦I just know that âupâ is good and âdownâ is bad, and I don't rely on any one indicator. I review them all, all the time. Well, last week while monitoring one of myTrack's chat rooms, I followed a discussion that keyed on the use of another indicatorâ¦one that I had never invoked: MACD. Again, I have no idea how the line is calculated, but allow me to describe a typical scenarioâ¦one that I have played out at least 2 dozen times in the past week and almost always with success.
The first step is to find a stock that is in decline, or a pullback to whatever degree. With L2 and the AIQ chart on the screen, my attention is on the MACD line as it declines. When it crosses zero into negative numbers, close attention is paid to its bottoming, or even a slight upturn. Sometimes other indicators will mimic MACDA, but not always. I've seen the mf turn up way in advance, for example, or continue to fall long after MACD has turned. Anyway, as MACD bottoms, or starts back up, my eye goes to L2 to watch for a shift in the rotation from clockwise to counter-clockwise. This is usually marked in advance when the MMs names (in myTrack) start turning from red to greenâ¦and the process can happen in a few short seconds, or take several minutes depending on the volume. First, a preponderance of redâ¦patience, patienceâ¦then, more greens 'til they're about evenly splitâ¦more patience, and keeping an eye in the MACD to see that it's still up, or at the very least, flatâ¦then, a preponderance of greenâ¦and at that point I slam in an order at the inside bid!â¦and now the counter-clockwise rotation is clearly evident. Thankfully, myTrack diverts orders to NITE (my default), or the Island who are almost always on the inside bid and my order is filled immediately. I then place the stop loss, usually 1-3 teenies below my buy pointâ¦and I sit back to watch the numbers go up. By now, all the indicators are looking âgoodââ¦assurance that I have, indeed, found the bottom and have only a rise to come. If, however, other indicators are contradictory, coupled with the price perhaps not doing as planned, I cancel the stop and slam a sell at the inside askâ¦just getting out to break evenâ¦but that has happened only once so far and I still made a teeny on the deal. Mostly, the price rises and I raise my stops accordinglyâ¦and keep doing so until I'm stopped out with a neat and tidy ¼, ½, or maybe even a whole apple to show for it.
Like I said, this isn't everyone's style, nor should it be. You've got to play in a fashion that's comfortable for youâ¦this just happens to be it for me. One of these days I'm sure to get in at the bottom of a long runâ¦until then, I'll be just be happy to be on the plus side of my trades."
Bruce
Hi Bruce
Many thanks for that contribution. I was not expecting people to post something they already trade, but rather to work on something different and so think outside the box so to speak. I think it is very good that you have posted a variation of what you do trade, and should not post the screenshots as you say.
again many thanks.
Best regards
Natalie
I looked at a few journals and the YM is a place to consider for a lot of basic reasons. I thing it would neutralize a lot of the rifts here too because of the change of scenery.
I don't think we should start with a target daily performance. ITHe performanece is automatically going to improve within 30 days and that will be a nice "push" that is automatic.
Before we start I recommend that we set up a format for reporting results. I recommend that it be financial as well.
I have a Tv session coming up for CERT documentary by one of the channels..Fun and games
I will come back later today.