Market makers threaten to cut me off?

Quote from niceneasy:

if you are routing through a mm and cancelling orders all day - they will get pissed.... remember they are taking the opposite of side of your trade no questions asked .....
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and how exactly do u route directly to mms, for example on the qqqq[?]
 
Quote from Don Bright:

I agree...your broker is the one who doesn't like it (for some odd reason)...need to know more. Who the broker is, and how exactly are you routing? NYSE stocks or just Naz.?

Don
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I'm with RML Trading. Everything has been going well until this issue came up.

I am trading both listed and OTC stocks. In the software I can select either ECNs or MM to send my market orders to. Since I want to avoid the ECN fees I usually route to one of the MMs that does not charge a routing fee. This apparently is causing the problem, according to the broker.

Is it true MMs don't like order flow from day traders?
All my orders are just simple plain market orders. typically 1000- 3000 shares per trade.
 
Quote from niceneasy:

if you are routing through a mm and cancelling orders all day - they will get pissed.... remember they are taking the opposite of side of your trade no questions asked .....
More...

I never cancel any orders. I just send them market orders and take whatever the fill they get me. We are talking about only 20 orders a day.

I'm just trying to make sense out of this.
 
Quote from NanoTick:

I'm with RML Trading. Everything has been going well until this issue came up.

I am trading both listed and OTC stocks. In the software I can select either ECNs or MM to send my market orders to. Since I want to avoid the ECN fees I usually route to one of the MMs that does not charge a routing fee. This apparently is causing the problem, according to the broker.

Is it true MMs don't like order flow from day traders?
All my orders are just simple plain market orders. typically 1000- 3000 shares per trade.
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BINGO!

"I am trading both listed and OTC stocks." <----OTC
:p

Bid whack'n

limit buy/cancel/modify *repeat* reverse *repeat......
 
nano tick as i explained you must be rapid firing some of the orders? if you threw in a market order every 30 minutes nobody would say a word i promise you.and you have to be keying on 1 stock. believe me it's not the broker complaining as he's making commissions and order flow payment. there's something you're not saying as for how you're trading with only 20 orders per day and 1-3k makes no sense why they'd be screwing with you. YOU HAVE TO BE RAPID FIRING YOUR ORDERS ON ONE STOCK TO CAUSE ANY UP ROAR. also what i don't understand is the mm should love you. on 1 k or more orders you're not getting autoexecution fills so the market maker has to be holding many of your orders for 90 seconds and killing you. why would you throw amrket orders of 3k shares in? i'm enver heard any exp trader doing this as they'll screw you to death
 
Quote from brandon12:

nano tick as i explained you must be rapid firing some of the orders? if you threw in a market order every 30 minutes nobody would say a word i promise you.and you have to be keying on 1 stock. believe me it's not the broker complaining as he's making commissions and order flow payment. there's something you're not saying as for how you're trading with only 20 orders per day and 1-3k makes no sense why they'd be screwing with you. YOU HAVE TO BE RAPID FIRING YOUR ORDERS ON ONE STOCK TO CAUSE ANY UP ROAR. also what i don't understand is the mm should love you. on 1 k or more orders you're not getting autoexecution fills so the market maker has to be holding many of your orders for 90 seconds and killing you. why would you throw amrket orders of 3k shares in? i'm enver heard any exp trader doing this as they'll screw you to death
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No, my orders are sent about every 10-15 min (on average), and I rarely trade a stock more than once a day.
 
Quote from NanoTick:

I have been with a direct access firm for a while. I am strictly day trading (large caps, about 20 trades per day). Most of my trades are market orders and routed to several market makers. I do this mainly to avoid ECN fees and also get better fills. Limit orders is not an option for my method, so I can't trade for rebate. Everything has been fine (profitable). Recently, the firm informed me that the MMs are complaining about my "abusive" use of the routing and threatening to cut me off. The firm explains that MMs in general don't like day trading order flow. Here are my questions:

1. Has anyone run into this type of problems before?
2. Why MMs don't like day traders? All my orders are market orders and they should make plenty of spread out of me.
3. I initially came to this direct access firm for its low commision, now I figure if I'm forced to use ECNs for my market orders, the fees plus commision is actually much higher than most discount brokers, so does it even make sense to saty with this firm?
4. Could I run into the same problem with a non-direct broker (like Ameritrade, Scott..)?

Any feedbacks are appreciated.
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Change brokers. No, that doesn't happen. Brokers welcome active and over hyper traders. They want you to trade. The more you trade, the more money they make. It doesn't sound you are using a direct access broker. Especially since you are talking about Scott trade and Ameritrade. They aren't even in the same ballpark as direct access.
 
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