Mark Douglas

Quote from TSGannGalt:

Well...

Look at this way. Let's say you have a strategy or trading style that doesn't work. You may be psychologically "optimal" towards trading, but you would eventually lose in the long run... As an example, Try making a living as a professional gambler in a casino. You wouldn't be doing it if there is no edge, you wouldn't just go into a casino playing under their edge and expect to make a living out of it.

Now, there's an issue about identifying a profitable strategy. In my opinion, again... OPINION, it comes from knowledge and experience. Are knowledge and experience, psychological aspects??? Rather debatable but my OPINION is, it's not psychological.

....

Re-mentioning what I've written above, it's not all of what makes a trader profitable. It's just part of it and blindly concluding that trading is psychological is immature.

Personally, I've also gone through all of what is mentioned here. I bought all of Van Tharp's courses that was available back then, read Mark Douglass' books, gone through psycho-analysis books like Freud, Lacan, Derrida, Jung and NLP material. Eventually, it really didn't do much help as a trader.

It was good to know as an individual but eventually you trade the market. Even with all the materials I've gone through, it didn't change who I was. Studying the market and actually trading them was what eventually made me profitable.

Though, one good thing about all these "psychological material" is that you can look back at these and say "This is where I am at..." or "Ahhh... this is what xxxxx was talking about...". Eventually, you have to reach that point to actually relate to the material. Simply, a qualia issue. (You may know how a apple tastes like but you have to eat it to "really know" how it tastes)

One question I can give is:

Aren't you looking for what works in the market, rather than learning about the market?
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If your trading is "psychologically" optimal you should break even at worst. If your method is much worse than random it shouldn't be a problem to reverse order of things.
Trading methologically is basically correct way to trade and I think it's a matter of psychology primarely.IMO
 
Quote from Cesko:

If your trading is "psychologically" optimal you should break even at worst. If your method is much worse than random it shouldn't be a problem to reverse order of things.
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Would you mind elaborating on this in detail?
 
Quote from Cesko:

If your trading is "psychologically" optimal you should break even at worst. If your method is much worse than random it shouldn't be a problem to reverse order of things.
More...

Very well stated, Cesko.

And, I believe very true. In my opinion, emotional control (psychology) is more important to success than the system.

I can give a system I use, which I know is profitable, to a trader who does not have emotional control and he will lose day after day.

Trading in the Zone is required reading for any trader I work with.

Nutsneal
 
Quote from NUTSNEAL:

Very well stated, Cesko.

And, I believe very true. In my opinion, emotional control (psychology) is more important to success than the system.

I can give a system I use, which I know is profitable, to a trader who does not have emotional control and he will lose day after day.

Trading in the Zone is required reading for any trader I work with.

Nutsneal
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If you had a system, in which you know is profitable, wouldn't you automate it?

:D
 
Quote from TSGannGalt:

If you had a system, in which you know is profitable, wouldn't you automate it?

:D
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Too much discretion (and emotional control) involved.:D :D
 
i recommend his first book, The Disciplined Trader. take your time reading it, and you will enjoy it and benefit from it. no book will turn your trading around, but it doesn't mean it doesn't have a lot of value.

Trading in the Zone is mostly hype imho, but if you have the time and energy, it won't hurt you either.

other than that, here are links to 2 audio lectures with Mark Douglas. i didn't listen to them yet, but you might wanna try:

http://www.woodiescciclub.com/Lectures/mark-douglas/index.htm
http://www.woodiescciclub.com/Lectures/mark-douglas/august-2005.htm
 
Quote from TSGannGalt:

[
Aren't you looking for what works in the market, rather than learning about the market? [/B]
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as a rookie, the above gives me much to think about

thanks
 
Quote from TSGannGalt:

Would you mind elaborating on this in detail?
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If after the fact your trading results seem much worse than random( 70-80% of losses,much larger losses than profits etc.) it is not so much error of judgement during entering the trade as it is the result of bad management (where psychology plays huge role).
For example, if 70-80% of trades result in loss you can imrove result by tweaking exits not entries.
Put it another way how can you hope to get substantial mathematical advantage over others nowadays when huge computing power is available to everybody?
 
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