Managing Mind/Body

Kindly explain to me EXACTLY what is real/physical in trading that allows me to build on kinesthetic experiences like learning to ride a bike or hit a ball. The only physical thing I do is punch T. I could be an immobile quadraplegic entering trades by squeezing a pneumatic bulb stuck up my ass. Otherwise it's all in my HEAD!

Also, you said you weren't going to talk about YOUR strategy. What is this?:

"we slog along working on channel drawing and extending. doing trverses to form them. Getting points 1,2,3 down (cold). At some point they are in our minds. At some points we see enough price bars hit and bounce off channels. we see the channels are "inside' and other spaces are "outside""
 
Quote from Roanoke:

Those were answers? I see that you decline to be drawn into a meaningful debate. My remarks were totally relevant because this is all about YOU, and I have read everything you have ever posted here. In fact, I know some of it better than you do, because you make it up as you go, and conveniently forget what you have changed. You sneaked into NLP and now you won't follow through. You denigrate edge trading, but admit that SCT is a collection of edges, and yet you fail to see the illogic of the two positions. You profess to be attuned to the needs of individual traders, but you sell them a one-size-fits-all strategy. As to your comments on my trading approach, you have no idea what it is because I haven't shared it.
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I will not be commenting on your trading approach. You PM'ed something to me once, though.

Certainly you are tops in what you do.

Actually SCT is a continuum. As you get to the limit, the pieces disappear.

Somehow you have the inncorrect idea that I deal with "one size fits all". I am suggesting that there are many ways that I find very workable. Most people use segmented accounts and multiple accounts. I am one of those. Most successful traders use avariety of methods depending upon the app of cap.
 
Also, Jack, let's cut the surreptitious NLP crap. "Chunking" is an NLP term. Credit it, or don't use it. People need to know that your subcontext is NLP. But be assured that if you use it, you had better get it right.
 
Quote from Cassandra:

Jack, just one little admonition. Re "getting posts dumped", unless you are a Coinz, that just doesn't happen here because it's all fodder for the psych cannon, grist for the auto-analytic mill. I advise you to put all detractors on "ignore" so that everyone else can enjoy them but you won't be distracted. And do kindly look up the word "hubris."
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The thread initiator is going to do the dumping in concert with the moderator if he is responsive.

As you see there is mostly crap here from detractors such as yourself.

This means that I will have to sort through the post I make and those of contributors and redo it into a final rewrite after three edits. When that is done, then it will be estremely helpful to people that are on their personal paths to excellence.

The example of hitting a baseball just shows that this is unfamiliar territory to those that has no psych reading background. i know know that it will be difficult for mostly anyone to use this thread without going to ground zero on how mental processes work.

Most people have passing understandings of this stuff. Roanoke and others do not, it turns out.

I thing I will start with "the stress response" since a lot of people don't have that understood either.

We will wind up mentally trading in the zone as sports people do sports in the zone. Just as there are many sports to zone out with anyone can use their personal method to zone with it.

Google me on the subject of organic farming.
 
Quote from Duref Mudgins:

Also, Jack, let's cut the surreptitious NLP crap. "Chunking" is an NLP term. Credit it, or don't use it. People need to know that your subcontext is NLP. But be assured that if you use it, you had better get it right.
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You missed. lol Try A.C Aitken and "working memory".

This is not NLP; you are screwing up.

The brain and its care is the topic primarily. We are just going to be getting the potential of people way up there to get the job done.

To further to get you straight: Think in a biological and biochemical context and a compiling context and "greasing" the synapse ops.

Let roanoke use the S word; being a copy cat is same old same old for you.

The way it turns out when it comes to getting it and getting it right; I am the leading person and you just, as usual, play catch up or shadow box.

We have two tasks here; let me intorduce you to them right off:

to put mind over matter

and

to put matter over mind.

Each according to the need that arises. This is going to be arranged to deal with advancement of expertise just as much as dealing with the baggage lousy traders have. Lousy traders make good examples of what can go wrong in the mind and in the brain (matter).
 
As is the norm with your teasing non-references to yourself over the years, searching on "jack hershey" and "organic farming" yields absolutely nothing. Sort of like your books. "Kokomo and Bogart" works great though, as do other family references which I will not violate your privacy to cite. Care to provide a more specific reference to your organic greatness? Or was your work primarily in fertilizers, like bullshit?
 
There are 2500 references to chunking and NLP, but only one for chunking and Alexander Aitkin, which nonetheless I thank you for the reference. Chunking appears very early in the NLP literature, and that's where you got it. You may not be able to remember it, however, as that was forty years ago.
 
Quote from Joe Doaks:

Jack, I find your fight or flee reference emotionally appealing, but I don't intellectually grasp its relevance to trading. If I flee, I don't trade. If I fight, well, we all know where that leads (Don't fight the tape, don't try to get even, etc.).
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Okay this is the segway into how an expert uses his mind and, in contrast, how someone works who does not have either skills, a plan, or and approach for trading going for him.

Think of a scalor arrangement of the best to the worst of traders and their trading.

At some point there is a line where on one side people get better and on the other side they get worse.

The line is often crossed either way by some outside happening or support or a failure of some sort.

Say there was a loser and he got some support in trading, if he were not in shape in the mind/body areas his ship still might not come in. That is because of "fight or flee" or what is called "the stress response". The stress response is trying to dissable him and dissconnect him from his failure in trading. his survival system is trying to take him away from trading completely by dissabling him permanently

The ancient physical stimulus to flee a tiger is still with us. I plan on doing a step by step on it to make people conscious of how it works for tigers and for repeated failure.

If you keep screwing up trading, your body is being told to leave the scene.

I will use a snake in my example in a while. The "snake" could be any threat actually. In another thread the snake is the first retrace after an equity BO for a specific person who is freaked out by it.

We need to understand how the stress response works.

We need to understand how various trading tools eliminate the possibility of the stress response and, in contrast, how other trading tools really bring on the stress response.

We need to see how people can get "stuck" because they are trapped in how they try to avoid the stress response.

There are many activities that ameliorate trading problems. Any trading problem can be coupled to stress fairly easily. People in ET often pose Q's on "What to do....after.... this or that. (think of 100 negatives to fill in).

So inherently from our past we have mechanisms that go into effect to help us survive.

By learning about how everything works, we get to change how it works and we get to channel the biochemistry in the better way to actually enhance our performance.

It turns out that, some folks are already requesting help in getting the authoritative basis for what they are learning here and trying to fight about. That will upgrade their challenges they face here to outdo what is on the table. It is a win win for us all . I will do some "fight fair" psychological sessions with them on the side.

The choice you mention about fighting with the market, we handle by another topic. We will be using music related analogies to see two areas. How the mind can engage constructively and harmoniously and also how listening and doing music is an extremely good way to move to higher ground in mental processing.

My overall statment was to bound the topic. That is not done well it turns out since some thought the main topics were OT and they insisted on faulting me for what I said the topics are. We couldn't even "chunk' without a misguided and mistaken response.

The stress response ultimately centers on both mind over matter and matter over mind. We need to arrest the stress response when it is there. Besides good trading, we will get the neocortex to talk sense to the limbic system. And we will be doing the matter over mind work of biochemically manipulating the endocrine system and our brains. If you practice any Native American health practices where you "listen" to your body to see how it is doing, you will find that helpful too.

The neocortex is a 2 1/2 foot square thin membrane over our chemical supply system that supports it's activety and functions.. We will be keeping the tanks full of everything we need to keep things in balance and plentiful. By not draining away stuff unnecessarily we become more efficient as well.

The excitement of trading is somewhat like the stress response. it is great to enjoy the excitement but we need to "waste" the surplus of biochemicals that we generate having successes too. It turns out we can kill two birds with one stone by using the same "warm down" for both the excitement of success as the stress response. Taking a jog and listening to your walkman is an easy solution after trading it turns out. To warm up, among other things, we can have a cup of coffee. The preflight check, you will find, is something that allows you to drop into the zone as well.
 
Quote from Duref Mudgins:

Excuse me, sir, but you ARE in the Psych Forum. We are not idiots here, like you may be accustomed to elsewhere. Fight/flight is a polarity response. Read your Virginia Satir. It is a subset of the cool/hot polarity, namely on the hot side. Many people, most notably technical people like engineers, programmers, scientists, and accountants (Asperger's Syndrome sufferers, in the main) are able to engage a cool side response to threat. ("I wanna go! Go cool! I wanna bust! Bust cool") They get analytical, become stalkers, invoke the killer instinct (the majority are in fact gun nuts). When they are stressed, they neither fight no flee: they become coolly obsessed with psyching out the opponent, outwaiting him, outwitting him, and finally, attacking him from the dark, killing him. These are the traders who know when the smart money is net long in a down market, and where, and needs to get short, and knows how. Another interesting polarity is sadism/masochism. Look for a current example in the strategy thread.
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This BS is a great example of NOT fight or flee. It is BS anyway so lets hope we get to be able to recognize it right off and not deal with it. All you see here is comic book strategy stuff and not the combo of mind over matter and matter over mind.

I do not expect a moderator to catch on to this but it is an example of trying too hard.
 
Quote from Duref Mudgins:

Kindly explain to me EXACTLY what is real/physical in trading that allows me to build on kinesthetic experiences like learning to ride a bike or hit a ball. The only physical thing I do is punch T. I could be an immobile quadraplegic entering trades by squeezing a pneumatic bulb stuck up my ass. Otherwise it's all in my HEAD!

You don't get it. Don't worry for a while. Maybe you will recognize in a while that you punch T like you lean to the left on your bike. When you figure out the process of how it works to leanto the left, you will also catch on to what happened to cause you to punch T. Hint: it was a sensory stimulation. Maybe in both cases you hear something. More likely it was something you saw with your eyes. I know you can orient here and begin to catch on. "muscle memory" is a broad term. Pretend you are Dustin Hoffman in Rain Man and mimic him watching the trading screen. how does dustin do tooth picks, How does dustin do card counts? Look in a book if you have one: cerebellum. For sure dustin is going to see the trade well before you ever will. This is not true false or multiple choice. You have to get with it and begin to think a little. We are thinking about thinking. And you are thinking about getting attention as usual.

Also, you said you weren't going to talk about YOUR strategy. What is this?:

"we slog along working on channel drawing and extending. doing trverses to form them. Getting points 1,2,3 down (cold). At some point they are in our minds. At some points we see enough price bars hit and bounce off channels. we see the channels are "inside' and other spaces are "outside""

This is a description of a learning process. this is a mental process that people go through. I posted it to show the precursor mental processes (once over lightly) so I could make the points that you read that followed it.

Heres what you do. Write something in the space instead and use that. Then if the segway to the remainder of the example is strange adjust the segway,etc, etc...this is not rocket science
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Some people have chatted about the psychology forum and it's ways. They may be referring to your BS. BS away but when you do not get a response from me, just look for BS from your buddies it will keep you happy.

I am not going to point out the little games anymore. Get over playing dumb and the AGM's.
 
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