Made a lot of progress, but feel like there's so much more to go...

[trader99]

You're welcome. I find it interesting how you look at all this because if I were you, I would look at it differently. Yes, that money is gone, but what would it have really done for you if you never learned to trade? Money parked in a bank is always good, but if you will truly be able to now replace income from a corporate job year after year, that money was well spent.

You said it above, time seems to be your most precious resource. Even if trading provided less income overall, but gives you the flexibility to be home and work on your business when you feel like it, is this not a fair exchange? Seriously, if I could choose making 200k and having to go to the office every day, vs. 100k and working at home a few hours and then doing whatever I wanted to do, the choice would be easy.

Another thought. None of these corporate jobs are safe. You can go from 200k or more per year, to nothing but a severance package that will run out. Sure, trading can also put you out of business, but in my opinion, those that didn't survive the transition when HFT came along never really knew how to trade in the first place. I think being a trader at home who is good is a little more future proof than any corporate job. So in many ways, going the route of trading at home and making it work is the smarter choice, in my opinion of course.

If you get sick in 5 years, and all you've done is slave away for 5 years since today and have a nice bank account but no more time, how will you feel? If you instead lived a decade in those 5 years, since you never had to actually show up for a job every day, you will perhaps feel that you accomplished more, for yourself and your kids.

Most people look towards retirement because they hate their job but need the money, and hence can't wait to retire. They of course need to make enough because after they retire, generating income will be limited. A trader never needs to retire. Its not one of those jobs you hate going to, and its not one of those jobs where after 60, your body just can't do it anymore. All that money lost will mean nothing if you're generating $250 per day, or $500 per day, or whatever you deem acceptable and can continue to generate.

I think if you combine this with your consulting business, you've got a nice dual income which back each other up, and your lifestyle should greatly improve as well.

This is just how I see it.

You've made many good points. Very well thought out. All of what you've said is true.

I'm still debating the merits of each path and weighing the options.
========================
Path 1: Go back to Corporate America
========================
Pros: $150K-$200K, benefits, insurances, bonuses, and continue to develop marketable skills. All good. But there's a cap. Unless I'm in Silicon Valley(Bay Area), I will probably max out at $250K, which is good for my geographical region. Even though I get recruiters' calls from SV every day, I just say NO because SV is too expensive to live. SV tech people can get way way higher than these numbers.

Cons: Back to the grind. Stressful. Potentially leaving little time for trading.

========================================
Path 2: Go Entrepreneurial - Combo of consulting biz + trading
========================================
Pros: Lots of time flexibility. Continue to hone my skills as a trader. I'm getting better and better every day now. I'm actually seeing real results. And if my biz takes off and my trading takes off then it's SUPER AWESOME! Time freedom. Financial Freedom. Flexibility. And the earnings potential is unlimited. $1K a day is over $200K a year assuming I can keep up that pace. And as my skills get better I can just scale that up to $2K a day to $5K a day. $4K-$5K a day is a $1M a year. That would be sweet.

Cons: Uncertain income stream. I might lose everything(unlikely now that I'm a more developed trader with better risk management). Or more realistically, I will not lose much money but wouldn't make much either. I got mortgage and family and the stress of making money every day might make me a less calm trader.
========================================
Path 3: BOTH. Corporate Job + trading on the side
========================================
Pros: Get guaranteed income stream and benefits. Get a kicker bonus from trading income. And when my trading hits a slump I will not panic because my salary will more than cover everything. So less stress with money. More clear headed when trading. Having the best of both worlds. I figure if I suck it up and work like a dog for the next 5 years then I would have more than paid back my losses and have a nice savings built up both in terms of nest egg and trading stake.

Cons: I can only trade probably early mornings or late nights. Or have to develop a swing trading methodology. Also, I'll be superbusy and always on. High power tech jobs are time consuming. Plus trading. Plus family.

In the next month or so I'll decide which of these 3 paths to take...

 

[JSOP]

You've made many good points. Very well thought out. All of what you've said is true.

I'm still debating the merits of each path and weighing the options.
========================
Path 1: Go back to Corporate America
========================
Pros: $150K-$200K, benefits, insurances, bonuses, and continue to develop marketable skills. All good. But there's a cap. Unless I'm in Silicon Valley(Bay Area), I will probably max out at $250K, which is good for my geographical region. Even though I get recruiters' calls from SV every day, I just say NO because SV is too expensive to live.

Cons: Back to the grind. Stressful. Potentially leaving little time for trading.

========================================
Path 2: Go Entrepreneurial - Combo of consulting biz + trading
========================================
Pros: Lots of time flexibility. Continue to hone my skills as a trader. I'm getting better and better every day now. I'm actually seeing real results. And if my biz takes off and my trading takes off then it's SUPER AWESOME! Time freedom. Financial Freedom. Flexibility. And the earnings potential is unlimited. $1K a day is over $200K a year assuming I can keep up that pace. And as my skills get better I can just scale that up to $2K a day to $5K a day. $4KK-$5K a day is a $1M a year. That would be sweet.

Cons: Uncertain income stream. I might lose everything(unlikely now that I'm a more developed trader with better risk management). Or more realistically, I will not lose much money but wouldn't make much either. I got mortgage and family and the stress of making money every day might make me a less calm trader.
========================================
Path 3: BOTH. Corporate Job + trading on the side
========================================
Pros: Get guaranteed income stream and benefits. Get a kicker bonus from trading income. And when my trading hits a slump I will not panic because my salary will more than cover everything. So less stress with money. More clear headed when trading. Having the best of both worlds. I figure if I suck it up and work like a dog for the next 5 years then I would have more than paid back my losses and have a nice savings built up both in terms of nest egg and trading stake.

Cons: I can only trade probably early mornings or late nights. Or have to develop a swing trading methodology. Also, I'll be superbusy and always on. High power tech jobs are time consuming. Plus trading. Plus family.

In the next month or so I'll decide which of these 3 paths to take...

I think you should start with Path 3 while you are still improving your trading and then eventually go to Path 2 or Path 4: Trading alone with total freedom once your trading skill has been perfected and can bring you consistent and sizeable income. There are securities you can trade off-hours. Many traders do that and they become very successful at it.

 

[trader99]

I think you should start with Path 3 while you are still improving your trading and then eventually go to Path 2 or Path 4: Trading alone with total freedom once your trading skill has been perfected can bring you consistent and sizeable income. There are securities you can trade off-hours. Many traders do that and they become very successful at it.

I agreed. I'm on the improving trajectory in my trading. I'm not at master level yet. But I can generate a $1K here and there and occasionally multiple thousands in a trade. But I want the multiple thousands a day to be the norm.

If I go Path 3, then my family will feel more secured. And I can save up a nice nest egg and trading stake. With a bigger trading stake, I can easily generate multiple Ks a day. And less risk too.

Path 4 is a distinct possibility. But to do Path 4 I need to make about $5K a day on average to feel comfortable doing this path... I'm a ways from that path.

 

[JSOP]

I agreed. I'm on the improving trajectory in my trading. I'm not at master level yet. But I can generate a $1K here and there and occasionally multiple thousands in a trade. But I want the multiple thousands a day to be the norm.

If I go Path 3, then my family will feel more secured. And I can save up a nice nest egg and trading stake. With a bigger trading stake, I can easily generate multiple Ks a day. And less risk too.

Path 4 is a distinct possibility. But to do Path 4 I need to make about $5K a day on average to feel comfortable doing this path... I'm a ways from that path.

Starting with Path 3 is really the best because you have the best of both worlds. You have the financial security not just for you but your whole family (if you do have a family, remember the family is MOST important. It's the number 1 people that you have to make happy. And you need their support to help you make it in whatever path that you want to take) and the capital that you need to continue to improve your trading and not the emotional stress when losses happen. Yes it would be a hard path for you with you splitting in several different ways but then again all other paths are hard. Trading alone with no full-time job with the steady income for support is even harder and Trading + consulting business, TWO ventures with no steady income is going to be excruciating.

If you want the gain, you have to bite the bullet for the pain. It's only when you've endured pain and got what you need and succeeded, that's when paradise starts with Path 2 or Path 4. Trust me, you WILL get there. It might look impossible to you now but you will get there. We all have confidence in you.

 

[JSOP]

I believe I gave you that idea. Thanks for the credit. j/k
But at the very least I see you're learning something.
Here's another one. Loss money are only losses if you didn't learn anything from it.


Can you still go back to corporate? I'm under the impression that Corporate America wants young dumb college kids and not old middle aged men? The work force experience I have is once you've been out of the system for a few years, it can be tough to get back in.

Hey!! Long time no see!! How are you? Have you gone back to your ex-gf? LOL

 

[trader99]

If you want the gain, you have to bite the bullet for the pain. It's only when you've endured pain and got what you need and succeeded, that's when paradise starts with Path 2 or Path 4. Trust me, you WILL get there. It might look impossible to you now but you will get there. We all have confidence in you.

Thanks for the sage advice and vote of confidence!

It doesn't look impossible to me now. It's all about edge+ leverage ==> scale. Trading is a very scalable biz. The nice thing about scalable biz is once you have an edge you just have to leverage it up and scale it up.

I'm hoping in the next 5 years I will be regularlying making at least $5K/day on average or more. Hitting that goal will make me no longer wonder about opportunity cost. hehe.

I'll periodically check-in.

 

[JSOP]

Thanks for the sage advice and vote of confidence!

It doesn't look impossible to me now. It's all about edge+ leverage ==> scale. Trading is a very scalable biz. The nice thing about scalable biz is once you have an edge you just have to leverage it up and scale it up.

My apologies. I shouldn't say "it looks impossible to you now" but "a distant possibility to you now".

I'm hoping in the next 5 years I will be regularlying making at least $5K/day on average or more. Hitting that goal will make me no longer wonder about opportunity cost. hehe.

I'll periodically check-in.

I have no doubt you will make it, maybe in less than 5 years.

 

[Palindrome]

Probably because you're trying to "set the paramaters" for trades rather than let the market "talk to you". IOW, trying to "cherry pick what YOU want to see".... which is not what the market usually offers up.

There is enough profit potential and "action" in the stock indices for certain... and likely any of the larger markets... to keep your mind fully occupied.

To "follow 10 markets" with the expectation of playing them well is... well, ridiculous.

Well, that is your opinion. I've never met a trader in my life, or had any coaching. I average about 6% per month with a 4.5 Sharpe Ratio and my worst monthly draw down has been 2% in a month.

I'm following 10 markets, and my strategy works.

In my opinion there is no way for me to trade 1 market and make 6% per month, I guess my opinion is the opposite of yours.

 

[Scataphagos]

Well, that is your opinion. I've never met a trader in my life, or had any coaching. I average about 6% per month with a 4.5 Sharpe Ratio and my worst monthly draw down has been 2% in a month.

I'm following 10 markets, and my strategy works.

Well, that's impressive.

 

[TraderEX]

Act in a way that's best overall for your wife and child. The answer should be clear. If not, your selfish, or at least I was. Hope you decide well.