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Mac/refco Trading Services
- Thread starter apple69
- Start date
I thought Mac costs were lower than you state. The traders alliance thing is starting at 54 Euro cents per rt for Eurex which is 20 cents lower than Macs starting rate and 14c over exchange fee.
I heard Mac start at 70p for Liffe now which is 14p over exchange and the same as that offered by Trader Alliance.
As for desk fee I think Mac have it there as they are at 1300 for RefcoPro (Easyscreen) and charting/news whereas the alliance are 1300 with TT and no charting system which will add ~160 for esignal for example. I know that some people sling slave screens off one box and that cuts cost of charts/news. Anybody hear about Bluesystems hawking a charting package that does everything we need as locals for 50/month?
Guess with Fortis behind the alliance and Refco behind Mac they will be able to both get very competitive, over next weeks I suspect the best deals will become clear. Also think it good to bear in mind where the best long term deal will be as suspect short term reductions to appeal to short term thinkers, which includes most scalpers.
I heard Mac start at 70p for Liffe now which is 14p over exchange and the same as that offered by Trader Alliance.
As for desk fee I think Mac have it there as they are at 1300 for RefcoPro (Easyscreen) and charting/news whereas the alliance are 1300 with TT and no charting system which will add ~160 for esignal for example. I know that some people sling slave screens off one box and that cuts cost of charts/news. Anybody hear about Bluesystems hawking a charting package that does everything we need as locals for 50/month?
Guess with Fortis behind the alliance and Refco behind Mac they will be able to both get very competitive, over next weeks I suspect the best deals will become clear. Also think it good to bear in mind where the best long term deal will be as suspect short term reductions to appeal to short term thinkers, which includes most scalpers.
Eurex fees 20c
Per side (x2 for round trip)
0-10k .37c (ie 74 per roundrtrip first 5K roundtrips)
10-20k .33
20-30 .32
30-40 .30
40-50 .29
50+ .27
liffe .40 - .33
dax .67 - .57
eurostoxx .47-.37
Per side (x2 for round trip)
0-10k .37c (ie 74 per roundrtrip first 5K roundtrips)
10-20k .33
20-30 .32
30-40 .30
40-50 .29
50+ .27
liffe .40 - .33
dax .67 - .57
eurostoxx .47-.37
Now we are talking, if MAC's commissions are really that cheap and the desk fee is under £1500 per month it is worth taking a look. I did take a look at their office at the end of last year which did look great I must admit but I decided against it due to the money I could save else where on commissions.
It is about time we started getting something back from the clearers
It is about time we started getting something back from the clearers
The pricing does look attractive.
I'd be concerned about the lack of TT, but if the Pro product is being developed with feedback from traders then it has potential.
I'm wondering how much further development there will be of X-Trader with all the money Brumfield is piling into suing all and sundry.
TWalker - haven't heard anything from Bluesystems for ages - the product i remember was a total POS IMHO.
I'd be concerned about the lack of TT, but if the Pro product is being developed with feedback from traders then it has potential.
I'm wondering how much further development there will be of X-Trader with all the money Brumfield is piling into suing all and sundry.
TWalker - haven't heard anything from Bluesystems for ages - the product i remember was a total POS IMHO.
I think the software is all they have left, didn't their arcade venture fold when people realised they were holding onto rebates?
Somebody told me that they had seen the charting stuff a couple of weeks ago and that they were offering it to arcades.
As for costs seems Alliance is cheaper on Eurex at â¬0.27/side but more on Liffe at £0.35/side. Speaking to the chap running it however he was confident that it wouldn't take much volume b4 prices will go to â¬0.25 and £0.61 resp.
Somebody told me that they had seen the charting stuff a couple of weeks ago and that they were offering it to arcades.
As for costs seems Alliance is cheaper on Eurex at â¬0.27/side but more on Liffe at £0.35/side. Speaking to the chap running it however he was confident that it wouldn't take much volume b4 prices will go to â¬0.25 and £0.61 resp.
..Interesting, though they have to get the volume through the door in the first place of course. Are they only offering those rates to clients based in the new office, or to remote offices who clear through them as well?
Mac cutting their rates has left this finely poised - if Fortis have spent good money on building a new floor then they're gonna want to see some ROI - tricky if the customer base isn't there. Then again, the whole TT/Refco debacle couldn't have happened at a better time for them, if people leave Mac because they can't use TT.
Of course its about more than just rates - did they give you an idea of the trading/it/risk support teams (size/experience)? What about the US costs?
Mac cutting their rates has left this finely poised - if Fortis have spent good money on building a new floor then they're gonna want to see some ROI - tricky if the customer base isn't there. Then again, the whole TT/Refco debacle couldn't have happened at a better time for them, if people leave Mac because they can't use TT.
Of course its about more than just rates - did they give you an idea of the trading/it/risk support teams (size/experience)? What about the US costs?
did they give you an idea of the trading/it/risk support teams (size/experience)? What about the US costs?
The new office is just around the corner from Fortis and since the office is run by them the trading & IT support will be direct with onsite Fortis people. There is a large comms room and an office of about 20 desks which I was told was just for support. They have only kitted out one of the two floors with desks/chairs so far and there is an option to go into a glassed walled office of 4-6 desks or sit on the main floor. They told me that about 25-30 desks are already taken.
TradersAlliance are not related to Fortis but have structured a group deal to take space as and when required in the Fortis Space. I have been told that the alliance will also have their own risk manager/s as they will run an account structure like any normal arcade, which will allows them to set and monitor individual limits independently.
The independence thing also means that it is possible to negotiate rates and if unsatisfied go find another clearing company. This will provide leverage to get rates down as prices go up. Should work in the same way on the desk fee. The pro rata space deal appears to be only for the first space of 150 desks after which the alliance has to make a decision about whether to take on a term lease for more that would be on the second floor which is monstrous, must be 6000sqft, and currently empty.
Personally I like the idea and think it will ensure costs stay low across the board and self funded traders finally get to keep a much better share of their hard won profit. The person behind this Alliance thing seems very straight forward and professional, he runs his own grad sponsorship schemes which he is moving into the new office from day 1. Will try to get him on here so people can get any of the difficult questions answered and work out if it is a better deal or not.
I have said all I know about it - In a nutshell costs at start appear to be
Desk: £1300 incl PC, TT platform/or any other, 2 screens and VAT.
Charts/News: As requested and charged at cost which will be negotiated accordingly, currently aggressive esignal deal ~£150pcm incl. exchange fees. can also share 1 between a number of traders on slave screens.
Rates: Eurex â¬0.27/side
LIFFE £0.35/side
CME & CBOT I have not confirmed but think they are $0.07/side over exchange fee
Any other questions beyond this should be addressed to the website. If I find out more I will let you know.
Thanks for taking the time to write such a detailed reply. It certainly sounds interesting and as you say, more competition of this type can only improve the situation for the community as a whole.
If you can get the guy on here we can give him the old thumbscrews and bright lights treatment.
We certainly have come a long way in 6 years, much more of this and firms will start to look........professional.
If you can get the guy on here we can give him the old thumbscrews and bright lights treatment.
We certainly have come a long way in 6 years, much more of this and firms will start to look........professional.
Quote from twalker:
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The person behind this Alliance thing seems very straight forward and professional, he runs his own grad sponsorship schemes which he is moving into the new office from day 1. Will try to get him on here so people can get any of the difficult questions answered and work out if it is a better deal or not.
Is this SD?