Lots of HATE being spewed at the non-vaxxed... but ZERO stories as to "why" they refuse

[piezoe]

COVID-19 Natural immunity more effective than vaccine, research suggests
https://saraacarter.com/covid-19-natural-immunity-more-effective-than-vaccine-research-suggests/
According to the research reported reported in the Scientific American Thursday: “the natural immune protection that develops after a SARS-CoV-2 infection offers considerably more of a shield against the Delta variant of the pandemic coronavirus than two doses of the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine, according to a large Israeli study that some scientists wish came with a ‘Don’t try this at home’ label.”

“The newly released data show people who once had a SARS-CoV-2 infection were much less likely than vaccinated people to get Delta, develop symptoms from it, or become hospitalized with serious COVID-19,” the research stated.

According to the study “vaccinated individuals were 27 times more likely to get a symptomatic COVID infection than those with natural immunity from CO

"Sara Carter" ???

This is old news. I read the actual preprint some time ago and commented on it here. At the time I had not been critical enough of the study, and thought it looked fairly reasonable, After more thought I recognized a key failing in the study. And others have since pointed out other problems. If it ever gets by the reviewers please let me know, and I'll look at it again. Did it ever get by peer review?

Most people, including yourself I am quite sure, do not know that those who test positive by PCR may not be infected!

The only way to confirm infection, short of actual live culture (neither quick nor easy, so it isn't done) is via symptoms. See for example this study: https://doi.org/10.1016/j.e... which shows that both natural immunity and that conferred by m-RNA vaccination both give excellent protection against serve disease from subsequent Covid infection.

Regarding the Article, here are my brief comments and those of others:

The Corona Committee in Israel show research on recovered patients vs. vaccinated here:https://www.gov.il/BlobFold...

This shows patients who recovered between Dec 2020-April 2021 had a 0.43% reinfection rate with 9 (0.0049%) sever cases.

The baseline of persons vaccinated in Feb 2021 was 2.12% infection rate and 0.0132% serious cases.

This data is in line with other professionally done and related studies. They are consistent in that they all show the mRNA vaccines to give excellent protection.

Everyone should understand that the PCR test does not distinguish between live and dead virus nor does it detect an active infection. That can only be done by viral culture. There is no test for live virus currently available for routine use. Those who test positive by PCR may not be infected!

The bottom line here is simple to absorb. You do not want to wait round to get infected so you can acquire natural immunity. Everyone get vaccinated NOW with one of the mRNA vaccines. The J&J vaccine is better than nothing and is mainly useful primitive remote areas the type of refrigeration currently required for the mRNA vaccines is not available.

 

[Buy1Sell2]

"Sara Carter" ???

This is old news. I read the actual preprint some time ago and commented on it here. At the time I had not been critical enough of the study, and thought it looked fairly reasonable, After more thought I recognized a key failing in the study. And others have since pointed out other problems. If it ever gets by the reviewers please let me know, and I'll look at it again. Did it ever get by peer review?

Most people, including yourself I am quite sure, do not know that those who test positive by PCR may not be infected!

The only way to confirm infection, short of actual live culture (neither quick nor easy, so it isn't done) is via symptoms. See for example this study: https://doi.org/10.1016/j.e...

Regarding the Article, here are my brief comments and those of others:

BTW, The Corona Committee in Israel show research on recovered patients vs. vaccinated here:https://www.gov.il/BlobFold...

This shows patients who recovered between Dec 2020-April 2021 had a 0.43% reinfection rate with 9 (0.0049%) sever cases.

The baseline of persons vaccinated in Feb 2021 was 2.12% infection rate and 0.0132% serious cases.

This data is in line with other professionally done and related studies. They are consistent in that they all show the mRNA vaccines to give superior protection.

Everyone should understand that the PCR test does not distinguish between live and dead virus nor does it detect an active infection. That can only be done by viral culture. There is no test for live virus currently available for routine use. Those who test positive by PCR may not be infected!

The issue though is that it's virology 101 that someone who recovers from a viral infection is much more protected than someone getting a vaccine.

 

[wrbtrader]

All acquired immunity is natural. The immune system is given a virus surface target to sample, it keys to this.

One can argue somewhat better sampling from Delta than original which the vaccine was designed off but guess what? If you are vaccinated and you come in contact with delta, you will be less ill and your immunity will now have delta in the library also. It's not one or the other. Or, update the vaccine for delta.

Had my aunt not been vaccinated, it was certainly Delta she was infected with by her carer, I'd be flying to a funeral quite likely. Now she is not dead and has a super charged immune learning. A small silver lining.

I had problems after for months with diabetic symptoms, pancreas insulin producing cells gobbled up by Covid. Seems normal now but who knows what I have of my original function and how that will affect me as the years ahead, diabetes not being a geriatric illness found in either side of my family.

Others I know have not recovered sense of smell/taste in over a year so it's perminent which seems minor but actually its a meaningful loss,.especially to the girl who is a trained chef.

But hey, we should do science on what our "common sense" tells us because the scientific method is not needed eh? Just whatever feels right like our ancestors did it. That's being a proper Conservative, Sara Carter says and if feels right..

Yeah...thanks for making that clarification that I often forget to mention about Natural Herd Immunity involving those that have recovered or survived a Covid infection...

Although they recover, many often have side effects that linger for many months and there's now data showing up that shows these individuals developing other illnesses because their immune system is fucked up along with the fact that we still do not know the long-term effects on the human body of a recovered Covid infection (e.g. their brain).

Seriously, it's now becoming a headache for disability insurance companies to verify that a person has natural immunity for those that do not have documentation for a Covid hospitalization especially those that only had a mild infection in which they quickly recovered without needing to be hospitalized.

Simply, those having Natural Immunity is not something to brag about.

wrbtrader

 

[Scataphagos]

Ok, you convinced me. I’ll get my Covid vaccination. Probably JNJ.

Sounds like a version of "Hobson's Choice".

 

[murray t turtle]

They are going to find the harsh reality... that not only did they lose their jobs --- but most businesses will not hire plague rats. ...............

%%
OK, but the labor unions, lawyers, nurses....... are not putting up with forced jabs.
LUV airlines pilots called in sick , many of them ; it was rat fink management trying to control jabs most likely................................................

 

[Bugenhagen]

Sounds like a version of "Hobson's Choice".

He is a self employed truck driver, can make big money right now due to high demand and why would he risk illness, especially a dragged out long covid? It makes no business sense. J&J, easy peasy for his age group.

The reason to protect others by not spreading fucking covid aside as anything but entirely self-centred action is anathama to "the strong" (many of whom are afraid of needles).

 

[piezoe]

The issue though is that it's virology 101 that someone who recovers from a viral infection is much more protected than someone getting a vaccine.

This is not true with the new mRNA vaccines for Covid, which is the subject here. So what is your point? With the mountain of data we have acquired showing the outstanding efficacy of the new mRNA vaccines for Covid, no one in there right mind would advocate against vaccination.

 

[Buy1Sell2]

This is not true with the new mRNA vaccines for Covid, which is the subject here. So what is your point? With the mountain of data we have acquired showing the outstanding efficacy of the new mRNA vaccines for Covid, no one in there right mind would advocate against vaccination.

No one is advocating against getting the vaccination. The point is that already having Kung Flu is much more effective at protection than having the vaccine.

 

[Overnight]

Your posting evades the issue totally. Nobody said don't get the vaccine. You're disingenuous and not very bright either.

Hold on here, B1. You are inferring that very idea of not getting the vaccine by continuing the line of thought you started by posting...

https://www.elitetrader.com/et/thre...to-why-they-refuse.362185/page-4#post-5474476

If you truly believe that getting the vaccine is not bad, stop posting articles that may put doubt in peoples' minds about getting the vaccine, since "natural immunity" may infer a greater efficacy based upon that "research".

 

[Buy1Sell2]

Hold on here, B1. You are inferring that very idea of not getting the vaccine by continuing the line of thought you started by posting...

No I'm not. By all means get the vaccine if you have not had a Kung Flu infection yet. It helps with minimizing symptoms. However, the point is that if someone has already had Kung Flu, then that is much more effective for them than getting the vaccine. Having already had Kung Flu is vastly more effective for protection that getting the vaccine.