Last Hope... Faithless Electors

Fun fact about faithless electors: Alexander Hamilton tried to coerce then Governor John Jay into changing New York’s electors to subvert Jefferson’s election in 1800. Hamilton argued Jefferson was an “atheist in religion, and a fanatic in politics.”

If you ask Trump or his lawyers, I'm sure they'd say they DID properly investigate the issues... up to the point where others prevented even further discovery.... had lots of eye-witness testimony, lots of filed affidavits, lots of irregularities about vote verification, etc... but he'd also say he wasn't allowed to reveal all and present his case.

Here’s an example of an “eye witness” at a MAGA riot:

05DD65D8-3172-4009-AE79-5476EA48536C.jpeg
 
I am not so sure about that. While the US bought itself a lot of soft power in the past, most electricity generation projects, dams, port projects in Asia, Africa, or the Middle East are nowadays run by the Chinese. It's not necessary nor important to comment on the difference in built quality but it is what it is. Then the rest of the world accepted that the US chose to stand outside any climate accord and trade deal and the rest of the world is ok with that by now. I think Europe could easily live with it if the US completely pulled out of the Nato as well. What I am trying to say is that America is playing a diminishing role in the world. That is good but also bad, not just for others, but also for the US itself. So, I am not sure how many players would show up if the US held a party and invited the rest. If it was free of charge sure, but nothing is free as we all know and most powers nowadays carefully consider who they align with. Europe now refuses to blindly align with Israel's interest and many nations and blocks refused to align with the US in the trade war against China. The party mates of the past are not that reliable anymore.

Im sorry, but no. Minus the Brits, the Western Europeans aren’t the fighting type. Without America in NATO Europe will lose to the Russians year after year.

Keeping democracy strong in Europe is critical to American security. We ain’t leaving. We built modern Europe and need it to prosper.
 
What the justices of the lower courts should do, is do their jobs and let evidence be presented before saying there is no evidence. That you would expect of a kangaroo court in a third world country where laws do not matter. Didn't the justices swore to uphold the US constitution? Yet, nobody seems to want to do their jobs. Now, if there is ample evidence then, they should allow plaintiffs motions to succeed. This is bigger than being a Democrat or Republican, laws should be upheld and apply to everyone without exception. Now, if they can prove that the fraud was not massive then, people can accept Joe Biden as being elected legally. Otherwise, the stench of illegality hangs on his head. If he really believed he won fair and square, he should demand an audit of all ballots cast in AZ, NV, GA, WI, PA, MI with the provision that invalid ballots be removed and declared null and void. Those ballots who were cast by dead people, illegals (foreigners), minors, signatures on ballots envelopes missing, signatures on ballot envelopes not matching, ballots received after November 3, 2020. Then, a hand recount of all valid ballots. Do that and I would be the first to congratulate Joe Biden if he ends up winning it in the end.

No one wants to do their jobs because the President has isolated himself over the last four years. Uncompromising men, and all that.

But still, the electoral votes need to go to the candidate the state voted for.
 
There is no proof of massive fraud that would change the results of the election. You are pushing debunked nonsense that has been rejected by the courts over 50 times including the Supreme Court. Judges -- including Trump appointees -- have rejected the election fraud claims as having no merit. These judges were doing their jobs but dismissing suits with no basis in fact.

interesting...
Seems like you're OK when piss poor excuses/evidence disenfranchise minorities but not whitey?

Patriot Americans rejected your BS (by nearly 2 million votes)!

Illegal Immigrants voting illegally rejected our new president (by nearly 2 million votes)!
A SAMPLING OF ELECTION FRAUD CASES FROM ACROSS THE COUNTRY
https://thf_media.s3.amazonaws.com/2015/pdf/VoterFraudCases-8-7-15-Merged.pdf

462 CASES
742 CRIMINAL CONVICTIONS

Read about the cases including the citation of "15 counts of voter fraud, including voter registration fraud and illegal voting".

Yes, voter registration fraud and illegal voting are just types of voter fraud - as defined by law in all 50 states.
The amusing part every time one of these studies comes out is how much time/effort the left spends "debunking" it. You almost think that the left benefits from illegal voters.
Well if you want to drive or fly in a plane (without a passport)... you are going to need to get one. You can thank the Obama administration.

Time that we used proper picture ids to stop illegal voting as well.
I don't care if they vote Republican or Democrat. If they are not legitimate voters then they should not be voting.

Most people who lived in more than one state are registered in more than one state to vote including me and Trump's own kids..... and millions of others in the U.S. Similar to the Trump kids, my status in these other states is set to "moved to new domicile outside current jurisdiction" or whatever the particular state uses for status for someone who moved out of state. When I registered to vote in my new state or got a new driver's license, my old state was informed and my voting registration status changed.

Can you explain to me the legitimate reasons for someone to be listed as inactive in North Carolina? The only one given in the article is the floods in eastern counties where people have left temporarily without a forwarding address due to the emergency & one day will return. However as covered by other local media outlets, the inactive registrations in these flooded counties are under 12 people.

Putting an end to illegal voting is not making a mountain out of a molehill. Defending the legitimacy of elections is at the core of American values. Voting needs to be monitored carefully to be sure it is conducted fairly and the each voter is allowed to vote in the particular election district.
Without the Electoral College Democrat machines in cities like Chicago and corrupt Democrats in states like NY and CA could simply churn out enough votes to ensure that their candidate was elected President...

The Electoral College: The last wall against voter fraud
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog...ollege_the_last_wall_against_voter_fraud.html

One of the reasons that Democrats hate the Electoral College is that it limits voter fraud.

Generally speaking high levels of illegal voting can only occur if the government looks the other way. That’s why voter fraud is more rampant in Democrat-run cities like Chicago or states like California than in rural Iowa.

Allowing voter fraud of course only happens if the people in power believe that the illegal votes will help them.

That’s why in the Florida recount of 2001 the Democrats were unconcerned about illegal ballots but desperate to ensure that military ballots weren’t counted. They knew that illegal votes would tend Democrat and military votes would tend Republican.

That’s also why in California illegals were given drivers licenses in early 2016. If you’ve got a drivers license it’s a lot easier to vote illegally, especially since the “Motor Voter” law means that people can register to vote when they get a drivers license.

Fortunately for America, the Electoral College limits how much the crooked politician in CA, and Illinois, can impact the presidential election. No matter how many dead people vote in Chicago or how many illegal immigrants vote in California the dishonest Dems in those states can only impact a limited number of votes in the Electoral College.

Without the Electoral College Democrat machines in cities like Chicago and corrupt Democrats in states like NY and CA could simply churn out enough votes to ensure that their candidate was elected President.

They’ve done something similar before. In the 1960 election the southern, Republican, precincts in Illinois reported their vote tallies. Then later Cook County -- home to the Democrat machine -- precincts reported and produced just enough votes to ensure that Illinois went to Kennedy.

Republicans learned their lesson and in subsequent elections southern areas reported a few totals and waited for the city to report a few totals to ensure that the Democrats couldn’t just magically produce the vote counts they needed.

When Democrats talk about democracy they’re not talking about the choice of the American people but of the choice of many illegal aliens, felons, and dead people.

To Democrats all that matters is winning and any technique they use is justified by the “goodness” of their cause. That’s why they reject the law this time and declare that the popular vote is all that matters.

Hence in a world where Obama’s DOJ won’t investigate voter fraud, the Elector College is our last protection against the many well established Democrat voter fraud machines.
Summary:

  • Late last year Robert J. Higdon Jr., the U.S. Attorney for the Eastern District of North Carolina stated that there would shortly be hundreds of more indictments for illegal voting.
  • The U.S. Attorney's office has demanded records on 789 voters from across eastern and central North Carolina.
  • The state-level Democrats have been doing everything they can to block the requests and impede federal investigation. They now have been forced to hand over the records on the 789.
  • This is just merely part 2 of the investigation after the initial 19 convictions from part 1. The U.S. Attorneys' office has subpoenaed multiple years' worth of registration and voting data on nearly 7 million North Carolina voters.
  • North Carolina has failed to comply with the subpoena for the entire set of voting records -- shortly most observers expect they will be ordered to comply by a federal judge.

Elections officials to hand federal investigators data on hundreds of NC voters
https://www.wral.com/elections-offi...ators-data-on-hundreds-of-nc-voters/18173664/


I look forward to this next next batch of 789 illegal voters being indicted, convicted, and deported. I also laugh at this left-leaning article from WRAL which whines about the investigation while quoting Democratic officials who have done their best to stop the investigation of illegal voting.
So much for the liberal claims that there is no voter fraud...

Texas says it found 95,000 non-citizens on voter rolls; 58,000 have voted
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/te...-non-citizens-on-voter-rolls-58000-have-voted

Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton announced Friday that the state has discovered 95,000 non-citizens on the voter rolls going back to 1996, 58,000 of whom have voted in at least one Texas election -- an announcement likely to raise fresh concerns about the prospect of voter fraud.

Texas has some of the toughest voter ID laws in the nation and has been one of the main battlegrounds in the Republican-led fight against alleged voter fraud. The office, in a statement, said that 33 people were prosecuted for voter fraud last year, and 97 were prosecuted between 2005-17. There are 16 million people in Texas registered to vote.

“Every single instance of illegal voting threatens democracy in our state and deprives individual Texans of their voice,” Paxton said in a statement.

The New York Times reported that the findings were a result of of an 11-month investigation into records at the Texas Department of Public Safety. Gov. Greg Abbott praised the findings and hinted at future legislation to crack down on voter fraud.


"I support prosecution where appropriate. The State will work on legislation to safeguard against these illegal practices," Abbott tweeted.

The revelation is likely to have national consequences and stir debate and the role of voter fraud. President Trump created a commission in 2017 to investigate allegations of voter fraud in the 2016 election. But it was eventually dismantled by Trump after the group faced lawsuits, opposition from states and in-fighting among its members.

Trump said at the time that Democrats refused to hand over data “because they know that many people are voting illegally.” Democrats have dismissed claims of voter fraud and accused Republicans of trying to disenfranchise minority voters with tight voter ID laws.

Dallas state Rep. Rafael Anchia told The Associated Press that "because we have consistently seen Texas politicians conjure the specter of voter fraud as pretext to suppress legitimate votes, we are naturally skeptical."

Paxton’s office noted that there have been a number of convictions of voter fraud in the state in recent years, including a charge against a non-citizen this month for illegal voting in Navarro County.
 
interesting:

So all these items demonstrate voter fraud exists.... and gives some idea of the size & scope of the fraud including a table of all the voting fraud convictions in recent years in the U.S. People should be thankful that I posted this information - but I will note that you failed to include the comprehensive voting fraud conviction database post I provided recently. Here it is - https://www.elitetrader.com/et/threads/voting-fraud-conviction-database.353446/

The question becomes is if there is a "massive" coordinated voter fraud in the 2020 election in the U.S. that rises to the level of overturning the election. Bottom line -- after all the investigating there is not.

None of this rules out the need for better validation of voters for both in-person and mail-in voting. For in-person voting the obvious step (being used in many states) is to require a picture id to vote - while allowing people to obtain a state picture id for voting purposes at no cost. For mail-in voting the obvious step is to eliminate all ballot harvesting and implement strict legal penalties for the harvesting of ballots.

There is also a need for states to clean up their voting roles -- if someone has not voted 4 years then a post card should be sent to them - if the postcard is rejected because the resident is no longer at that address -- then either the name should be removed after an attempt is made to review records to determine if the re-registered to vote at another address (inside or outside the district).
 
So all these items demonstrate voter fraud exists.... and gives some idea of the size & scope of the fraud including a table of all the voting fraud convictions in recent years in the U.S. People should be thankful that I posted this information - but I will note that you failed to include the comprehensive voting fraud conviction database post I provided recently. Here it is - https://www.elitetrader.com/et/threads/voting-fraud-conviction-database.353446/

The question becomes is if there is a "massive" coordinated voter fraud in the 2020 election in the U.S. that rises to the level of overturning the election. Bottom line -- after all the investigating there is not.

None of this rules out the need for better validation of voters for both in-person and mail-in voting. For in-person voting the obvious step (being used in many states) is to require a picture id to vote - while allowing people to obtain a state picture id for voting purposes at no cost. For mail-in voting the obvious step is to eliminate all ballot harvesting and implement strict legal penalties for the harvesting of ballots.

There is also a need for states to clean up their voting roles -- if someone has not voted 4 years then a post card should be sent to them - if the postcard is rejected because the resident is no longer at that address -- then either the name should be removed after an attempt is made to review records to determine if the re-registered to vote at another address (inside or outside the district).

So why should inconsequential voter fraud not overturn an election but inconsequential voter fraud disenfranchise minority voters with restrictive policies (ie voter id)? I didn't have time to debunk most of the quoted claims, but let's be honest, half those are in the "3 million illegals voted for Trump" category (ie Texas claims).

https://www.elitetrader.com/et/threads/study-supports-trump-5-7-million-noncitizens-may-have-cast-illegal-votes.310616/
Let's subtract the votes of the 2 million illegal immigrants who illegally voted.

P.S. - say the words "President Donald Trump". Get used to it.
Study supports Trump: 5.7 million noncitizens may have cast illegal votes
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/jun/19/noncitizen-illegal-vote-number-higher-than-estimat/

A research group in New Jersey has taken a fresh look at postelection polling data and concluded that the number of noncitizens voting illegally in U.S. elections is likely far greater than previous estimates.

As many as 5.7 million noncitizens may have voted in the 2008 election, which put Barack Obama in the White House.

The research organization Just Facts, a widely cited, independent think tank led by self-described conservatives and libertarians, revealed its number-crunching in a report on national immigration.

Just Facts President James D. Agresti and his team looked at data from an extensive Harvard/YouGov study that every two years questions a sample size of tens of thousands of voters. Some acknowledge they are noncitizens and are thus ineligible to vote.

Just Facts’ conclusions confront both sides in the illegal voting debate: those who say it happens a lot and those who say the problem nonexistent.

In one camp, there are groundbreaking studies by professors at Old Dominion University in Virginia who attempted to compile scientifically derived illegal voting numbers using the Harvard data, called the Cooperative Congressional Election Study.

On the other side are the professors who conducted the study and contended that “zero” noncitizens of about 18 million adults in the U.S. voted. The liberal mainstream media adopted this position and proclaimed the Old Dominion work was “debunked.”

The ODU professors, who stand by their work in the face of attacks from the left, concluded that in 2008 as few as 38,000 and as many as 2.8 million noncitizens voted.

Mr. Agresti’s analysis of the same polling data settled on much higher numbers. He estimated that as many as 7.9 million noncitizens were illegally registered that year and 594,000 to 5.7 million voted.

These numbers are more in line with the unverified estimates given by President Trump, who said the number of ballots cast by noncitizens was the reason he lost the popular vote to Hillary Clinton.

Last month, the president signed an executive order setting up a commission to try to find on-the-ground truth in illegal voting. Headed by Vice President Mike Pence, the panel also will look at outdated voter lists across the nation with names of dead people and multiple registrants.

For 2012, Just Facts said, 3.2 million to 5.6 million noncitizens were registered to vote and 1.2 million to 3.6 million of them voted.

Mr. Agresti lays out his reasoning in a series of complicated calculations, which he compares to U.S. Census Bureau figures for noncitizen residents. Polls show noncitizens vote overwhelmingly Democratic.

“The details are technical, but the figure I calculated is based on a more conservative margin of sampling error and a methodology that I consider to be more accurate,” Mr. Agresti told The Washington Times.

He believes the Harvard/YouGov researchers based their “zero” claim on two flawed assumptions. First, they assumed that people who said they voted and identified a candidate did not vote unless their names showed up in a database.

“This is illogical, because such databases are unlikely to verify voters who use fraudulent identities, and millions of noncitizens use them,” Mr. Agresti said.

He cites government audits that show large numbers of noncitizens use false IDs and Social Security numbers in order to function in the U.S., which could include voting.

Second, Harvard assumed that respondent citizens sometimes misidentified themselves as noncitizens but also concluded that noncitizens never misidentified themselves as citizens, Mr. Agresti said.

“This is irrational, because illegal immigrants often claim they are citizens in order to conceal the fact that they are in the U.S. illegally,” he said.

Some of the polled noncitizens denied they were registered to vote when publicly available databases show that they were, he said.

This conclusion, he said, is backed by the Harvard/YouGov study’s findings of consumer and vote data matches for 90 percent of participants but only 41 percent of noncitizen respondents.

As to why his numbers are higher than the besieged ODU professors’ study, Mr. Agresti said: “I calculated the margin of sampling error in a more cautious way to ensure greater confidence in the results, and I used a slightly different methodology that I think is more accurate.”

There is hard evidence outside of polling that noncitizens do vote. Conservative activists have conducted limited investigations in Maryland and Virginia that found thousands of aliens were registered.

These inquiries, such as comparing noncitizen jury pool rejections to voter rolls, captured just a snapshot. But conservatives say they show there is a much broader problem that a comprehensive probe by the Pence commission could uncover.

The Public Interest Legal Foundation, which fights voter fraud, released one of its most comprehensive reports last month.

Its investigation found that Virginia removed more than 5,500 noncitizens from voter lists, including 1,852 people who had cast more than 7,000 ballots. The people volunteered their status, most likely when acquiring driver’s licenses. The Public Interest Legal Foundation said there are likely many more illegal voters on Virginia’s rolls who have never admitted to being noncitizens.
 
Last edited:
So all these items demonstrate voter fraud exists.... and gives some idea of the size & scope of the fraud including a table of all the voting fraud convictions in recent years in the U.S. People should be thankful that I posted this information - but I will note that you failed to include the comprehensive voting fraud conviction database post I provided recently. Here it is - https://www.elitetrader.com/et/threads/voting-fraud-conviction-database.353446/

The question becomes is if there is a "massive" coordinated voter fraud in the 2020 election in the U.S. that rises to the level of overturning the election. Bottom line -- after all the investigating there is not.

None of this rules out the need for better validation of voters for both in-person and mail-in voting. For in-person voting the obvious step (being used in many states) is to require a picture id to vote - while allowing people to obtain a state picture id for voting purposes at no cost. For mail-in voting the obvious step is to eliminate all ballot harvesting and implement strict legal penalties for the harvesting of ballots.

There is also a need for states to clean up their voting roles -- if someone has not voted 4 years then a post card should be sent to them - if the postcard is rejected because the resident is no longer at that address -- then either the name should be removed after an attempt is made to review records to determine if the re-registered to vote at another address (inside or outside the district).

I would add that the level of voting fraud for this election is much higher than what is being reported. But yes, after the mail-in shit show we just experienced, voting laws need to be tightened.

Voter ID in no way disenfranchises minorities.
 
I would add that the level of voting fraud for this election is much higher than what is being reported. But yes, after the mail-in shit show we just experienced, voting laws need to be tightened.

Voter ID in no way disenfranchises minorities.

Sir, this is an HVAC repair service...

https://abc13.com/amp/mark-anthony-...ed-aggravated-assault-liberty-center/8802235/

"He crossed the line from dirty politics to commission of a violent crime, and we are lucky no one was killed," Harris County District Attorney Kim Ogg said. "His alleged investigation was backward from the start - first alleging a crime had occurred and then trying to prove it happened."

According to court documents, Aguirre told police that he was part of a group of private citizens called the "Liberty Center," who were conducting a civilian investigation into the alleged ballot scheme.

According to Aguirre, he had been conducting surveillance for four days on a man who was allegedly the mastermind of a giant voter fraud scheme. Aguirre told authorities the man was hiding 750,000 fraudulent ballots in a truck he was driving.

Instead, the victim turned out to be an innocent air conditioner repairman, court documents said.

Aguirre ran his SUV into the back of the truck to get the technician to stop and get out, according to court documents.

When the technician got out of the truck, Aguirre pointed a handgun at the technician, forced him to the ground and put his knee on the man's back until police came, the court document said.
 
So all these items demonstrate voter fraud exists.... and gives some idea of the size & scope of the fraud including a table of all the voting fraud convictions in recent years in the U.S. People should be thankful that I posted this information - but I will note that you failed to include the comprehensive voting fraud conviction database post I provided recently. Here it is - https://www.elitetrader.com/et/threads/voting-fraud-conviction-database.353446/

The question becomes is if there is a "massive" coordinated voter fraud in the 2020 election in the U.S. that rises to the level of overturning the election. Bottom line -- after all the investigating there is not.

None of this rules out the need for better validation of voters for both in-person and mail-in voting. For in-person voting the obvious step (being used in many states) is to require a picture id to vote - while allowing people to obtain a state picture id for voting purposes at no cost. For mail-in voting the obvious step is to eliminate all ballot harvesting and implement strict legal penalties for the harvesting of ballots.

There is also a need for states to clean up their voting roles -- if someone has not voted 4 years then a post card should be sent to them - if the postcard is rejected because the resident is no longer at that address -- then either the name should be removed after an attempt is made to review records to determine if the re-registered to vote at another address (inside or outside the district).

Excuse me, but why exactly is “better validation” needed when we just had the most secure election in our nation’s history?

All this is doing is 1. Legitimizing baseless claims and 2. Hindering rightful voters trying to vote.

Voting laws should be positive not negative. We should have more laws for provisional and mail in ballots. There should nationwide same day voter registration. Every American should automatically be registered to vote.
 
Excuse me, but why exactly is “better validation” needed when we just had the most secure election in our nation’s history?

All this is doing is 1. Legitimizing baseless claims and 2. Hindering rightful voters trying to vote.

Voting laws should be positive not negative. We should have more laws for provisional and mail in ballots. There should nationwide same day voter registration. Every American should automatically be registered to vote.
GWB is exMAGA trying to clean his image and hoping to have it both ways w/o getting called out.
 
Back
Top