kobe faces life in prison (that's a bit much, imo)

G

Gordon Gekko

even if he's guilty, the way this alleged rape occured, he should not get life in prison, imo. that punishment is too severe.

there are different degrees of things. if you don't think so, think of a mother who kills her suffering child in a hospital by unplugging life support or something and think of a person who kills another in a drive-by shooting.

i am all for strict punishment when there is actually a victim (fuck victimless crimes). for example, if you kill someone in a drive-by shooting and your fingerprints are on the bullets and there's a video tape of it--YOU'RE DONE, imo.

based on what i know of the kobe case, it is way too he said she said to even convict him of anything. to send a guy to jail, i want overwhelming proof. you don't send possibly innocent men to jail to make sure you get all the guilty ones. also, the way this alleged rape took place, she went to his room, gave him a tour, agreed to some contact; that is a lesser degree of rape, imo, than mugging a girl at night with a knife and raping her. even if there was more proof of this rape and he's guilty, the way it happened, NO WAY SHOULD HE GET LIFE IN PRISON FOR THAT--NO WAY.

i've known some girls that are truly screwy in the head. i'm talking they will flat out lie with a straight face if they're mad. i heard on tv that kobe may have asked the accuser to kiss his penis or something after the alleged rape. what if after she did it, he rudely said, "get lost" and kicked her out of the room. maybe after she felt used and wants to make him pay. i'm NOT saying this is what happened, but there ARE girls out there who would do this. since the evidence seems to be weak against kobe, i would not convict him based on what i know of the case, and knowing how some girls can be.
 
Quote from Gordon Gekko:

even if he's guilty, the way this alleged rape occurred, he should not get life in prison, imo. that punishment is too severe.
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If I'm not mistaken, life in prison is the maximum penalty for what Kobe allegedly did. The judge will of course use discretion when sentencing due to the circumstances surrounding the case.

If Kobe were to be found guilty of rape, I believe his sentence will be similar to Mike Tyson's sentence -- 5 years in jail. Kobe would then be eligible for parole probably shortly after serving approximately 2 and a half years of his sentence.

Obviously life in jail would only be used for the most brutal of rape cases.
 
Is not an ABSOLUTE LAW and does not prevent ALL of the alleged victim's sexual history from entering into the Trial.

In fact, if there is evidence that might exxonerate Kobe and bring into question if there could be others who had had sex with the alleged victim and thus responsible for the vaginal tearing that she exhibited, then that evidence can be introduced into the Trial by the defense team.

Say hello to the little yellow-crotched panties with someone else's sperm and pubic hair . . . and a ton of highly paid EXPERT WITNESSES on vaginal tearing put on by the defense!

:)
 
If Kobe is guilty, if he did what is alleged, then he will have raped this poor girl, and forced her to go through this awful trial process where she is forced to prove she is not guilty of lying.

What is a fair penalty for that?

If he ruined her life, why isn't a life sentence fair?
 
Quote from ARogueTrader:

If Kobe is guilty, if he did what is alleged, then he will have raped this poor girl, and forced her to go through this awful trial process where she is forced to prove she is not guilty of lying.

What is a fair penalty for that?

If he ruined her life, why isn't a life sentence fair?
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ARogueTrader, if you are married, are you still beating your wife? No? Please prove to us that you aren't. You're talking about a teenage girl who has gone on severe depression benders this year, twice tried to take her own life this year, slept around a fair amount this year (even the day after being raped?!), and you're saying she needn't even defend her claim that Kobe raped her? That her history is such we should believe her out of the goodness of our hearts... just because she said so??? :confused:
 
Quote from Magna:

ARogueTrader, if you are married, are you still beating your wife? No? Please prove to us that you aren't. You're talking about a teenage girl who has gone on severe depression benders this year, twice tried to take her own life this year, slept around a fair amount this year (even the day after being raped?!), and you're saying she needn't even defend her claim that Kobe raped her? That her history is such we should believe her out of the goodness of our hearts... just because she said so??? :confused:
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If you understand the concept of if, then you understand the idea behind if/then statements.

If Kobe is guilty of rape then life in prison is a fair punishment in this case.

Yes, the prosecution needs to present evidence sufficient to convince a reasonable person that she is telling the truth and Kobe is lying. The physical evidence, and eye witnesses are the important factors in this case.

Anyone who has made any determination to this point of his guilt or innocence without viewing all the facts and all the evidence is absolutely guilty of being one who is prejudiced in nature, in that a decision of guilt or innocence has already been made, a prejudgment has been made without knowing all the facts.

These people who jump to conclusions, one way or another, usually are lousy traders too.
 
Quote from ARogueTrader:

If you understand the concept of if, then you understand the idea behind if/then statements.
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But I do, Rogue, but I do, and this part of your if/then I am in complete agreement with:
"If Kobe is guilty, if he did what is alleged, then he will have raped this poor girl.

But not this part (hard to tell just where your if/then ends):
and forced her to go through this awful trial process where she is forced to prove she is not guilty of lying.

This awful trial process as you call it is a fundamental part of our justice system. A girl, a demonstrably unstable one at that, makes a claim. At not a penny cost to her she has the full weight and resources of the Colorado prosecutorial system behind her. She risks no time in jail for possibly lying. Yet she puts a man's life at risk (I'm not saying Kobe can't afford his defense. He can. Many men languishing in prison over similar rape charges couldn't). And regardless of the outcome I suspect our teenage girl will end up with some nice book deal or movie of the week, and walk away with a fair amount of cash. In any case, you admonish a judicial system that requires she "prove she is not guilty of lying." Tch, tch.
If Kobe is guilty of rape then life in prison is a fair punishment in this case.
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I strongly disagree, but that's the topic of this thread.
Anyone who has made any determination to this point of his guilt or innocence without viewing all the facts and all the evidence is absolutely guilty of being one who is prejudiced in nature, in that a decision of guilt or innocence has already been made, a prejudgment has been made without knowing all the facts.
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The reality is that neither you nor I will ever know all the evidence, all the facts. The prosecution and defense reveal what they want us to hear, and have already demonstrated they will conveniently leave out anything that might be contrary to their case. So pleasssssssssssssssssse, enough with this "all the facts"... It's now been 8 years later, do you know "ALL the facts" of the O.J. case yet??
These people who jump to conclusions, one way or another, usually are lousy traders too.
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Somehow I just knew this had to do with trading, and lousy trading at that. Thanks for making this important connection in your argument!! :)
 
Quote from Magna:

But I do, Rogue, but I do, and this part of your if/then I am in complete agreement with:
"If Kobe is guilty, if he did what is alleged, then he will have raped this poor girl.

But not this part (hard to tell just where your if/then ends):
and forced her to go through this awful trial process where she is forced to prove she is not guilty of lying.

This awful trial process as you call it is a fundamental part of our justice system. A girl, a demonstrably unstable one at that, makes a claim. At not a penny cost to her she has the full weight and resources of the Colorado prosecutorial system behind her. She risks no time in jail for possibly lying. Yet she puts a man's life at risk (I'm not saying Kobe can't afford his defense. He can. Many men languishing in prison over similar rape charges couldn't). And regardless of the outcome I suspect our teenage girl will end up with some nice book deal or movie of the week, and walk away with a fair amount of cash. In any case, you admonish a judicial system that requires she "prove she is not guilty of lying." Tch, tch. I strongly disagree, but that's the topic of this thread.The reality is that neither you nor I will ever know all the evidence, all the facts. The prosecution and defense reveal what they want us to hear, and have already demonstrated they will conveniently leave out anything that might be contrary to their case. So pleasssssssssssssssssse, enough with this "all the facts"... It's now been 8 years later, do you know "ALL the facts" of the O.J. case yet??Somehow I just knew this had to do with trading, and lousy trading at that. Thanks for making this important connection in your argument!! :) [/B]
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I assume you have never been through a rape, and coming forward to accuse the rapist, a wealthy, popular, charismatic, clean cut image NBA superstar.

What I am saying is that if Kobe is guilty, then he is forcing this trial. He could simply plead guilty, no?

What a woman has to endure if she is innocent is awful. Yes, you can say that is our justice system, and this is true.

However, reports are that close to 40% of women who are raped do not report the rape because of the ordeal of the rape trial.

In this case (this is not a normal rape case because of the amount of money that will be spent to discredit her, and the public notoriety of this case) this girl, if innocent in the respect that she is telling us the truth, that Kobe did indeed rape her, will suffer greatly as a result of her standing up to defend herself and her rights.

Look, if you are a lynch mob type who shoots first and asks questions later, fine, that is your mentality. Like traders who buy and sell first on impulse and rumor, only to get whipped.

However, I am sure you know that there was no evidence presented at the pre-trial hearing from either side that actually proves much of anything, other than the need for a trial.

The prosecution will present their case. The defense will present their case. The prosecution will cross examine the evidence with equal force as the defense.

The full weight of the prosecution is much less that the defense and money that will bring in expert witness after expert witness, the best money can buy of course.

Unlike L.A., where the jury pool was looking for payback for Rodney King, et. al., and O.J. was the beneficiary, I don't believe the jury pool in Colorado has an axe to grind against black athletes. Many black athletes are heroes in Colorado, both professional and college athletes. This is not going to be a racial case, unless the scummy defense tries to pull the race card, which would be an error in my opinion.

This attempt to poison the jury pool by Mackie & company is just another case of the need to completely seal all these proceedings from the press until the trial is completed.

We will indeed see all the facts that can be presented, and that is why physical evidence and eye witness testimony is so critical in this case.

If we always left these cases up to he said/she said, there would never be a conviction, and no woman would ever report the rapes as they would know that it is a hopeless proposition to do so, and rape in effect would be a crime that could not be stopped in any manner, as the rapists would act on their impulses with complete knowledge of impunity.

As far as this girl profiting financially from this case, how much money did Desiree Washington make from her rape case, and how did she take advantage of that situation?

Your bias is transparent.
 
Quote from ARogueTrader:

...If Kobe is guilty, if he did what is alleged, then he will have raped this poor girl
[yes, this unstable, suicidal teenager who was awestruck by this famous person, willingly entered his room, kissed him, gave no indication to an eye-witness at the hotel upon leaving that anything unruly had happened, didn't tell her investigating officer during the first interview that she had ever said "No", showed up to the hospital the next day wearing different panties soiled by another man's semen and pubic hair]

...and forced her to go through this awful trial process where she is forced to prove she is not guilty of lying.
[yes, sorry, she can't simply make the claim and have it stand at that although from your posts I suspect you would prefer it that way]

...If he ruined her life
[please, enough melodrama, she hasn't even hit 20 yet, nothing is ruined]

...If Kobe is guilty of rape then life in prison is a fair punishment in this case.
[I'm sure Kobe appreciates your unbiased impartiality in deciding his punishment, life in prison, the ruination of his career and his family, all for a few minutes of sex that may have easily been consentual.]

...What I am saying is that if Kobe is guilty, then he is forcing this trial. He could simply plead guilty, no?
[I suppose with that logic anyone who ever defends themselves against claims by another person or the government is "forcing" a trial and should forego "forcing" by always pleading guilty]

...What a woman has to endure if she is innocent is awful.
[true, and what a man has to go thru, in expense, in cost to his family, his career, a portion (or all) of his life in prison if wrongly convicted, is also awful]

...this girl, if innocent in the respect that she is telling us the truth, that Kobe did indeed rape her, will suffer greatly
[the melodrama continues... And if she was lying will she go to jail for costing this man millions of dollars, potentially ruining his livelihood and his family, in fact his very life itself? No. In fact, nothing will happen to her.]

...The full weight of the prosecution is much less that the defense
[prosecutors from the entire state of Colorado have offered to pitch in and do whatever is necessary to assist, using the full resources of all their offices, so it's not just a couple of "understaffed" local prosecutors]

...This is not going to be a racial case, unless the scummy defense tries to pull the race card
[but how do you really feel about the defense?]

...This attempt to poison the jury pool by Mackie & company
[those dastardly lawyers, not that I would ever suggest the prosecution was also actively trying to poison the jury pool by continually leaking damaging, unsubstantiated claims against Kobe]

...Your bias is transparent.
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If we tell the truth, I think all our biases are showing.
 
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