keystone trading group

[syswizard]

Quote from Amitabha:


IMO there is no such thing as a dumb question- but there are dumb ways to piss away 5000 dollars.

Great response and my sentiments...EXACTLY.
"Show me the money".
I don't think they have "produced" that many great traders.
One reason is "attitude".
I joined their chat group...and mentioned the morning futures one day.....and they said "no more talk of futures". They were so paranoid about espousing anything positive about the futures market because, of course, it directly COMPETES with their EQUITIES-ONLY business model.

 

[BartS]

I guess I'm a dumbass then, because not only I "pissed away" 5000 dollars, but on top of it I'm happy about it!!!

I could tell you about guys who make money in the firm, but you'd probably say that's bs too, and it's not really my information to divulge in the first place.
And honestly, I learned more in the last 4 months than I could have learned on my own in a long time.

I'll check back on this thread in a bit....haven't been on the site in a while and don't miss the bickering one bit.

 

[bstay]

Quote from Amitabha:
and bstay in response to your calling my question dumb- I also do not know anybody who lights cigars with money- it was sarcasm that I must admit was uncalled for- I am just looking for proof that these guys are or are not a good way to learn to trade- the only proof that would make them believable (at least for me) is that they can produce students who make good money- I have yet to see one shred of evidence of this. I see posts about how great the class is, how great the rebates are etc, but I have yet to see proof that they have consistantly produced quality traders.

why not ask Keystone directly for "proof", whether they have produced ANY profitable traders who started from scratch (zero trading experience) after taking their courses? surely Keystone is running a charity and is obligated to make every client a success, instead of running a prop firm where the few best traders make far more money to cover the (absorbing) losses of the struggling majority ..... some of whom will never make it.

i am a fulltime trader so how much i make is not relevant to how much a complete fresh novice can expect after only one month of "training". if u looking for a guaranteed education, then Keystone is not for u. look elsewhere then.

 

[bstay]

Quote from BartS:
I'll check back on this thread in a bit....haven't been on the site in a while and don't miss the bickering one bit.

yep, been a culture now at ET. sort of the place to argue and spread untruths.

 

[Amitabha]

bstay- I did ask and they failed to produce it.
Of course no one is guarunteed to succeed, but you would at least expect to see better than average success rates. If you are not paying the 5K for high rate instruction to increase your chance of success then why bother? B stay you are right about one thing- keystone is not for me
I have said my peace and I am tired of this. I am finished with this thread

 

[HTS]

Don't get involved with Keystone Trading Group! Your paying $5000 for training that you can get at any tradeshow for under $1000. The come on is that you can be a full time trader if you make only $100 after a 4 month course is a scam or that you will be an automatic full time trader after paying for the year course.
They don't tell you that you have a limited number of stocks to trade and a very tight stop loss ($50) daily and $100 weekly making it almost impossible to make the $100 net profit especially for beginners. Very high drop out rate 99%

 

[l2tradr]

Quote from bstay:

why not ask Keystone directly for "proof", whether they have produced ANY profitable traders who started from scratch (zero trading experience) after taking their courses?

This doesn't relate to Keystone specifically, but I am pretty sure that any firm would not be legally allowed to divulge such information. Put yourself in that position, if you were a trader there and were making money, would you want your firm to show your statements to some random guy without your knowledge? Even WITH your knowledge, why would you personally volunteer such information? You have nothing to gain from it....just a though.

 

[BPtrader]

Quote from l2tradr:

This doesn't relate to Keystone specifically, but I am pretty sure that any firm would not be legally allowed to divulge such information. Put yourself in that position, if you were a trader there and were making money, would you want your firm to show your statements to some random guy without your knowledge? Even WITH your knowledge, why would you personally volunteer such information? You have nothing to gain from it....just a though.

nobody wants the names of individual traders.

what one wants is the statistics of the trader population in a firm: the percentage of profitable traders.

For example, a firm may produce a sheet of paper showing these numbers: 65% of our traders in 2009 were profitable. 20% of those profitable traders made $100,000 or above, 50% of them made 50,000-99,999, the rest made 50,000 or below.

If you run a firm like keystone, don't you want to tell prospective traders how well your firm's current traders are doing???

Like Wharton School of Business distributing information, to prospective students, about how many of its graduates were hired at Wall Street firms and hedge funds.

 

[l2tradr]

Quote from BPtrader:

nobody wants the names of individual traders.

what one wants is the statistics of the trader population in a firm: the percentage of profitable traders.

For example, a firm may produce a sheet of paper showing these numbers: 65% of our traders in 2009 were profitable. 20% of those profitable traders made $100,000 or above, 50% of them made 50,000-99,999, the rest made 50,000 or below.

If you run a firm like keystone, don't you want to tell prospective traders how well your firm's current traders are doing???

Like Wharton School of Business distributing information, to prospective students, about how many of its graduates were hired at Wall Street firms and hedge funds.

LOL, I like how you have Warton and Keystone in the same post

Sure, providing statistics is different, no privacy laws are broken there. That could work. One has to be careful in drawing conclusions from them, but yes, that would be good...at least you can do a firm-to-firm comparison that way.

 

[OMoney]

Do all prop shops charge a fee for start up education?

What is the average charge?

Do they charge for software and exchange fees?

Are there any other costs?

If a trader puts up his own money he expects leverage. What is the cost for that leverage? And do you have to pay the education fee of you have your own money?

How do most of the shops operate?