keystone trading group

WinItAll · Aug 21, 2009

Not a pecimist buddy, have nothing to be pecimistic about. I do live in the real world and consider myself a realist. You should try living here some time.

And for your information if your account balance breaches a predetermined downside you absolutely have to put up more money at any of these prop shops. Good luck with starting your trading endeavor without properly doing your research. I have no spite or hard feeling about any of these places, on the contrary it's a lucrative business model and if I had the time and patience I wouldn't mind having my own shop. I am simply stating the truth b/c I have been asked the same questions by people in this post regarding this issue.

As far as being lonely on this endeavor, you should keep traveling down the path you're on now... Don't do any research on firms or the SEC rules, you can see the case that was brought about a few years back and believe what whoever is looking to sign you up for a lump sum says. You'll go far that way.

bstay · Aug 21, 2009

Quote from WinItAll:
I would like to hear from some guys who work at one of these shops. And other posters PLEASE DO NOT ATTACK THESE PEOPLE AS THEY'VE DONE NOTHING WRONG..... THIS IS A DISCUSSION, NOT A PLACE TO RIP APART GUYS WHO ARE TRYING TO LEARN IN THIS BUSINESS. SO LET'S KEEP THIS AN IMFORMATIVE DISCUSSION AND NOT A FIGHT.

I'm aware of the SEC vs Tuco Trading LLC case. Enforcement is on case-by-case basis. Other similar firms continue to operate, and only Tuco is shut down.

sbxems · Oct 2, 2009

I must say I have just started with Keystone and I am going to tell you the truth.. I have been self teaching myself how to trade for a while. Since being with Keystone I have learned how to REALLY TRADE. They are not just about if it does this short, if it does this long. They teach you the markets, how to read them, how to read stocks.... They dont make you a robot they make you learn the market.
The owners Pete and Eric are very, very honest and are very willing to answer every question you have.
Any questions PM me but I am being completely honest as someone who has had a passion for the markets for years KEYSTONE is the way to go to LEARN HOW THE MARKET WORKS AND LEARN HOW TO TRADE.
Thank you

DT3 · Oct 2, 2009

Quote from sbxems:

I must say I have just started with Keystone and I am going to tell you the truth.. I have been self teaching myself how to trade for a while. Since being with Keystone I have learned how to REALLY TRADE. They are not just about if it does this short, if it does this long. They teach you the markets, how to read them, how to read stocks.... They dont make you a robot they make you learn the market.
The owners Pete and Eric are very, very honest and are very willing to answer every question you have.
Any questions PM me but I am being completely honest as someone who has had a passion for the markets for years KEYSTONE is the way to go to LEARN HOW THE MARKET WORKS AND LEARN HOW TO TRADE.
Thank you

Can you be more specific, what exactly did they teach you? Are you trading with them now? How much BP do they give and what are your commission rates?

sbxems · Oct 3, 2009

They teach you how to read order flow. How to master multiple time frame analysis. Candlesticks analysis..and much more... I am trading with them they give you as much buying power as you prove you can handle... they will move you up quick if you show them you are not just trying ti git a hime run and make risky trades. commission is cheap.. there are two programs longer intraday trending which is 1.25 per 1000 full ecn rebates. the other program is scalping and im not familiar with the commision rates but i think its .20 per 1000. s alot less because your trading thousands of shares. Before starting i have tried to find truthful people when doing my research and couldnt find any so here i am answering any question. truthfully. GL

reeseinv · Oct 3, 2009

Quote from sbxems:

They teach you how to read order flow. How to master multiple time frame analysis. Candlesticks analysis..and much more... I am trading with them they give you as much buying power as you prove you can handle... they will move you up quick if you show them you are not just trying ti git a hime run and make risky trades. commission is cheap.. there are two programs longer intraday trending which is 1.25 per 1000 full ecn rebates. the other program is scalping and im not familiar with the commision rates but i think its .20 per 1000. s alot less because your trading thousands of shares. Before starting i have tried to find truthful people when doing my research and couldnt find any so here i am answering any question. truthfully. GL

You didnt really answer the quesiton but i think its 20:1 with a 10K committment is that about right ?

allen919 · Oct 4, 2009

I'm under the impression that the shops that charge for training and dont require a contribution will close your account as soon as your losses equal the amount of tuition you have paid.

Can anyone confirm that?

jrlvnv · Oct 5, 2009

Quote from reeseinv:

You didnt really answer the quesiton but i think its 20:1 with a 10K committment is that about right ?

No that is incorrect. You have 2 choices. Pay for the training and trade "their" money and they tell you how/what to trade or you put up the 25k so you can daytrade your own.

All these training fees are to get by license rule so that is why you can no longer get a 10:1 on 5k "legally of course".

leela · Oct 5, 2009

Quote from allen919:

I'm under the impression that the shops that charge for training and dont require a contribution will close your account as soon as your losses equal the amount of tuition you have paid.

Can anyone confirm that?

They will tell u go for more training (i.e. pay money) when half of your earlier tuition fee.

I don't mind trading "their way" if it is truly their capital - not just the money I had to hand over to work for them.

WinItAll · Oct 9, 2009

It's common practice for these firms to tell you how they don't usually just let ANYONE join and that you just happen to meet the requirements.

Just for common knowledge, any sucker with a check for 5,000 dollars will be accepted b/c the firm has no money at risk...... Worst comes to worst they only make money on your comissions

If you make money they win and if you lose money they still win, just not as much. Oh yeah, and you win too if you make. No matter what they're making commission money on you and if you are making money, by trading your own capital/deposit, then they get a cut of that too. As for the ignorant response above me, just by trading at a firm you are paying for using their space. Win, lose or draw the firm makes commission charges off you. So you know, the rate I trade at for myself is more than most prop firms and that's 90 cents per thousand shares.....

Any prop firm that has more than five trades pays anywhere between 50 cents per thousand to 1 dollar per thousand.... Not a cent more. Whatever your commission cost is per thousand subtract a dollar per thousand (just to high ball it) and that's what they make on you.

So someone who trades 50k shares a day and is charged 6 bucks per thousand is in actuality paying the prop firm they trade with $5,000 a month in pure profit.

TO CONCLUDE, IF YOU GO BACK TO THE BEGINNING OF THE YEAR AND TRADE ABOUT A MILLION SHARES A MONTH YOU WOULD BE CREATING $60,000 A YEAR FOR THE PROP FIRM WHILE TRADING WITH YOUR OWN MONEY (DON'T FALL FOR THE TRAINING BULLSHIT, ONCE YOU GO THRU THAT MONEY YOU'RE DONE) AND THE SCARY PART IS THAT'S BEFORE THEY TAKE A PIECE OF YOUR PROFIT.

So to put it all together if you made $100k this year and traded around 50k per day with a firm letting you keep 80% of your profits and charging $6 per thousand the the prop firm would have made exactly as much as you.......

You make 80k and the firm would make $20,000 from your profits and $60,000 on your comissions. So you both make 80k a year.