keystone trading group

BartS: Since you work for them, you probably know better.

Did you pay 5k to learn how to scalp a few cents here and there using their indicators?

I hope you make enough to recoup. Your 5k is gone.
 
Quote from dodobird4545:

1) The stock lists for both premiere and platinum are very very non-volatile stocks such as gm, ge, c, bac and so on.

2) I would say that if you are looking to trade for a firm that claims to be run by traders, then make sure it is.

3)You should do your homework and actually watch these guys trade. From what I've seen these guys are honest but also are not really traders. You will learn the basics like bid and offer, a few charts, order flow, etc, but will not learn how to be profitable there.

4)I have never worked for keystone, but all i can say is they seem very honest but read the fine print.

5)These guys came off more as business men than traders. But at least you get what you sign up for with no surprises, which says something these days. [/B]
More...

I don't generally spend time on ET but got an email about this post.
I hope the ET moderators do not delete this post because I mention other firms besides Keystone Trading. I think it is only fair to allow the post if you allow posts to remain by traders who do not actually trade with us. So here goes

1) Premier traders are scalpers, so yes they trade liquid stocks for smaller move. That is the very definition of the word scalping.

Our Platinum traders choose whatever stocks they want to trade generally, speaking stocks that have an average intra day range of a dollar or more. Your point about which stocks our traders trade is not true.

Typically starting out with stocks in the DOW the first month. They are taught to build a position as the stock moves in their favor, how could they possibly do that in stocks that don't move?

2) Keystone is a firm run by traders. My partner and I trade every day on the floor. And I always invite anyone who doesn't believe that I can make money to come watch me trade. I am sure the guys at SMB and T3 will tell you the same

3) see above. To prove that fact August 6 we had ANOTHER live trading event in front of 65 people (yes we made money).

Of course we start with the basics, where else would we start?

You stated "you won't learn how to be profitable there" You honestly believe you can make a statement like that with NEVER having seen us trade?

3a) thank you very much for stating a few times that we are honest and you get what you pay for, reputation is everything.

4) again thanks for saying we are very honest especially since you have never worked for us which means you have very limited knowledge of how we run our trading operation from day to day, no firm or business can be perfect for everyone but you will always know where you stand with us

5) "These guys came off more as business men than traders." Thank you for the compliment about how we run our business, you would have no idea about how we trade unless you actually watch us trade.

One more point, I am not sure who you are or when you interviewed but I will say this. As you know from the presentation you attended and from the interview we back traders with a track record.

Since you have so much success as a trader and have no problem posting on your opinion about a firm and traders you have never worked with can I ask if you brought with you YOUR track record of profitability for us to partner up?

We get hundreds of traders a month who contact us and tell us they have a track record but when it comes time to see it they disappear.

There are some great trading/educational firms out there now, Keystone/T3/SMB pick one that suits your personality but it is unprofessional to have an opinion on traders you have never seen trade or a trading firm operation that you have never been a part of.

It is very common for guys on ET to post "why would a good trader waste time teaching?"

Number one is to cultivate new talent to build a thriving trading business, too many opportunities each day to capitalize on your own and yes building a team is exciting.

Number two is there are too many pikers who want to waste your time, if an experienced trader is going to take time to mentor, his or her time is worth money. It filters out hose people who "want to give it a shot"

Number three is 90% of the people who want to trade for a living do not have $25,000 or any solid trading plan that actually works with real money. Firms like T3, SMB and Keystone provide both (no risk deposit, mentoring and a trading plan)

BTW if you are looking to get into the business and a firm asks you for a risk deposit and they are not a broker dealer, run the other way.

I can think of one very popular trading author in NYC who blatantly advertises accepting risk deposits less than $25K, negotiating commissions and providing you with leverage. These are all violations as deemed by the SEC/NASD

Pete
 
Quote from Pete Renzulli:

I don't generally spend time on ET but got an email about this post.
I hope the ET moderators do not delete this post because I mention other firms besides Keystone Trading. I think it is only fair to allow the post if you allow posts to remain by traders who do not actually trade with us. So here goes

1) Premier traders are scalpers, so yes they trade liquid stocks for smaller move. That is the very definition of the word scalping.

Our Platinum traders choose whatever stocks they want to trade generally, speaking stocks that have an average intra day range of a dollar or more. Your point about which stocks our traders trade is not true.

Typically starting out with stocks in the DOW the first month. They are taught to build a position as the stock moves in their favor, how could they possibly do that in stocks that don't move?

2) Keystone is a firm run by traders. My partner and I trade every day on the floor. And I always invite anyone who doesn't believe that I can make money to come watch me trade. I am sure the guys at SMB and T3 will tell you the same

3) see above. To prove that fact August 6 we had ANOTHER live trading event in front of 65 people (yes we made money).

Of course we start with the basics, where else would we start?

You stated "you won't learn how to be profitable there" You honestly believe you can make a statement like that with NEVER having seen us trade?

3a) thank you very much for stating a few times that we are honest and you get what you pay for, reputation is everything.

4) again thanks for saying we are very honest especially since you have never worked for us which means you have very limited knowledge of how we run our trading operation from day to day, no firm or business can be perfect for everyone but you will always know where you stand with us

5) "These guys came off more as business men than traders." Thank you for the compliment about how we run our business, you would have no idea about how we trade unless you actually watch us trade.

One more point, I am not sure who you are or when you interviewed but I will say this. As you know from the presentation you attended and from the interview we back traders with a track record.

Since you have so much success as a trader and have no problem posting on your opinion about a firm and traders you have never worked with can I ask if you brought with you YOUR track record of profitability for us to partner up?

We get hundreds of traders a month who contact us and tell us they have a track record but when it comes time to see it they disappear.

There are some great trading/educational firms out there now, Keystone/T3/SMB pick one that suits your personality but it is unprofessional to have an opinion on traders you have never seen trade or a trading firm operation that you have never been a part of.

It is very common for guys on ET to post "why would a good trader waste time teaching?"

Number one is to cultivate new talent to build a thriving trading business, too many opportunities each day to capitalize on your own and yes building a team is exciting.

Number two is there are too many pikers who want to waste your time, if an experienced trader is going to take time to mentor, his or her time is worth money. It filters out hose people who "want to give it a shot"

Number three is 90% of the people who want to trade for a living do not have $25,000 or any solid trading plan that actually works with real money. Firms like T3, SMB and Keystone provide both (no risk deposit, mentoring and a trading plan)

BTW if you are looking to get into the business and a firm asks you for a risk deposit and they are not a broker dealer, run the other way.

I can think of one very popular trading author in NYC who blatantly advertises accepting risk deposits less than $25K, negotiating commissions and providing you with leverage. These are all violations as deemed by the SEC/NASD

Pete
More...


And where is the track record of your instructors that teach "profitable" strategies ?

Right, you don't have them either...remembers me of a thread where the profit/losses of all traders at a prop firm were disclosed, under them was 1 instructor of a popular trading firm who never made a dime at that firm...I will look it up
 
You know what, the guy is right..... I have never traded there and what I did hear was the deal was very straight forward. As far as watching them trade I DID see the stuff from whatever premium means and it was trading for pennies. Maybe it was the some special list but it was still trading for pennies i was watching.

I don't know who the firms are that you are talking about so I'm not really sure what they have to do with anything.

This is a message board for aspiring traders looking for firms and most of us are right out of college. We are trying to avoid being taken advantage of and this is a blog which is supposed to let us speak freely. I stated several times that you came off honestly and i think that the biggest compliment you can get. But we are supposed to be out to share our OPINIONS on this site, not be attacked for sharing our view.
 
I forgot to say that I don't have a track record b/c i never traded before making it unlikely that i could show you one. Either way I apologize if I innaccurately stated something but I'm pretty sure I just gave my OPINION.
 
Nothing personal.

Just felt a need to post a reply as myself because of all the thousands of anonymous posts.

Sorry if you took it as something against you, wasn't intended to be so.

As far as that other firm I didn't mention their name nor did I say anything negative about the authors ability to teach, he is a very well respected author/teacher.

I simply stated a truth about risk deposits

Be well

Pete
 
Quote from puretruth:

And where is the track record of your instructors that teach "profitable" strategies ?

Right, you don't have them either...remembers me of a thread where the profit/losses of all traders at a prop firm were disclosed, under them was 1 instructor of a popular trading firm who never made a dime at that firm...I will look it up
More...

read the post, I don't remember mentioning the firm nor do I even insinuate anything about the guys ability to teach trading.

If you know who he is (and it sounds like you do and for some reason you feel the need to defend him for something I never mentioned) I will be the first to tell you he is very well respected as an author and teacher.

Simply made a comment about risk deposits.
 
These instructors can teach you what is bid and ask, what is a limit or market order. They can tell you about moving average crossovers, candlesticks, etc.

Such instructions are not worth the many thousands they are charging.

I learned a lot more than that from free webinars and from a live trading room for $30/mo.

Ask yourself this question: If you are not trying to get a job with firm, would you be willing to pay as much for their so called training?

This question would help you understand if what they are teaching is worth the amount they charge, or if it is a deceptive sneaky way to get you to buy your job with them.

They make their money by continuously recruiting new students, dangling a job in front of them. They have help wanted job ads on Craigslists on every major city. I chanced into them looking for a job. It looks like is their primary souce of revenue, and not from the profits of their traders.
 
I agree with you hippie. The only way to learn to trade is by making your own mistakes and having guys trading live while sharing their opinions.

The teaching needs to be ongoing and consistant. It's also very important for it to be LIVE training, not going over things after. Not to say that this firm doesn't have LIVE training, just saying in general that it's very important so you know whether profitable guys are teaching you.

I think the best thing to do if you are trying to learn is subscribe to a trading site, most it will cost is 200 a month and absorb all they have to teach from all the lectures, but more importantly make sure one of the traders is on the air live everyday and saying why he/she is taking a certain position, why they're getting out at a certain point and what they saw on the chart, tape, order flow, etc.

In my opinion joining up for workshops with historical charts and power point slides is a waste of money...... Go by the Tech Analysis Bible and a book on either OHLC or Candlestick charting and you'll learn a 5000 dollar course worth of info for 50 bucks. Then sign up for a live trading site and have someone trading live with you every day for as long as you want for 200 a month instead of a lump sum fee.

That's what I did and it worked rather well.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top