Keynesian lesson for the et righties

[mrbill]

Quote from Free Thinker:

the ironic thing is there are actually righties on et arguing that someone like ron paul, who has promised to cut a trillion dollars in his first year,would spur job growth.

I like much of what Ron Paul says, but I don't think he has some magic pill. Public or private sector jobs? Did he go into more detail?

 

[PiggyBank]

Quote from piezoe:

Well Piggy, it seems you didn't quite understand the NYTimes article nor do you understand Keynes. Spending public money on wasting assets for the sole purpose of creating a temporary boost in demand is not a very good idea.

Instead, what is being suggested, and what Keynes would approve of, is investing public dollars, even if those dollars have to be borrowed, in the private sector so as to create jobs building infrastructure (which includes for example things like high speed rail, developing energy alternatives, improving education, and constructing public facilities of all kinds.) This in turn will generate increased tax revenue and create demand in the private sector by putting folks to work on worthwhile projects, putting money in their pockets, and getting getting them off the unemployment/public assistance roles. The results of these projects can pay healthy dividends for years to come.

did I not address infrastructure spending.. oh that's right I did, but you choose to cut off my post. i fully understand the article and your post. It seems what isn't understood is that PUBLIC spending can only be done at a cost to present and future taxpayers. there is no way around it, except to do it as little as possible. The private sector CAN build infrastructure. I don't care at all whether Keynes would approve or not.

 

[Free Thinker]

Quote from mrbill:

I like much of what Ron Paul says, but I don't think he has some magic pill. Public or private sector jobs? Did he go into more detail?

some nonsense about lower debt spurring economic activity.

ron paul like policies would take us back to a 1937 depression. some day we may have to do austarity and suffer through the depression it would cause but lets not try to claim that cutting a trillion dollars would spur economic activity.

 

[wildchild]

Then with Obama's 5 trillion+ in new debt the economy should be booming. Its not.

 

[Free Thinker]

Quote from PiggyBank:

The private sector CAN build infrastructure. I don't care at all whether Keynes would approve or not.

that is nonsense. history shows that all the great infrastructure projects were government inspired.

 

[peilthetraveler]

Quote from Free Thinker:

any economics in your background? you aint getting it. the iphone is just a symbol. it could be anything. lets call it an ibridge.
the initial demand can be consumers or government. the government doesnt build anything. it manages projects.
the government orders an ibridge. since it doesnt build anything it has to place an order with a private contractor who has employees. that contractor has to buy supplies from suppliers who have employees. as all these employees make money they create demand for other goods and services. this all has a multiplyer effect. if it is strong enough it can be self reinforcing.
so keynesian government spending can create demand and increase the velocity of money.

So freethinker...why doesnt the government just give every American $100,000 to spend as he pleases. He will buy lots of things which will boost the economy and create demand for more jobs, right? Would this be a good idea for you?

 

[jem]

Quote from Free Thinker:

any economics in your background? you aint getting it. the iphone is just a symbol. it could be anything. lets call it an ibridge.
the initial demand can be consumers or government. the government doesnt build anything. it manages projects.
the government orders an ibridge. since it doesnt build anything it has to place an order with a private contractor who has employees. that contractor has to buy supplies from suppliers who have employees. as all these employees make money they create demand for other goods and services. this all has a multiplyer effect. if it is strong enough it can be self reinforcing.
so keynesian government spending can create demand and increase the velocity of money.

you are a clueless leftist...

to review...

a. your author proved innovative supply (use any symbol you wish) created demand --- the complete reverse of his and your thesis. Creation and creative destruction is what makes capitalism work.
The economy grows by creating innovative supply and innovative services.


b. Our govt is spending 2.43 dollars to create 1 dollar of gdp... by anyone's arithmetic that shows you that govt should not be spending more.

 

[Free Thinker]

Quote from peilthetraveler:

So freethinker...why doesnt the government just give every American $100,000 to spend as he pleases. He will buy lots of things which will boost the economy and create demand for more jobs, right? Would this be a good idea for you?

that would no doubt spur economic activity but by investing in public infrastructure you get the benefit of productivity enhancement. dont forget this infrastructure will have to be replaced someday in any case, some if it is already obsolete.

 

[wildchild]

Hey Freethinker, then with all of Obama's spending, where are the jobs?

 

[PiggyBank]

Quote from Free Thinker:

that is nonsense. history shows that all the great infrastructure projects were government inspired.

You admitted yourself that the govt doesn't actually create anything they take OUR money and give it to private sector companies to build. The point, there is no need for the govt to be involved at all. On a thread very similar to this not so long ago, I gave you an example of the railroads, the ONLY intercontinental railroad ever built in this country that never went bankrupt was the one produced 100% privately by JJ Hill. The reason why is simple, he HAD to make $$ to stay in business, while the govt subsidized railroads did not. For piezoe to use the high speed rail as an example of something we need and that will pay dividends is laughable.. at least according to other govt run railways. How's amtrak doing?

Oh and how about energy alternatives, we DON'T actually need them and these companies like solyndra can't even stay afloat. lol. and how about education, how in the world does investing in education pay dividends? "well students come out smarter and get better jobs, they end up paying more in tax", NOT if the jobs don't exist. Education is not a right, and the fed govt has no authority to be spending money on college loans. not in the Constitution anyway.