Mistakes such as what?
Having too many beers and laughing at flatulence jokes?
Kavanaugh is on fire
- Thread starter gwb-trading
- Start date
Mistakes such as what?
Having too many beers and laughing at flatulence jokes?
Absolutely, due process that's why we finally have an FBI investigation on this particular accusation. By the way he was not accused of groping. He is accused of attempted RAPE for which there is no statute of limitation. Whatever the FBI investigation finds shall serve as deciding factor whether he will be excluded from consideration as Supreme Court Judge or confirmed. Simple as that. We have that now thanks to Jeff Flake. Thank you Senator Flake.
Very much agree. He did not come across as being credible and honest. But that is not enough for a conviction. Let's see what the FBI unearths. But in my book it is already enough to not qualify for the highest law court in the country. The picture he painted of what was going on in his childhood is stinking dishonest and misleading.
just look at his yearbook.
Exactly. It is disgustingly dishonest to stand there under oath and pretend he had no influence over what some editor put into the yearbook. Disgusting and a lie. The side if him of the many times he was in a drunken stupor were completely omitted by him and the question by the sex crime prosecutor whether he ever remembered a time he woke up the next morning and could not remember anything or part of the previous night is an oxymoron. The yearbook, hundreds of classmates in his school and other schools corroborate that he and his kind drank themselves into oblivion many times. Nothing wrong with that (well illegal as under drinking age but forgivable) but claiming he never forgot a thing about the previous night goes straight against all scientific and medical evidence. I am absolutely sure not a single guy on this entire forum could claim the same. Everyone drank before to a degree that they forgot pieces of the previous night. That is where he lost my trust in him. Perhaps he studied hard was a good athlete and good church boy. But there is the other side of him that partied hard and certainly there were times he drank so hard that he must have forgotten details of the previous night.
I am sure the hard core right wingers now get a hard on because the FBI already overstepped its mandate which is to only investigate within the scope of this particular accusation. As we speak the FBI started to reach out to the second accuser. I believe it is the right thing to do given the circumstances.
I am sure the hard core right wingers now get a hard on because the FBI already overstepped its mandate which is to only investigate within the scope of this particular accusation. As we speak the FBI started to reach out to the second accuser. I believe it is the right thing to do given the circumstances.
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You sound like you may need to be hospitalized if Kavanaugh is confirmed.
Just remember that we are here for you.
No but it would do great damage to this country if he was confirmed while the FBI found something within this week that points to evidence against Kav. Should they find no evidence then may he be elected and blessed. Otherwise he deserves to rot in hell alongside his wife and entire family who stood by his lies and disguise.
Really, accused of attempted rape on those facts? No or extremely low chance of that based on the facts Ms. Ford presented. .
Nothing that Ford stated went any where close to showing that the man who was groping her met the the elements of attempted rape....
https://rape.uslegal.com/attempt-to-rape/
I realize that definitions will vary by state.
But generally you must establish there was an intention to rape in the Man's mind and that he touched her genitals after removing her clothes.
Did she testify to anything like that at all.
All she stated was that she had fear it might happen.
Nothing that Ford stated went any where close to showing that the man who was groping her met the the elements of attempted rape....
https://rape.uslegal.com/attempt-to-rape/
I realize that definitions will vary by state.
But generally you must establish there was an intention to rape in the Man's mind and that he touched her genitals after removing her clothes.
Did she testify to anything like that at all.
All she stated was that she had fear it might happen.
Why Maryland police aren’t investigating the Kavanaugh allegations
Maryland Gov. Larry Hogan (R) has called for a “full investigation”into allegations that Supreme Court nominee Brett M. Kavanaugh sexually assaulted Christine Blasey Ford 36 years ago, when both were teenagers.
But neither the Maryland State Police, which reports to Hogan, nor police in Montgomery County, the Washington suburb where the assault allegedly occurred, are likely to launch such a probe.
Here’s why:
1. Hogan’s spokeswoman said last week that the governor “has never used the state police to pursue investigations at his personal whim. That is a very dangerous and slippery slope.”
So while Democratic state lawmakers have asked Hogan to initiate an investigation within Maryland, he is not planning to do so. Instead, he is calling for an unspecified independent investigator, who would presumably report to federal officials.
The Maryland State Police says its policy is to investigate allegations only when a criminal complaint has been filed; Ford has not filed a criminal complaint.
If such a complaint were filed, the state police would turn it over to Montgomery County police.
2. Montgomery County police, too, note that no accuser of Kavanaugh’s has come forward to request a police investigation.
And even if an accuser went to the local department, the statute of limitations appears to have long since passed for pursuing the allegations described in Thursday’s dramatic Senate Judiciary Committee hearing.
The most serious allegation that authorities could pursue, given the sworn testimony provided by Ford, would be attempted rape. But that was considered a misdemeanor in Maryland in 1982, and that would be the relevant legal standard.
As a misdemeanor, the offense carried a one-year statute of limitations, meaning charges would have had to be filed within a year of an incident, according to John McCarthy, Montgomery County’s longtime chief prosecutor. Lisae C. Jordan, the executive director and counsel for the Maryland Coalition Against Sexual Assault, and other longtime Maryland lawyers interviewed in recent days concurred.
The Maryland legislature changed the law in 1996, making attempted rape a felony and removing the statute of limitations, according to McCarthy and Jordan.
“But we’d have to apply the law as it existed at the time of the allegations,” McCarthy said.
Other possible charges, such as second-degree assault, remain misdemeanor offenses in Maryland and subject to a one-year statute of limitations, McCarthy said.
“Based on all the allegations I’ve seen so far, there are a number of legal barriers to criminal prosecutions,” Jordan said.
Allegations and challenges
Ford has accused Kavanaugh of sexually assaulting her more than three decades ago during a summer in the early 1980s, when they were high school students in suburban Maryland. She alleges that Kavanaugh and a friend corralled her in a bedroom during a gathering of teenagers at a house in Montgomery County.
While his friend watched, Ford alleged, Kavanaugh pinned her to a bed, on her back, and groped her through her clothes, grinding his body against hers and clumsily trying to pull off her one-piece bathing suit and the clothing she wore over it. When she tried to scream, she said in Washington on Thursday, he put his hand over her mouth.
Kavanaugh has consistently and categorically denied the allegations. He and his supporters also have pointed to what amounts to legal weaknesses in Ford’s claims, including a lack of corroboration from others.
Pursuing a criminal case in the matter would present challenges beyond the issue of whether the time frame in which to pursue a case has passed.
Among the other challenges: Kavanaugh’s age at the time. Any investigation and prosecution might have to be done under the rules of juvenile proceedings.
“This would be an extremely difficult case to put together after all this time,” said Louis M. Leibowitz, a longtime criminal defense lawyer in Montgomery County.
Before such legal questions, though, an investigation would have to be initiated.
Why police wait for victims
Police in Montgomery County conduct “victim-based” sexual assault investigations, meaning they generally do not launch an investigation until someone speaks to investigators and says he or she wants a criminal case to be opened.
Jordan said that approach is proper.
“Launching this kind of investigation without input and cooperation from victims is looking at it from the wrong direction,” she said. “You’re risking re-traumatizing them again. It would be an even worse idea in cases like this, where detectives would know they’d have very serious legal issues to overcome. What would be the benefit?”
“I don’t think it’s appropriate to conduct a criminal investigation of a reported sexual assault from 35 years ago without the survivor supporting the investigation,” she added.
“Law enforcement has learned a great deal over the years about the best practices for sexual assault investigations,” said Montgomery County Police Chief J. Thomas Manger, who also serves as president of the nationwide Major Cities Chiefs Police Association.
Approaching victims who have not stepped forward and have not indicated they want to speak with investigators can be extremely jarring to them. “You just can’t do that,” Manger said. “It’s morally wrong.”
His department has been asked repeatedly over the past week about why it has not launched an investigation. The agency earlier released a carefully worded answer, which was still in effect Thursday evening and speaks of a “victim-centered” approach:
“At this time, the Montgomery County Police Department has not received a request by any alleged victim nor a victim’s attorney to initiate a police report or a criminal investigation regarding Supreme Court nominee Brett Kavanaugh. The department recognizes that victims of sexual assault may not want to involve law enforcement and/or initiate a criminal investigation, and we respect that position. The department, however, stands prepared to assist anyone who reports being the victim of a sexual assault.”
Jordan said she has heard from rape victim advocates in recent days asking about a possible criminal investigation. She shared an email she had written to them, which in part discussed the legal challenges.
While attempted rape is a felony under current law, the email states, “this was not always the case. Prior to 1996, attempts were also misdemeanors and subject to a one-year statute of limitations.”
“Maryland laws on sex crimes have evolved significantly since the early 1980s,” Jordan added in an interview. “In 1982, there was little awareness of the impact of sexual violence, assaults that did not involve vaginal intercourse were not even considered sex crimes, and many viewed sexual assaults by acquaintances as inconsequential. It’s astounding that any woman ever reported rape.”
https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...4051b6ad114_story.html?utm_term=.aaa0d1e930fb
Maryland Gov. Larry Hogan (R) has called for a “full investigation”into allegations that Supreme Court nominee Brett M. Kavanaugh sexually assaulted Christine Blasey Ford 36 years ago, when both were teenagers.
But neither the Maryland State Police, which reports to Hogan, nor police in Montgomery County, the Washington suburb where the assault allegedly occurred, are likely to launch such a probe.
Here’s why:
1. Hogan’s spokeswoman said last week that the governor “has never used the state police to pursue investigations at his personal whim. That is a very dangerous and slippery slope.”
So while Democratic state lawmakers have asked Hogan to initiate an investigation within Maryland, he is not planning to do so. Instead, he is calling for an unspecified independent investigator, who would presumably report to federal officials.
The Maryland State Police says its policy is to investigate allegations only when a criminal complaint has been filed; Ford has not filed a criminal complaint.
If such a complaint were filed, the state police would turn it over to Montgomery County police.
2. Montgomery County police, too, note that no accuser of Kavanaugh’s has come forward to request a police investigation.
And even if an accuser went to the local department, the statute of limitations appears to have long since passed for pursuing the allegations described in Thursday’s dramatic Senate Judiciary Committee hearing.
The most serious allegation that authorities could pursue, given the sworn testimony provided by Ford, would be attempted rape. But that was considered a misdemeanor in Maryland in 1982, and that would be the relevant legal standard.
As a misdemeanor, the offense carried a one-year statute of limitations, meaning charges would have had to be filed within a year of an incident, according to John McCarthy, Montgomery County’s longtime chief prosecutor. Lisae C. Jordan, the executive director and counsel for the Maryland Coalition Against Sexual Assault, and other longtime Maryland lawyers interviewed in recent days concurred.
The Maryland legislature changed the law in 1996, making attempted rape a felony and removing the statute of limitations, according to McCarthy and Jordan.
“But we’d have to apply the law as it existed at the time of the allegations,” McCarthy said.
Other possible charges, such as second-degree assault, remain misdemeanor offenses in Maryland and subject to a one-year statute of limitations, McCarthy said.
“Based on all the allegations I’ve seen so far, there are a number of legal barriers to criminal prosecutions,” Jordan said.
Allegations and challenges
Ford has accused Kavanaugh of sexually assaulting her more than three decades ago during a summer in the early 1980s, when they were high school students in suburban Maryland. She alleges that Kavanaugh and a friend corralled her in a bedroom during a gathering of teenagers at a house in Montgomery County.
While his friend watched, Ford alleged, Kavanaugh pinned her to a bed, on her back, and groped her through her clothes, grinding his body against hers and clumsily trying to pull off her one-piece bathing suit and the clothing she wore over it. When she tried to scream, she said in Washington on Thursday, he put his hand over her mouth.
Kavanaugh has consistently and categorically denied the allegations. He and his supporters also have pointed to what amounts to legal weaknesses in Ford’s claims, including a lack of corroboration from others.
Pursuing a criminal case in the matter would present challenges beyond the issue of whether the time frame in which to pursue a case has passed.
Among the other challenges: Kavanaugh’s age at the time. Any investigation and prosecution might have to be done under the rules of juvenile proceedings.
“This would be an extremely difficult case to put together after all this time,” said Louis M. Leibowitz, a longtime criminal defense lawyer in Montgomery County.
Before such legal questions, though, an investigation would have to be initiated.
Why police wait for victims
Police in Montgomery County conduct “victim-based” sexual assault investigations, meaning they generally do not launch an investigation until someone speaks to investigators and says he or she wants a criminal case to be opened.
Jordan said that approach is proper.
“Launching this kind of investigation without input and cooperation from victims is looking at it from the wrong direction,” she said. “You’re risking re-traumatizing them again. It would be an even worse idea in cases like this, where detectives would know they’d have very serious legal issues to overcome. What would be the benefit?”
“I don’t think it’s appropriate to conduct a criminal investigation of a reported sexual assault from 35 years ago without the survivor supporting the investigation,” she added.
“Law enforcement has learned a great deal over the years about the best practices for sexual assault investigations,” said Montgomery County Police Chief J. Thomas Manger, who also serves as president of the nationwide Major Cities Chiefs Police Association.
Approaching victims who have not stepped forward and have not indicated they want to speak with investigators can be extremely jarring to them. “You just can’t do that,” Manger said. “It’s morally wrong.”
His department has been asked repeatedly over the past week about why it has not launched an investigation. The agency earlier released a carefully worded answer, which was still in effect Thursday evening and speaks of a “victim-centered” approach:
“At this time, the Montgomery County Police Department has not received a request by any alleged victim nor a victim’s attorney to initiate a police report or a criminal investigation regarding Supreme Court nominee Brett Kavanaugh. The department recognizes that victims of sexual assault may not want to involve law enforcement and/or initiate a criminal investigation, and we respect that position. The department, however, stands prepared to assist anyone who reports being the victim of a sexual assault.”
Jordan said she has heard from rape victim advocates in recent days asking about a possible criminal investigation. She shared an email she had written to them, which in part discussed the legal challenges.
While attempted rape is a felony under current law, the email states, “this was not always the case. Prior to 1996, attempts were also misdemeanors and subject to a one-year statute of limitations.”
“Maryland laws on sex crimes have evolved significantly since the early 1980s,” Jordan added in an interview. “In 1982, there was little awareness of the impact of sexual violence, assaults that did not involve vaginal intercourse were not even considered sex crimes, and many viewed sexual assaults by acquaintances as inconsequential. It’s astounding that any woman ever reported rape.”
https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...4051b6ad114_story.html?utm_term=.aaa0d1e930fb
so you agree that he groped her. right?