Just who are the bad guys in the polygamy case?

[FightTheFuture]

Hilarious tragedy that the government has created an "emergency disaster situation".

$60,000 per day to care for the kids and mothers. Just a drop in the bucket. Legal costs, hundreds of attorneys, etc.

700 Child "Protective" Service Workers, 150 city employees

http://www.scrippsnews.com/node/32246

You've got the best and the brightest workin' in the gummint here fer shur. The experts could not think of a better way to handle this. We are in control here.

I wonder how many years this will drag on for. Well, we could not find much to hang them on, but we sure did make a mess of things.

 

[FightTheFuture]

Quote from nutmeg:





Like Viet nam. Take a hill, then retreat. Next day take the same hill. I've read some on the various wars (drugs, poverty, etc) the people who are/were commited to the cause ended up frustrated, unable to finsh what was started, somewhere someone higher up in the beaucracy always called for the retreat. The black hole of accountability, by design.

Yup, with a few that really care and want to make things better for people, and can't do a thing about it except go through the motions to keep their job hoping that one day...

 

[ratboy88]

Quote from trendlover:

So say the warrant is void, and then the DNA tests show many girls who gave birth at 13, 14 15 years old, and the fathers are much older, and those same fathers are proved through DNA to have many other children with many different women of young ages who are thier wives, BUT becasue the warrent is void, they all get off and go back to their compound where they continue to brainswash little boys and girls to benefit a few. Is that good? These men have many wives and its illegal, but it is ignored. They have many children who not always can be taken care of.

well the legal age to marry w/parental consent was 14 back in june 2005. and if all these people share parents.. then they will have an extremely difficult times proving who did what just by using dna samples.

and polygamy is illegal but if they are legally married to one woman... but then have sex with other women.. we are talking adultery now.. wanna enforce that one across the country?

 

[trendlover]

Quote from ratboy88:

well.. considering the phone call was a hoax and the sheriff's unnamed informant was working closely with this hoax'er/criminal.. i would say the warrant is void as hell now. btw, the hoax'er is an obama delegate.. i kid you not.


then you have the sheriff admitting he has been pressured by the locals in the past to raid the ranch. and not to be dismissed lightly, oil has recently been found next to the property... 200 yards from the property line. jeffs doesn't have mineral rights.. but he does have control of executive rights. who knows.. i think a lot more is to come.

I see what you are leading to. The reason for the raid was not for the well being of the kids and women, but oil. This is your speculation yes? Who knows?

 

[trendlover]

Quote from ratboy88:

well the legal age to marry w/parental consent was 14 back in june 2005. and if all these people share parents.. then they will have an extremely difficult times proving who did what just by using dna samples.

and polygamy is illegal but if they are legally married to one woman... but then have sex with other women.. we are talking adultery now.. wanna enforce that one across the country?

You are right, Warren Jeffs, his father and other past leaders all knew the loopholes of law, and knew legally to only have one legal marriage..others are considered spiritual. But the women who were born and raised into this cult know no different and from birth are brainwashed and bullied to be submissive and compliant. Did this men break the law by not allowing these womens their constitutional right to and education, and the freedom to make their own choices?

ps you are a tough debate ratboy, are you a lawyer?

 

[ratboy88]

Quote from trendlover:

I see what you are leading to. The reason for the raid was not for the well being of the kids and women, but oil. This is your speculation yes? Who knows?

actually i think the greatest pressure came from the locals. they pressured sheriff doran for 4 years. his informant flora jessop spent 30 to 40 hrs on the phone with rozita e swinton (the obama delegate...LOL).

flora relayed all of the info from swinton to doran and then someone coerced swinton to call the women's shelter in west texas. that's why they have sealed the records on the informant(flora jessop) and also the arrest records of swinton.

they know the warrant is garbage.. but they sure as hell don't want that info getting out.

i wouldn't even be surprised if flora made the call to the hotline for swinton. flora and doran had been itching to go in there for 4 years. i can tell you right now they know exactly where the phone call to the women's shelter came from.

 

[nutmeg]

Rat,

You are building a chain of influence, for what purpose- a movie {:>)? The oil, the Obama delegate, the age of consent law, the whack job flora, the hot line call. Meanwhile, back at the ranch, the polygamists are using the very same tool - the law. When the white hat uses the law it grows into a conspiracy? Yet when the bad guy uses the law, somehow his use of the law is more righteous and without conspiracy?

What is wrong for society to change the age of consent? You make this sound as an immoral tatic. The polygamists have the same avenue to change the law in their favor.

 

[trendlover]

Quote from ratboy88:

actually i think the greatest pressure came from the locals. they pressured sheriff doran for 4 years. his informant flora jessop spent 30 to 40 hrs on the phone with rozita e swinton (the obama delegate...LOL).

flora relayed all of the info from swinton to doran and then someone coerced swinton to call the women's shelter in west texas. that's why they have sealed the records on the informant(flora jessop) and also the arrest records of swinton.

they know the warrant is garbage.. but they sure as hell don't want that info getting out.

i wouldn't even be surprised if flora made the call to the hotline for swinton. flora and doran had been itching to go in there for 4 years. i can tell you right now they know exactly where the phone call to the women's shelter came from. [/QUOTE

What does it matter why or where the pressure came from. Yes the locals could see a communtiy was being built very quickly around them. Warren Jeffs bought a big peice of land and then quickly gathered together his cheap labor to build his compound. And those that labored to build were under the delusion they did this for god. Then Jeffs moves his cult to this new secretive compound, which pay lots of taxes (good for the town) but otherwise the people only socialize to buy food, or do business. Police do not go in, no one in the town can interact, and they are free to break the law without being seen. I say, flora was just what was needed!

 

[trendlover]

Quote from nutmeg:

Rat,

You are building a chain of influence, for what purpose- a movie {:>)? The oil, the Obama delegate, the age of consent law, the whack job flora, the hot line call. Meanwhile, back at the ranch, the polygamists are using the very same tool - the law. When the white hat uses the law it grows into a conspiracy? Yet when the bad guy uses the law, somehow his use of the law is more righteous and without conspiracy?

What is wrong for society to change the age of consent? You make this sound as an immoral tatic. The polygamists have the same avenue to change the law in their favor.

Yes! Nutmeg has a good point ratboy. It is true that this cult has used the law to its advantage. These men that have built this are not so primitive as the women and children they produce and marry. They know exactly waht they are doing by the law..but their wives (legal or not) and thier children are the primitive and clueless ones. It is about power, sex with young and many girls, and money.

 

[ratboy88]

Quote from trendlover:

Yes! Nutmeg has a good point ratboy. It is true that this cult has used the law to its advantage. These men that have built this are not so primitive as the women and children they produce and marry. They know exactly waht they are doing by the law..but their wives (legal or not) and thier children are the primitive and clueless ones. It is about power, sex with young and many girls, and money.

you have been very respectful during our debate.. i have no doubt you are sincere. i will let Andy sum up my answer/reply:

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