Job Fight: Immigrants vs. Locals

http://it.truveo.com/Charlie-Rose-November-15-1994/id/117474832


"What is the good of having an economy which grows by 80% if your unemployment – people excluded from active economic life – goes from 420,000 to 5.1million?”

“You go and you create a corporation in China. And you build a factory in China. And what do you want to sell, mugs? You sell mugs in China. And you conquer part of the Chinese market by competing fair and square in China. That’s life. That’s adding to the activity of China. You’re a corporate citizen over there, you’re working over there.”

“But if you move a factory from the States and take that to China, not so as to conquer the chinese market but so as to re-import the goods into the States, so as to get cheap labor, what are you doing? What you are doing is you are saying to your employees here, ‘You’re too expensive, folks. You want money. You want protection. You want unions. You want holidays. Forget it! We can employ 47 people over there (for each one of you) who want nothing.’”

“So, don’t confuse 2 issues. One is going out to participate in their growing economies by building there and conquering part of the market. The other is merely killing off employment in your own country, getting rid of your own labor force – transferring it over there and importing it back – purely so as to increase your profit margins.”

“Now, the average company has about 25% of it’s costs in labor costs, including the social costs, the welfare costs around it, 25%. When you move – 25% of volume, that is – you, all of a sudden, can save over 25%, so your profits go leaping up. But you’re destroying – totally destroying – not only the number of people who’ve got jobs but also their salaries.”

“Now, you realize that salaries in the States – earnings, weekly earnings, hourly earnings over the last 20 years – have already dropped about 19% in real dollars. It’s already been a massive decline and that is why the so called recovery – which is a recovery of economic indexes – hasn’t got the feel good factor because people’s salaries have gone down. They’re gonna go down much more. It’s only beginning and the reason is very straightforward.”

“When you manufacture something, anything – this table – you have a value added. The value added is when you take the raw materials and you manufacture a product. Value you add is known as value added. And that is shared between capital and labor. And the whole division – the sharing of that – has been the subject of massive debates for generations. How much should go to capital? How much should go to labor? You’ve had strikes, you’ve had lockouts, you’ve had political debates.”

“All of a sudden, by creating a global marketplace for labor, by creating circumstances where people are making the same product with the same technology for the same capital and the only variant is cost of labor, you are shattering that – shattering the way you share the value added and that means that you are destroying the basis on which we’ve been able to create an equilibrium and have a stable society.”

“I am entirely for free enterprise. I am for free markets. I’m not for the destruction of one’s society.”

“The economy is there to serve the fundamental needs of society, which are prosperity, which are stability, and which are contentment. That is the basis of my thinking. And what I’m saying at this stage is that if, purely for an economic doctrine, you have a situation whereby the economy grows but you create poverty, unemployment, and you destabilize the society, you’re in trouble.”

“Look what’s happened in the last 50 years. You see, people are not willing to look at fundamentals. When I was a boy we were taught that irreversibly we were moving towards progress. That material wealth, material prosperity would solve our problems, would improve our way of life, and improve our civilization. We were taught that. And we achieved the creation of material prosperity in a way which we would never have dreamt of. We made the economy grow 400%. Incredible! And what have we done? We destabilized our society. We’ve increased unemployment massively. We’ve totally destabilized our cities. We’ve uprooted our countryside. We’ve increased crime. Every single viable criteria for a stable society has become negative. Therefore, something must be wrong. And what has become wrong is that instead of the economy being there to serve us, we are there adoring, serving economic indexes.”

“The facts are that people who benefit are big major corporations. There is a divorce between the interests of major corporations and of society. When one used to say and believe – and probably rightly – what is good for General Motors is good for the United States. That is no longer true. Today the transnational corporations have annual sales of $4.8trillion. They account for 1/3 of all – the top alone account for 1/3 of – direct investment. Now how do they operate? They’re no longer linked to the United States, the american ones, or to France or to Britain. They operate by farming out their production to whatever company produces the cheapest labor, wherever they can get the biggest return on capital, and pay the lowest part to labor.”

“Firstly, it started with the textile industries, and the shoes, and those industries were decimated. We lost millions of employment, of people employed. Secondly, it was followed by the high tech industries. And as I say in the last few months we’ve had those. Thirdly, the service industries – these are facts – the service industries, they’ve been moving offshore. There are satellites up there. If you take Swiss Air. Swiss Air has moved part of its back office into Bombay. Why? Because they can communicate through the satellites and reduce their costs by 95%.”
 
Quote from MandelbrotSet:

Unfortunately, you've posted a very good and timely article.

I think there should be extremely long-term unemployment benifits (about 5 years or so) combined with basic medical coverage so that people can survivie while trying to get their feet underneath them and do better for themselves.
[/i] :eek:
More...

5 years of unemployment bennies? get real brotha that's semi-retired. the solution you are searching for is called "savings". people spent all they had, borrowed against the appreciation in their homes, etc... they would have been better off living blow their means.

We are just seeing the beginning of immigrant backlash. It will get worse. Immigrants are an easy target to demonize. Here in Cali people are waking up & realizing you can't have open borders, min-wage workers having six kids, free medial for immigrants & their spawn, housing of immigrants criminals in state prisons, etc.
 
"I don't mind doing any kind of work," Ms. Aye, a petite 22-year-old, said that evening as she settled into a reclining beach chair she bought at Goodwill.

Farther back in the line, marked by orange tape and monitored by police, locals like David Curtis seethed. "This is the worst job I have ever applied for," said the 31-year-old welder,
--------------------------------

Check out the attitude.

The local hasn't even worked one day and concluded it is the worst job.

Bingo, We have a disgruntled employee before he even has the job.
 
I am an immigrant myself. I happily paid every tax known to mankind for 10 years before receiving my residency even though I knew I had no eligibility for benefits. I have no problems paying into the system. I consider it opportunity cost and don't try too hard to avoid taxes.

What I still don't understand is why are kids of illegal immigrants citizens? Shouldn't derived action be illegal too? If Ireland can do it whats stopping USA? I think that's the single biggest reason for border crossings. (I am in CA)


Quote from nutmeg:

"I don't mind doing any kind of work," Ms. Aye, a petite 22-year-old, said that evening as she settled into a reclining beach chair she bought at Goodwill.

Farther back in the line, marked by orange tape and monitored by police, locals like David Curtis seethed. "This is the worst job I have ever applied for," said the 31-year-old welder,
--------------------------------

Check out the attitude.

The local hasn't even worked one day and concluded it is the worst job.

Bingo, We have a disgruntled employee before he even has the job.
More...
 
The United States in their current financial situation should be begging for immigrants. They'll need all the young workers that they can get to help pay for the huge unfunded social security payments that are coming.

Immigrants don't destroy an economy. If an immigrant, legal or illegal has enough ambition to leave their homeland, they'll typically have ambition to work, save and get ahead. The contribution that they make to the economy will more than offset the job that they might displace.

Imports don't directly harm an economy either. If Joe American makes $50,000 a year but spends $75000 on a big American made truck, somewhere down the line the extra $25,000 has to come from outside the country. If his neighbor makes $50,000 and only spends $25,000 on a Toyota and he invests the other $25,000, he is helping to build the country up with his investment.

What is destroying the American economy is the excessive debt carried by the people and the government. There is only one thing of value left in the United States that the foreign debt holders can spend their American dollars on. They'll use the cash to buy American stocks once the price has fallen low enough.

All of the above might sound unpatriotic or anti American. However, if the people truly wanted to build up America, they would stop looking for scapegoats, study the true problems and find solutions.
 
It should be clear to all that the War on Communism was War OF Communism. The elite bankers have nutured China and provided material aid and support to the Communist regime.

Now, Commuism is the dominant economic superpower in the world. Well done, we've been distracted by all the BS flag-waving brainwashing campaigns thrown at us by the elites and moneychangers. Look how these have destroyed our society and culture: radical femminism, PC, globalism, 'green movement', unfettered immigration.

But that was the goal all along. Surely you knew that? If not it will become increasingly clearer to you.

Hope is lost, our sprits are broken. Kids have turned to drug. We've seen our religions ridiculed and destroyed. Every popular show like Simpsons, Family Guys, SNL, riducules Christians and protrays them as raving bible nuts or as child molestors.

Kids believe in nothing, no inter-conectedness; drugs are an attempt to connect with themselves and others. Problem is, no amount of drugs will do what the human sprit is capable of.

Ooops, we're not even allowed to use the world Sprit in our schools, that would be non-PC and non-inclusive!! Bad me.

Who is behind this? The first thing an invading army does is to take over the media outlets. The people are defeated by way of Propaganda.
 
its a no brainer? who would hire an american?

id rather chose an immigrant who will work hard and is grateful to have employment. with no sense of entitlement or knowledge of local and state laws lol
 
There aren't any solutions really. In expansions, workers get left behind so the business sector loosens up credit to increase their capacity utilization. It was that way in the 20's, again in the 90's and now they are trying to reinflate one more time... the ones that use the credit strictly to buy inflating assets do ok but the credit card junkie and lazy types get steamrolled.. added to the mix this time, however, is a large underclass of both poor and rich that live on public sector money. Those barnacles on the ships of state might suffer for real this time around, especially the poor sector. In fact, I believe they might be what will turn inflation into hyperinflation. As the inflation rises recipients of all kinds will be in revolt and demanding more which leads to more printing which leads to.......
 
You ARE THE MAN! Great post!

Quote from TorontoTrader2:

It should be clear to all that the War on Communism was War OF Communism. The elite bankers have nutured China and provided material aid and support to the Communist regime.

Now, Commuism is the dominant economic superpower in the world. Well done, we've been distracted by all the BS flag-waving brainwashing campaigns thrown at us by the elites and moneychangers. Look how these have destroyed our society and culture: radical femminism, PC, globalism, 'green movement', unfettered immigration.

But that was the goal all along. Surely you knew that? If not it will become increasingly clearer to you.

Hope is lost, our sprits are broken. Kids have turned to drug. We've seen our religions ridiculed and destroyed. Every popular show like Simpsons, Family Guys, SNL, riducules Christians and protrays them as raving bible nuts or as child molestors.

Kids believe in nothing, no inter-conectedness; drugs are an attempt to connect with themselves and others. Problem is, no amount of drugs will do what the human sprit is capable of.

Ooops, we're not even allowed to use the world Sprit in our schools, that would be non-PC and non-inclusive!! Bad me.

Who is behind this? The first thing an invading army does is to take over the media outlets. The people are defeated by way of Propaganda.
More...
 
Quote from TheDudeofLife:

http://it.truveo.com/Charlie-Rose-November-15-1994/id/117474832


"What is the good of having an economy which grows by 80% if your unemployment – people excluded from active economic life – goes from 420,000 to 5.1million?”

“You go and you create a corporation in China. And you build a factory in China. And what do you want to sell, mugs? You sell mugs in China. And you conquer part of the Chinese market by competing fair and square in China. That’s life. That’s adding to the activity of China. You’re a corporate citizen over there, you’re working over there.”

“But if you move a factory from the States and take that to China, not so as to conquer the chinese market but so as to re-import the goods into the States, so as to get cheap labor, what are you doing? What you are doing is you are saying to your employees here, ‘You’re too expensive, folks. You want money. You want protection. You want unions. You want holidays. Forget it! We can employ 47 people over there (for each one of you) who want nothing.’”

“So, don’t confuse 2 issues. One is going out to participate in their growing economies by building there and conquering part of the market. The other is merely killing off employment in your own country, getting rid of your own labor force – transferring it over there and importing it back – purely so as to increase your profit margins.”

“Now, the average company has about 25% of it’s costs in labor costs, including the social costs, the welfare costs around it, 25%. When you move – 25% of volume, that is – you, all of a sudden, can save over 25%, so your profits go leaping up. But you’re destroying – totally destroying – not only the number of people who’ve got jobs but also their salaries.”

“Now, you realize that salaries in the States – earnings, weekly earnings, hourly earnings over the last 20 years – have already dropped about 19% in real dollars. It’s already been a massive decline and that is why the so called recovery – which is a recovery of economic indexes – hasn’t got the feel good factor because people’s salaries have gone down. They’re gonna go down much more. It’s only beginning and the reason is very straightforward.”

“When you manufacture something, anything – this table – you have a value added. The value added is when you take the raw materials and you manufacture a product. Value you add is known as value added. And that is shared between capital and labor. And the whole division – the sharing of that – has been the subject of massive debates for generations. How much should go to capital? How much should go to labor? You’ve had strikes, you’ve had lockouts, you’ve had political debates.”

“All of a sudden, by creating a global marketplace for labor, by creating circumstances where people are making the same product with the same technology for the same capital and the only variant is cost of labor, you are shattering that – shattering the way you share the value added and that means that you are destroying the basis on which we’ve been able to create an equilibrium and have a stable society.”

“I am entirely for free enterprise. I am for free markets. I’m not for the destruction of one’s society.”

“The economy is there to serve the fundamental needs of society, which are prosperity, which are stability, and which are contentment. That is the basis of my thinking. And what I’m saying at this stage is that if, purely for an economic doctrine, you have a situation whereby the economy grows but you create poverty, unemployment, and you destabilize the society, you’re in trouble.”

“Look what’s happened in the last 50 years. You see, people are not willing to look at fundamentals. When I was a boy we were taught that irreversibly we were moving towards progress. That material wealth, material prosperity would solve our problems, would improve our way of life, and improve our civilization. We were taught that. And we achieved the creation of material prosperity in a way which we would never have dreamt of. We made the economy grow 400%. Incredible! And what have we done? We destabilized our society. We’ve increased unemployment massively. We’ve totally destabilized our cities. We’ve uprooted our countryside. We’ve increased crime. Every single viable criteria for a stable society has become negative. Therefore, something must be wrong. And what has become wrong is that instead of the economy being there to serve us, we are there adoring, serving economic indexes.”

“The facts are that people who benefit are big major corporations. There is a divorce between the interests of major corporations and of society. When one used to say and believe – and probably rightly – what is good for General Motors is good for the United States. That is no longer true. Today the transnational corporations have annual sales of $4.8trillion. They account for 1/3 of all – the top alone account for 1/3 of – direct investment. Now how do they operate? They’re no longer linked to the United States, the american ones, or to France or to Britain. They operate by farming out their production to whatever company produces the cheapest labor, wherever they can get the biggest return on capital, and pay the lowest part to labor.”

“Firstly, it started with the textile industries, and the shoes, and those industries were decimated. We lost millions of employment, of people employed. Secondly, it was followed by the high tech industries. And as I say in the last few months we’ve had those. Thirdly, the service industries – these are facts – the service industries, they’ve been moving offshore. There are satellites up there. If you take Swiss Air. Swiss Air has moved part of its back office into Bombay. Why? Because they can communicate through the satellites and reduce their costs by 95%.”
More...

You have contributed an important issue where our good, old currency discussion begins. Countries like the UK and other have the possibility to prop up demand by currency devaluation. I see the affinity of the U.S.A. to devalue in order to generate new demand. BUT, BUT, BUT : when will finally the Chinese problem be resolved ? The US has exported so many jobs to China and allowed the auto industry to stumble !

Unfortunately, the Chinese hold big chunks of T Bonds right now in the middle of a severe crisis and this administration has been warned at one occassion VERY, VERY direct what will happen if the currency issue becomes a topic between the two countries.

Do you remember HOW FAST Geithner revoked his remarks of China being a currency manipulator ? As I recall when China´s leadership asked for some "guarantee" for their bond holdings...
 
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