is trading less riskier then starting a business?

[NoDoji]

Quote from hanzahar:

surprisingly 90% of business (small) fail within 5 years.

if you are not an employee type of person which path will your pursue and have better chances of success? (anyway what is success in trading anyway since there is no guarantee of a profit for the next trade)

trading or business... other businesses e.g restaurant,motel etc.

1. 50% of small businesses succeed for at least 5 years

2. Profitable trading is a business and should be treated as such, meaning don't place a penny of capital on the line until you've completed your R&D, created a robust trading plan, and tested it thoroughly.

3. "...what is success in trading anyway since there is no guarantee of a profit for the next trade" --- This is what consistently unprofitable traders believe.

 

[mobutu]

Quote from clacy:

I am an owner/operator of a small business, and I also trade, although I tend to be more of a position/swing trader, which is much easier than day trading, IMO.

I find both are very difficult. Obviously it has to be that way, or everyone would be doing one or both. Who would put up with being unemployed or facing the corporate world, if owning your own business were easy? The same could be said for trading obviously.

The real answer to your question, is that it probably depends on the skillset of the individual. Personally, I find operating and building a business more challenging. Any time you have customers and employees (and we have a lot of them because we're in a low per-employee/customer business), you have a lot of stressful bullshit to deal with. There is rarely a month that goes by that someone doesn't threaten a lawsuit (mostly employees but sometimes customers).

You have:

-Worker's comp claims by employees
-Liability and property claims by customers
-An endless amount of governmental regulation and paperwork
-Tons of liability defensive practices, which is mostly wasted time.
-I literally have months where I average 110+ hours/week of work time
-Obtaining financing
-Sales tax, unemployment taxes, income taxes, employer payroll taxes, use taxes as well as 6 different forms of insurance coverages and countless permits, fees and licenses go along with businesses.

Of course trading has its own set of problems.

Both are very difficult, and mathematically improbable, which is exactly why you have such high income potential.

No wonder you have problems and find things difficult in business and trading. You run your business like its 1850. Employees??? LMFAO. No one hires employees anymore-- use subcontractors and part timers. Only morons hire full time any longer. Liability claims? Property claims? Buy insurance-- use a outside adjuster to lower claim and handle it. Work 110 hours per week?? WTF?? Why have a business at all, freedom is the key. You sound like a slave. Taxes are mostly due to your old fashion belief in employees.

You need to reevaluate your priorities.

 

[hanzahar]

Quote from NoDoji:

1. 50% of small businesses succeed for at least 5 years

2. Profitable trading is a business and should be treated as such, meaning don't place a penny of capital on the line until you've completed your R&D, created a robust trading plan, and tested it thoroughly.

3. "...what is success in trading anyway since there is no guarantee of a profit for the next trade" --- This is what consistently unprofitable traders believe.

any threads to share on consistent profitable trades?

thank you for the time

 

[clacy]

Quote from mobutu:

No wonder you have problems and find things difficult in business and trading. You run your business like its 1850. Employees??? LMFAO. No one hires employees anymore-- use subcontractors and part timers. Only morons hire full time any longer. Liability claims? Property claims? Buy insurance-- use a outside adjuster to lower claim and handle it. Work 110 hours per week?? WTF?? Why have a business at all, freedom is the key. You sound like a slave. Taxes are mostly due to your old fashion belief in employees.

You need to reevaluate your priorities.

There are many guidelines on classifications of employees and subs so it's not feasible in my industry. I do use a lot of part-timers. In fact we have over 200 PT employees, but there are negative aspects to PT workers as well. High turnover, and poor quality.

There are many taxes that are unavoidable, including state/local sales & use taxes on all transactions so they are not just payroll related.

Also, I do have many types of insurance but it sounds like you dp not understand how insurance works. When you file claims, premiums rise.

You sound like a typical, clueless internet moron that has never succeeded at anything but talks a big game.

It's clear you have no clue what you're talking about related to my business. In fact, I'd wager to say you've never made a business transaction in your life.

My guess is you read the 4 Hour Work Week 5 years ago, and that summarizes your business experience.

 

[blakpacman]

Quote from clacy:

There are many guidelines on classifications of employees and subs so it's not feasible in my industry. I do use a lot of part-timers. In fact we have over 200 PT employees, but there are negative aspects to PT workers as well. High turnover, and poor quality.

There are many taxes that are unavoidable, including state/local sales & use taxes on all transactions so they are not just payroll related.

Also, I do have many types of insurance but it sounds like you dp not understand how insurance works. When you file claims, premiums rise.

You sound like a typical, clueless internet moron that has never succeeded at anything but talks a big game.

It's clear you have no clue what you're talking about related to my business. In fact, I'd wager to say you've never made a business transaction in your life.

My guess is you read the 4 Hour Work Week 5 years ago, and that summarizes your business experience.

Msgboards are filled with guys like this.
200 is a heck of a lot of PTers. What kind of business do you run, if I may inquire?

 

[Handle123]

Quote from hanzahar:

if starting a business is less riskier then day trading... why people day trade? because people assume they have better chances of succeeding and it is easier? (low cost)

As dumb as this sounds, too many people actually believe they can compete with those who breath trading, well capitalized, developed into robots, learned to program to do thousands of backtests. Those who have done 30,000 plus hours of screen time, we lick our chops just waiting for the inexperienced to hit the mouse.

Whether you start a business or trade, you have to be well educated for the endeavor you are starting and well capitalized. Way way way too many want to open an account and go for it, whereas if they studied first for 2-3 years, papertraded, learn to program, and start on long term trading first, they be ahead of the 90% who lose and quit.

Start with papertrading account, $50k, when you have tripled it 3 seperate times, then you are a ton more ready than a guy who hasn't.

 

[slumdog]

In trading you define the risk.

You can risk 0.1% of your capital or you can risk 10% or you can risk 100% of your capital in one go.

If you risk 0.1% of capital you might never have more than a 1 or 2% drawdown, ever. Assumes you have an edge. Of course your upside will be limited too.

But trading can be a very low risk business or it can be high risk, its entirely up to you.

 

[Redneck]

Each endeavor is risky

And each has their unique risk


imho:

Thinking a losing trade(s) is a trader’s biggest risk to successful trading – is naïve

But I do understand how & why one does

RN

 

[mu2pilot]

I think the better, more relevant question is, in which endeavor (trading versus a small business) am I more likely to succeed and make a reasonable return on my investment of capital and sweat equity?

I have started several businesses and have experienced moderate success (I built one of my businesses from $200,000/yr gross sales to a business with 150 employees and sold it for $2.5mm). I've also failed in some of the businesses I started or acquired.

I have tried to be make it as a trader, but have yet to succeed in that endeavor.

Based on what I know about both, I think that the average person has a higher probability of succeeding in a small business than as a trader.

The amount of time that you put in learning how to succeed needs to be included in the investment cost of both endeavors.

 

[hanzahar]

Quote from Handle123:

As dumb as this sounds, too many people actually believe they can compete with those who breath trading, well capitalized, developed into robots, learned to program to do thousands of backtests. Those who have done 30,000 plus hours of screen time, we lick our chops just waiting for the inexperienced to hit the mouse.

Whether you start a business or trade, you have to be well educated for the endeavor you are starting and well capitalized. Way way way too many want to open an account and go for it, whereas if they studied first for 2-3 years, papertraded, learn to program, and start on long term trading first, they be ahead of the 90% who lose and quit.

Start with papertrading account, $50k, when you have tripled it 3 seperate times, then you are a ton more ready than a guy who hasn't.

thank you will thinkorswim paper trading on 20 mins delayed data feed do the trick?