Is there an order in the Universe?

[ZZZzzzzzzz]

Really, to make your case, all you have to do is demonstrate examples of non-God, creating, producing, and maintaining the degree of complexity, order, regularity, etc. that we all see daily....

As soon as yall "scientists" can produce a solar system in your labs, I have little doubt yall will be able to convert some folks to your way of thinking...

Quote from vhehn:

you make my point nicely. when you say"as a matter of fact the odds are so against it happened by chance that intelligent design is the only other option" you are saying. "i dont understand how xxx could have happened so it had to be god". that is an argument from ignorance.

 

[ZZZzzzzzzz]

If odds can actually be calculated on such a thing, I would say that intelligent design has better odds than say, ignorant chance of creating our known universe, ya...

Of course, I would be willing to see your examples of something similar to natural law being generated from ignorant chance...

Quote from vhehn:

i suppose you consider this solid proof? "as a matter of fact the odds are so against it happened by chance that intelligent design is the only other option"

 

[stu]

Quote from ElCubano:

...as a matter of fact the odds are so against it happened by chance that intelligent design is the only other option...

thing is ...it is not a matter of fact. What odds?. What chance?

But for the sake of argument, say all that were the case, why would you limit your ideas to 'intelligent design' being the only other option?

Why not 'unintelligent design as another option? Staying with the speculation the odds were against and quite by chance completely natural unintelligent events designed the universe one bit on top or the next? eh?

 

[ElCubano]

Quote from vhehn:

you make my point nicely. when you say"as a matter of fact the odds are so against it happened by chance that intelligent design is the only other option" you are saying. "i dont understand how xxx could have happened so it had to be god". that is an argument from ignorance.

no it isn't...if it didn't happen by chance please elaborate on what other options are available to us besides intelligent design ..and then we can move forward..i am saying that neither argument can be proved..not yours not mine...if you can please show me the proof....you are making an argument as if you showed us some proof and you haven't...you are the one talking with ignorance. im saying that the odds are soo against ur argument that the chances are that it was the other option ( intelligent design) ..then i go a step forward and say i respect what u think for i cant prove mine..all that i ask is that you respect mine since you can prove urs...whats so hard about that???

 

[ElCubano]

Quote from stu:

thing is ...it is not a matter of fact. What odds?. What chance?

But for the sake of argument, say all that were the case, why would you limit your ideas to 'intelligent design' being the only other option?

Why not 'unintelligent design as another option? Staying with the speculation the odds were against and quite by chance completely natural unintelligent events designed the universe one bit on top or the next? eh?

cmon write this so i can understand it...you know im stupid

 

[stu]

Quote from ElCubano:

cmon write this so i can understand it...you know im stupid

LOL kiss me Cuban!
(not on the lips dude!)

 

[Free Thinker]

Quote from ElCubano:

no it isn't...if it didn't happen by chance please elaborate on what other options are available to us besides intelligent design ..and then we can move forward..i am saying that neither argument can be proved..not yours not mine...if you can please show me the proof....you are making an argument as if you showed us some proof and you haven't...you are the one talking with ignorance. im saying that the odds are soo against ur argument that the chances are that it was the other option ( intelligent design) ..then i go a step forward and say i respect what u think for i cant prove mine..all that i ask is that you respect mine since you can prove urs...whats so hard about that???

read through these and take the time to think through the implications:
http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/richard_carrier/addendaB.html
Addendum B: Are the Odds Against the Origin of Life Too Great to Accept?All too frequently we hear statistics being offered to "prove" that the odds against the origin of life are so great that we must posit a Creator to explain the event. David Foster, for example, whose book I critique through the link at the bottom of this essay, uses the odds of spontaneously assembling the genome of the T4 bacteriophage, and also the human hemoglobin molecule, as proof of the impossibility of life, even though no one thinks the T4 genome or hemoglobin has ever been assembled at random

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/abioprob/abioprob.html
Lies, Damned Lies, Statistics,
and Probability of Abiogenesis Calculations

 

[ElCubano]

Quote from vhehn:

read through these and take the time to think through the implications:
http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/richard_carrier/addendaB.html
Addendum B: Are the Odds Against the Origin of Life Too Great to Accept?All too frequently we hear statistics being offered to "prove" that the odds against the origin of life are so great that we must posit a Creator to explain the event. David Foster, for example, whose book I critique through the link at the bottom of this essay, uses the odds of spontaneously assembling the genome of the T4 bacteriophage, and also the human hemoglobin molecule, as proof of the impossibility of life, even though no one thinks the T4 genome or hemoglobin has ever been assembled at random

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/abioprob/abioprob.html
Lies, Damned Lies, Statistics,
and Probability of Abiogenesis Calculations

Vehn c'mon dude...for everything you send me to read i can send you a link that reads the other way...im not going to argue with you..I respect what you think and how you want to view your existence...but until you show me that we are here by chance with proof to back it up..why would you continue as though you know for a fact?? are you 100% sure that we came by chance?? and if so please just show me your proof?? thats all im asking...thats not much to ask is it??? I want to believe you trust me i do...just show me the pudding..

you do know that there are super mcduper supr duper smart scientists that dont think the way you do...dare call them ignorant and not back up ur smack...cmon

 

[ZZZzzzzzzz]

You are being too reasonable...

These cats worship man and scientist just like some thesits worship Jesus and God...

Quote from ElCubano:

Vehn c'mon dude...for everything you send me to read i can send you a link that reads the other way...im not going to argue with you..I respect what you think and how you want to view your existence...but until you show me that we are here by chance with proof to back it up..why would you continue as though you know for a fact?? are you 100% sure that we came by chance?? and if so please just show me your proof?? thats all im asking...thats not much to ask is it??? I want to believe you trust me i do...just show me the pudding..

you do know that there are super mcduper supr duper smart scientists that dont think the way you do...dare call them ignorant and not back up ur smack...cmon

 

[Free Thinker]

Quote from ElCubano:

are you 100% sure that we came by chance?? and if so please just show me your proof??

no i am not 100% sure. i am only 100% sure it never happened like the bible says it happened.
i am open to any new evidence that goddidit. do you have any?