I don't believe I am any less capable than any other trader out there. I believe with time I will develop a deep understanding of the bond market. I am not one to simply give up on a market just because I lost money. If I lose the rest of my money, then I will have to go to work, save up, and start again. As much as I'd hate to have to do that, it looks like that is what I will have to do. To tell me to give up because it is "too difficult" with "too many professionals" is not very good advice at all, I think. I do appreciate your response though. Thanks
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Is my career over?
- Thread starter TruthSeeker247
- Start date
I don't believe I am any less capable than any other trader out there. I believe with time I will develop a deep understanding of the bond market. I am not one to simply give up on a market just because I lost money. If I lose the rest of my money, then I will have to go to work, save up, and start again. As much as I'd hate to have to do that, it looks like that is what I will have to do. To tell me to give up because it is "too difficult" with "too many professionals" is not very good advice at all, I think. I do appreciate your response though. Thanks
Quote from bstay:
I've patiently read through this thread as it sounds alot like me. After I lost my job in March, I funded an equity account with $27K. I'm quickly down -3K in 5 weeks.
Despite the many good advice to TS, there's a problem with how gamblers "listen":
1. 95% of all beginning traders fail.
Gambler: I'm going to make it.
2. Most traders learning this game has blown their account at least once.
Gambler: That's me.
3. Losing streak is part of the game.
Gambler: That's me.
4. Trade small, cut losses quickly, stay in the game longer.
Gambler: OK, I'll continue to "learn" to trade.
5. Don't lose more than 1% on a small account.
Gambler: OK, so it's fine to continue losing 1% per trade.
I could go on, but what I'm telling myself (and TS if he's listening) is that I probably don't have an edge. The probability of loss in the way I trade is high. I'm now back to papertrading, which I've heard so much advice but never did. It took me a while to "stop trading for one day". It also took me a while to "cut down your normal position size".
Well, I'm not trading today but will be watching and mentally taking paper trades ..... until I'm consistent.
My edge is my tendency to ride profits for a long time. I am extremely patient as a trader. If I can learn to also keep my losses small, then I will do fine, one day.
Quote from ChrisM:
It happened to many. In my opinion the best is to take a break, cool down and learn/test some more. After some you`ll realize how much you have already learned by this experience, but first let emotions go away.
The emotions are for the most part gone. I do wake up sometimes feeling like shit though but I quickly remember the positive: I'm not completely done yet and I've learned quite a lot about the bond market. Thanks
First, foremost and finally...
You need to have a plan for every trade:
a) a predefined expectation and anticipated price for entry,
b) a projection of where it it's going - which if not confirmed means get out now,
c) a point of exit, which when reached is time to close the position.
Of course, you can make corrections and perform reassessment along the way, but if you don't have a plan or violate the rules and ignore the original plan's failure when that occurs, it will be painful over and over again.
-jmho
You need to have a plan for every trade:
a) a predefined expectation and anticipated price for entry,
b) a projection of where it it's going - which if not confirmed means get out now,
c) a point of exit, which when reached is time to close the position.
Of course, you can make corrections and perform reassessment along the way, but if you don't have a plan or violate the rules and ignore the original plan's failure when that occurs, it will be painful over and over again.
-jmho
Quote from Htrader:
The FIRST you need to do is to stop trading the 30-yr futures. Many people think that since futures have high liquidity and long trading hours it means they are easier to trade. That is completely wrong.
Try looking at stocks instead of futures. If you read the Traders P/L thread you'll notice that almost every profitable trader is trading stocks.
Honestly though you'd be doing yourself a huge favor by just moving on. The vast majority of people are not successful traders, theres nothing wrong with that. Treat trading like a real business. Don't pour money down a black hole.
Have you ever suffered a major loss in trading? I would say probably not because if you had you would not longer be trading; that is, you'd probably give up. Your attitude seems to be: if i lose too much, let me do myself a favor and just move on. Sorry but that is not very inspiring at all. If YOU were not meant to be a trader then perhaps YOU should move on to something else. I know I was born to be a trader and don't expect to ever give up on trading as a profession. Losses should be expected as should a blowup of one's account. 99% of would-be-traders are like you: they have a big loss and then they "move on." That's why 99% don't make it and why I believe I will. You see, I don't have a strong affinity with money; I am not materialistic. I can take a loss and keep on truckin. Trading is what I was truly meant to do; I am convinced of this.
So, I will move on, but I will not give up on trading. Whether I lose what little I have left or not, I will always be a trader at heart and any job I take will be a temporary one to build up a new trading stake. These are facts of the matter.
here's my motto: NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER EVER GIVE UP!
Contrast it with yours: if you lose too much money, do yourself a favor and give up!
Thanks for your post
Quote from nbates:
First, foremost and finally...
You need to have a plan for every trade:
a) a predefined expectation and anticipated price for entry,
b) a projection of where it it's going - which if not confirmed means get out now,
c) a point of exit, which when reached is time to close the position.
Of course, you can make corrections and perform reassessment along the way, but if you don't have a plan or violate the rules and ignore the original plan's failure when that occurs, it will be painful over and over again.
-jmho
You are so right about that. I have A and B set. My biggest problem is part C. I don't always stop my losses where I should.
Thanks
start out small!
40 cars going into it beginning is just WAY too much..
Start at 1... profitable, learning lessons
up to 3... ditto
then 5
then 10...........
some of the folks who I know in the 50-100 lot arena NEVER start off the day at FULL STRENGTH. What if that day your head is not in the game. Much better to realize that your head is not in the game with 1 or 5 lots, than with the whole boat at 40.
-c
40 cars going into it beginning is just WAY too much..
Start at 1... profitable, learning lessons
up to 3... ditto
then 5
then 10...........
some of the folks who I know in the 50-100 lot arena NEVER start off the day at FULL STRENGTH. What if that day your head is not in the game. Much better to realize that your head is not in the game with 1 or 5 lots, than with the whole boat at 40.
-c
The painful truth is, you never had a career in trading to start with. This was the equivalent a guy who just read the rules of poker and sat at a table with a bunch of pro's. Sure you made a little bit of money along the way due to pure luck, but you were doomed from the start if you played long enough.
Get out now. Learn to really trade while saving up for an account big enough to make a living off of. Somewhere in the 200K range would be decent before attempting full time trading as a career.
Even with 200K and 20% a year return, thats only 40K year. Not much.
Do you know how many pro funds pull 20% a year consistently?
Not very many.
So I think its a little crazy to assume you will be able to beat the majority of pros and make enough to live on while still growing your account.
There are exceptions, but there is a reason so many people fail at this game. #1 & #2 being undercapitalization and trading with no real edge.
You have commited both of these errors already.
If you cannot at least tell someone what you exact win% rate, profit factor, and max draw down is for whatever system you are trading, then you are not even close to being ready.
Go teach yourself to trade. It will take years.
Get out now. Learn to really trade while saving up for an account big enough to make a living off of. Somewhere in the 200K range would be decent before attempting full time trading as a career.
Even with 200K and 20% a year return, thats only 40K year. Not much.
Do you know how many pro funds pull 20% a year consistently?
Not very many.
So I think its a little crazy to assume you will be able to beat the majority of pros and make enough to live on while still growing your account.
There are exceptions, but there is a reason so many people fail at this game. #1 & #2 being undercapitalization and trading with no real edge.
You have commited both of these errors already.
If you cannot at least tell someone what you exact win% rate, profit factor, and max draw down is for whatever system you are trading, then you are not even close to being ready.
Go teach yourself to trade. It will take years.
also have you considered spreads?
while not giving you the pure adrenaline of outright futs trading, spreads are, in general somewhat less risky. And, personally, I find spread and yield curve dynamics to be quite fascinating. You may like it too.. just a opinion.
good luck, i've been in your shoes before.. i know how it feels. But first, like some wise people have said, you have to learn how to stay in the game until you get it right
-c
while not giving you the pure adrenaline of outright futs trading, spreads are, in general somewhat less risky. And, personally, I find spread and yield curve dynamics to be quite fascinating. You may like it too.. just a opinion.
good luck, i've been in your shoes before.. i know how it feels. But first, like some wise people have said, you have to learn how to stay in the game until you get it right
-c