Is it possible to net $100K a year

[Osman]

maybe comming in thinking about making $100k trading is making you take unnecessary risks?

Can you post a bit on your trading style/ what you trade? Maybe its something there that is causing the losses.

 

[nitro]

Quote from BSAM:

nitro.....

Stretching things just a liiiiiittle, aren't we nitro? You're illustrating the exception to the general rule. Most people don't lose $65,000 dollars on a trade. Most never have and never will. If it was that easy, not many besides Warren Buffet, Bill Gates, etc. could risk trading. (Sky's not falling, nitro. Relax.)

Nope,

Not stretching it one bit. Your question was how does one lose that much money on a trade, I answered it with a first hand account.

If you are around real traders in a firm with dozens of traders, you see it every once in a while and with some luck, you won't be starring at that someone in the mirror that looks just like you when it happens.

I am perfectly relaxed as well.

nitro

 

[BSAM]

Quote from nitro:

Nope,

Not stretching it one bit. Your question was how does one lose that much money on a trade, I answered it.

If you are around real traders in a firm with dozens of traders, you see it every once in a while and with some luck, you won't be starring at that someone in the mirror that looks just like you.

I am perfectly relaxed as well.

nitro

No, nitro. My question was: How did DOMINIC lose $65,000 on one trade? AND, it wasn't due to a trading halt. And, MOST will NEVER encouter such (a $65,000 trading loss). Annnnnnnd, again, relax nitro, the sky's REALLY NOT FALLING.

 

[Osman]

Quote from nitro:

Nope,

Not stretching it one bit. Your question was how does one lose that much money on a trade, I answered it with a first hand account.

If you are around real traders in a firm with dozens of traders, you see it every once in a while and with some luck, you won't be starring at that someone in the mirror that looks just like you when it happens.

I am perfectly relaxed as well.

nitro

breakdowns happen more often than we think, people just lose it. Seen it happen on the floor, doesn't really matter what size the loss is, it always goes the same way:

3/15 get a call from one of the traders trading from home that day. panicking on the phone, asking what to do. Find out that he shorted FAST @45.93 with 2000 shares. the main trader on the phone told him to close out the position ASAP. FAST closed ~47.09 that day. Now that the trading day is done, get him on the phone expecting that he closed the position. He didn't. OK, whatever

3/23 Trader shorts another 2000 shares, doubling up. don't know at what price but FAST was trading around ~$47.75

by 3/31 FAST was almost $54. I came by to hang during lunch and see his screen. He was still in it. With 6000 shares. 'the company is really weak financially' he says. Big Whoops.
never asked him when he closed the position.

 

[nitro]

Quote from BSAM:

No, nitro. My question was: How did DOMINIC lose $65,000 on one trade? AND, it wasn't due to a trading halt. And, MOST will NEVER encouter such (a $65,000 trading loss). Annnnnnnd, again, relax nitro, the sky's REALLY NOT FALLING.

Well,

I was trying to quench your curiosity when you said

...Just curious and it could help some other trader.

since it seemed that you were more interested in the mechanics of the loss than the fact that it was dominic who was the unfortunate trader on the end of that loss. Also, I was not responding to you directly, but to those other traders that you are referring to it might help, including dominic that he should not feel totally bad.

You say that most traders never encouter a $65,000 loss? Well, I have no idea who you trade with or with what size, but I encounter those kinds of losses about two to three times a year at the firms that I have been associated with, and these are not extraordinary traders by any means, at least I do not think so.

Big losses seem to come to those that move to size they cannot handle, either out of ego or pressure to make more money. I have seen it so many times.

FWIW, the trader that lost the $44K on the MO debacle made it back in two weeks and ended up for the month. Now _that_ is out of the ordinary.

Still very relaxed on a fine peaceful evening in Chicago.

nitro

 

[nitro]

I have nothing to add.

nitro

Quote from silk:

You can't really expect to pull more than 30-100% out of the market in a year on your buying power day trading year in and year out. So in my opinion you are wasting your time if you are trading less than 250k. 100k buying power is certainly unacceptable. If you don't have this much money you need to go to a professional firm and get some professional leverage.

The thing is if you are profitable trading 100k buying power you will be profitable trading 1 million. So why not make 10 times as much money. So go to a prop firm. Most liquidity bottlenecks aren't hit until you are talking greater than 1 million buying power.

I'm up about 17% on my buying power this year. In 2002 I was up perhaps 50%. Last year I was up maybe 4%. This is on three to 6 million in buying power. My life would be much different had i tried to use my own money back in 2002. 50% return on 4 million is much better than 50% return on 25k.

 

[BSAM]

Quote from nitro:

****************************************************
Well,
I was trying to quench your curiosity when you said.....
****************************************************
I 'preciate your concern.




****************************************************
You say that most traders never encouter a $65,000 loss? Well, I have no idea who you trade with or with what size, but I encounter those kinds of losses about two to three times a year at the firms that I have been associated with, and these are not extraordinary traders by any means, at least I do not think so.
****************************************************
I know it's late in Chicago, but the key word is "most". I'm sure you would not consider two or three times a year as excessive.



****************************************************
Still very relaxed on a fine peaceful evening in Chicago.
****************************************************
I'm glad for you my friend.



nitro

 

[qwiktrade]

Quote from Kerry:

What does it matter if someone makes $1 or $1,000,000?

Why should you care? Shouldn't you be focusing on what you need to make that instead of asking others how much they make? Very few people are going to give you their methods on how they make $1,000,000 a year. Don't be foolish.

Its like showing up at a dinner party and you asking each guest how much they make for a living. Then, asking them how exactly do they do it.

well, we cant all marry ketchup billionaires..

seriously, with a 65k loss on one trade with a 4-1 lever, its probably a good thing jingle nuts didnt have 3-5 million buying power..

i watched a friend lose 20 something grand on a trade one time.. it was down on bad news after hours and he bought a "bounce".. more like a flop.. then it became a trade till the next day.. then it was for his "long term account".. he ended up taking the loss a few days later..

fast and loose doesnt seem to work so well in trading.. no matter how many excuses we make for ourselves after the fact..

-qwik

 

[dgmodel]

Quote from 1st_samurai:

Papertrading with awesome results? Wow, sounds like my paper trading when I was in high school long ago. Let me tell you are in for a long ride when you finally start real trading.

lol, exactly papertrading is bullshit, trading demo is mareshit, unless youre in the game with real money youre not learning or accomplishing anything... bottom line...

 

[flyingdutch]

after the numerous replies here, where other people say that they know XYZ who'd lost Yk$, the things that are missing is: "what was the account size?". I'm sorry but whatever trader you are, for a prop firm, a private trader or whatever, if after 4 years you blow away 65% of your account on ONE trade, it shows that you don't know/want to know/don't understand, one of the very basic principles of trading: "cutting losses fast". And this is nothing new, fancy. You pick up ANY book on trading and this will be in one of the first chapters. Guess what would happen if you blew out 65% of soros account on ONE trade? The only alternative would be to hang yourself. Again, sorry, but blowing away 65% of your account on ONE trade, proves to me, IMHO, that you don't understand anything what is required to survive in this jungle.

FWIW

TFD

PS: My previous post was just an advice to save you blowing away the remaining 35%...