Before I respond to this post, I need u to define in clear and concrete terms the definition of the institution of marriage to make sure the we are on the same page.
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Is homosexuality a choice?
- Thread starter Rearden Metal
- Start date
Before I respond to this post, I need u to define in clear and concrete terms the definition of the institution of marriage to make sure the we are on the same page.
I think you may have taken my comment out of context. I don't believe sexual preference is a choice. I think it is as natural as breathing. Those who have to consciously "choose" their sexual orientation are fighting an inner battle. That is the only point I was trying to convey in my prior post.Quote from OPTIONAL777:
Resisting and controlling urges and basic instinctual behavior based on choices that are more "enlightened" is what civilization is all about...
Whether the urge is to have sex with the opposite sex, or same sex, it is still an urge.
The urge by the homophobes to hate gays and deny them Constitutional rights for the pursuit of life, liberty, and happiness needs to be resisted as well as any other primitive urge...
Two definitions.
1. A legal definition.
2. A religious definition.
Say a couple get married by some church that the government does not recognize as "legally" performing a marriage.
Is that a marriage?
1. A legal definition.
2. A religious definition.
Say a couple get married by some church that the government does not recognize as "legally" performing a marriage.
Is that a marriage?
Quote from ARealGannTrader:
Before I respond to this post, I need u to define in clear and concrete terms the definition of the institution of marriage to make sure the we are on the same page.
is heterosexuality a choice??
There are preists and nuns who chose celibacy and a single existence for their lives.
Is this natural?
No.
Is resisting hitting someone when they insult a person natural?
No.
Is theft natural?
Yes.
Murder?
Yes.
Having sex outside of marriage?
Yes.
Greed?
Yes.
We have instincts, and then we have intellect that makes decisions on how to respond to our basic animal instincts...
What we prefer may be instinctual, but that is not what makes us a civilization. What makes a civilization is how we control our instincts.
Fighting the inner battle between our high and lower nature is what makes for civilization...
We learn to learn many things in life, and we need to learn tolerance of gays, and their basic human right to marry whomever they wish, as long as both parties involved are capable of informed consent in their decision making process.
Is this natural?
No.
Is resisting hitting someone when they insult a person natural?
No.
Is theft natural?
Yes.
Murder?
Yes.
Having sex outside of marriage?
Yes.
Greed?
Yes.
We have instincts, and then we have intellect that makes decisions on how to respond to our basic animal instincts...
What we prefer may be instinctual, but that is not what makes us a civilization. What makes a civilization is how we control our instincts.
Fighting the inner battle between our high and lower nature is what makes for civilization...
We learn to learn many things in life, and we need to learn tolerance of gays, and their basic human right to marry whomever they wish, as long as both parties involved are capable of informed consent in their decision making process.
Quote from Thunderdog:
I think you may have taken my comment out of context. I don't believe sexual preference is a choice. I think it is as natural as breathing. Those who have to consciously "choose" their sexual orientation are fighting an inner battle. That is the only point I was trying to convey in my prior post.
Quote from sameeh55:
If we have agreed that it is not a choice (I believe it is not) then who are we to tell them how reach sexual happiness?
I have seen homosexuals in the most rigid and homophobe societies. If they resisted any attempt to force conformity on them in these countries, including sever prosecution such as the execution of two homosexuals in Iran, how in gods name can we say, while keeping a straight face, that it is their choice?
For precisely the same reason that people here in the united states commit crimes that carry a capital punishment, and are proven competent by the medical community.
They choose to do what they WANT to do regardless of the consequences, because they do not fully measure the consequences of discovery, and do not believe they will be caught.
i dont think you can control an errrrrrection thats under autonomic control. your first erect occurred when your mommie wiped your ass, what's that say about your preferences?
Quote from ByLoSellHi:
You're into the scientific method, RM.
In fact, it supports many of the positions you've taken, many of which I absolutely agree with, and that some claim are 'radical.'
One example of this is the ability to treat depression far more effectively with opiates, opiate derived meds, or synthetic opiates (or the like), than with the incredibly ineffective SSRIs and other 'miracle meds' that have been pushed so stunningly successfully by Big Pharma (despite clear evidence they wreak havoc on many of the body's systems and are no more effective than placebo meds).
Well, that same scientific method, whenever it's been rigorously applied, has indicated that there is little if any doubt that there is a strong genetic predisposition to homosexuality.
Whether additional factors, whether biological or societal (nature versus nurture), play a role in 'pushing' people towards homosexuality, exist - well, that's worthy of further research.
It's well known that a much larger % of gay females have higher levels of testosterone and lower levels of estrogen than the female population as a whole.
The "theory" of genetic predisposition to homosexuality has no concrete evidence.
Is there a genetic predisposition to cancer?
If so, how can there be agents that "cause" cancer?
It also follows, that if there is a sex gene for the same sex, there is also a sex gene for finding humans without secondary sex characteristics attractive.
Acting of the latter, even viewing it, carries very serious social consequences.
But it does not stop what i would guess to be millions around the globe.
If a man gets behind a horse, or a woman get underneath a dog, was it in the genes?
Finding a gay gene is a lot like finding a fat gene. The reality is that people want to do what they want to do, and some of these people have enough financial firepower to come up with "scientific" studies to justify what is ultimately nothing more than social choices.
Quote from killthesunshine:
i dont think you can control an errrrrrection thats under autonomic control. your first erect occurred when your mommie wiped your ass, what's that say about your preferences?
It probable meant they had to pee, or were frightened.
Women carry erect nipples when sexually aroused.......or if they get cold.
I will worry about homosexuality as some sort of national threat when I start reading headlines stating 'Straight Man Forcibly Raped In The Ass At ATM Machine' in the papers.
I haven't heard much about these crimes of passion outside of prison walls.
p.s. In full disclosure, homosexuality used to carry a designation of mental illness under the DSM (I think DSM-III) but it was removed due to political pressure from gays. Maybe that issue is still a fair one.
Also, I do NOT want to see public schools stepping into this quagmire and saying that homosexuality IS or IS NOT normal. Leave it alone, public schools. I do not want 'My Two Mommies' or 'My Two Daddies' read to my children. Let me decide how they are exposed to this issue, and let me exercise parental governance over matters such as this that are the proper province of parents alone.
I haven't heard much about these crimes of passion outside of prison walls.
p.s. In full disclosure, homosexuality used to carry a designation of mental illness under the DSM (I think DSM-III) but it was removed due to political pressure from gays. Maybe that issue is still a fair one.
Also, I do NOT want to see public schools stepping into this quagmire and saying that homosexuality IS or IS NOT normal. Leave it alone, public schools. I do not want 'My Two Mommies' or 'My Two Daddies' read to my children. Let me decide how they are exposed to this issue, and let me exercise parental governance over matters such as this that are the proper province of parents alone.