Is day trading worth it?

[i am nobody]

I see that the poster disagrees with you on this. I'm not in the market at the moment and currently not up to date, but I can say for sure that what you're saying was the norm when I was trading. ES would often have days where it went nowhere. After big moves and volatility, some consolidation is normal and to be expected.

I think it's very important to learn how to spot these type of days and potentially stay out or at least minimize trading frequency on those days. I know that I would lose profits from other days on such days because I tried to force trades that wasn't there.

This is the distribution of the last 484 trading days in the ES. Y-axle is number of days, X-axle is the difference between high and low of the day in points (not ticks!!!). This is the minimum potential. In reality trading potential is even bigger because in this charts we assume only one move, where as in reality we can have various moves within one day which can enlarge the daily potential. Question is of course: how much of this potential are you able to catch.

Many times big moves happen at moments when everybody thinks the market fell asleep. Why do this big moves happen then? Because everybody is asleep and nobody expects this to happen. The fact that everybody is taken by surprise will even strengthen the move. Panic all around.

 

[Laissez Faire]

Many times big moves happen at moments when everybody thinks the market fell asleep. Why do this big moves happen then? Because everybody is asleep and nobody expects this to happen. The fact that everybody is taken by surprise will even strengthen the move. Panic all around.

Nice statistics. I maintain similar statistics and in even more detail, including the number of daily swings and their duration and extent. I'm sure you do as well.

It seems as the volatility have been pretty nice in ES lately, but it's still evident that narrow range days happen and I maintain that playing those days is quite different from the more volatile days where the swings are larger and more violent. I typically thrived on the latter days and tended to get chopped up on the former, although late in my trading career I learned to recognize those dull narrow range days where price typically drifted tick by tick in a dull manner from low to high or vice versa.

I'm curious as to the subject at hand here. How's your ES trading going? Would you say day trading is worth it from your point of view? : )

 

[marketsurfer]

This is the distribution of the last 484 trading days in the ES. Y-axle is number of days, X-axle is the difference between high and low of the day in points (not ticks!!!). This is the minimum potential. In reality trading potential is even bigger because in this charts we assume only one move, where as in reality we can have various moves within one day which can enlarge the daily potential. Question is of course: how much of this potential are you able to catch.

View attachment 151236

Many times big moves happen at moments when everybody thinks the market fell asleep. Why do this big moves happen then? Because everybody is asleep and nobody expects this to happen. The fact that everybody is taken by surprise will even strengthen the move. Panic all around.

Slim Jim chart entries have been around for years. Nothing new here.

 

[bigsnack]

I find that I agree with dbphoenix in this regard. I don't believe that there really is noise, only price action that isn't at or near levels that you have predefined. I found that trying to decipher "trending" action vs. "chop" or "noise" was the number one reason why I would bail on a trade WAY too early, and end up missing my original target. If you believe in your analysis, and you have at least some degree of confidence that you know what you are doing, my belief is that you get in where you want to enter, and get out where you plan to exit. Maybe the "noise" is simply a breather before going to my intended target, but I usually just end up stressing myself out and adding unnecessary fear by trying to figure out halfway through a trade if it's somehow going to magically fail before my target and take me out.

 

[dbphoenix]

I find that I agree with dbphoenix in this regard. I don't believe that there really is noise, only price action that isn't at or near levels that you have predefined. I found that trying to decipher "trending" action vs. "chop" or "noise" was the number one reason why I would bail on a trade WAY too early, and end up missing my original target. If you believe in your analysis, and you have at least some degree of confidence that you know what you are doing, my belief is that you get in where you want to enter, and get out where you plan to exit. Maybe the "noise" is simply a breather before going to my intended target, but I usually just end up stressing myself out and adding unnecessary fear by trying to figure out halfway through a trade if it's somehow going to magically fail before my target and take me out.

It is common for traders to want to see price plummet the moment they've entered their short, or to skyrocket into a parabolic move the moment they've bought. And they sure don't want to see any pauses along the way.

This is why the trader must define clearly, in advance, just what it is he wants to see in his trade, and to have the discipline to exit that trade when he doesn't see it, or when he no longer sees it, whether it's seconds after he enters or hours.

 

[i am nobody]

Nice statistics. I maintain similar statistics and in even more detail, including the number of daily swings and their duration and extent. I'm sure you do as well.

It seems as the volatility have been pretty nice in ES lately, but it's still evident that narrow range days happen and I maintain that playing those days is quite different from the more volatile days where the swings are larger and more violent. I typically thrived on the latter days and tended to get chopped up on the former, although late in my trading career I learned to recognize those dull narrow range days where price typically drifted tick by tick in a dull manner from low to high or vice versa.

I'm curious as to the subject at hand here. How's your ES trading going? Would you say day trading is worth it from your point of view? : )

I don't share any information about my trading anymore, too much bashers. But starting to daytrade was worth it, although I have had a few terribly bad years. I saw quite a few daytraders start, but nobody survived it. It is difficult but not impossible.
There are also millions of sportsmen, but only a few reach the top. But that's not a reason to give up already before you tried. At least I am not like that.

 

[i am nobody]

Slim Jim chart entries have been around for years. Nothing new here.

Trickshot wrote: In fact dull days are more like the rule and not the exception these days since volatility has crashed.

The chart that I posted was a reaction on that statement. I used data that is real and can be checked by anybody, so undeniable. This chart showed that the statement Trickshot made is complete nonsense.
Your posting is also completely irrelevant and meaningless in this case. There is no link whatsover with dull markets and crashed volatility.
You also missed this chart:

 

[marketsurfer]

Trickshot wrote: In fact dull days are more like the rule and not the exception these days since volatility has crashed.

The chart that I posted was a reaction on that statement. I used data that is real and can be checked by anybody, so undeniable. This chart showed that the statement Trickshot made is complete nonsense.
Your posting is also completely irrelevant and meaningless in this case. There is no link whatsover with dull markets and crashed volatility.
You also missed this chart:

View attachment 151257

What's up with the gonzo hostility vibe?

I don't disagree with you--- i was agreeing with you. surf

 

[i am nobody]

What's up with the gonzo hostility vibe?

I don't disagree with you--- i was agreeing with you. surf

English language is only the third language I speak. This means that sometimes maybe I understand wrong what is written. So I want to apoligize for the misunderstanding, it was not on purpose.

For instance this sentence is already difficult for me to interprete correctly as this is not the english I learned:
What's up with the gonzo hostility vibe?

Never heard before from "Gonzo".
"Slim Jim chart entries." Never heard from these charts before too. Interpreted this as negative because of previous discussions.

 

[Buy1Sell2]

Does noise not depend of a personal interpretation and situation?
If I have a trading plan, everything that tries to confuse me is noise to me. Noise comes from annoying, it means something that wants to disturb you in what you try to do.
Theoretically every tick has a meaning and noise does not exist. But I see it from the position where i am in. But I should use the word irrelevant then from now on?

Noise is market activity--plain and simple. It certainly exists and is represented on the charts by bars. Noise can be informative, noise can be uninformative. Noise is there regardless.