Is day trading worth it?

[drownpruf]

lol so the response is that hindsight charts are the answer... not blotters. Stating that you posted a short in advance when the post doesn't exist. Produce the evidence and the guy's only response is that he doesn't know today's date.

Stated on here that he "has a 80% hit-rate at 10x losers". Of course he had the thread deleted, but I have the screen grab.

He has never produced a trade at a price and never will. He would then be on the record. I am convinced (as are others who have PMed me) that the guy doesn't trade.

Blow-up artist trolling for suckers. More excuses. Wake up ppl.

 

[Laissez Faire]

Don't take this the wrong way, but regardless of what you're saying, this is all in hindsight.

I have not read all your posts, but you seem to always have the perfect explanation in hindsight, making it seem like you have a 100% success rate with these set-ups?

Don't they ever fail?

Using my own methodology consisting of price levels, prior OHLC, statistics of swing sizes, S/R, basic chart patterns, etc, I could always trace price perfectly perfectly after the close and tell a very exciting story of what price did from open to close. It made perfect sense. This is one of the reasons I believe profitable trading is possible, since there seem to be a order in how price moves.

However, when live trading, it's a different animal and at any given point in time, price can do a lot more than simply go up and down.

Bumping this for, NoDoji.

One of the things that give guys like sellindex credibility, is that they actually lose as well and post their losses.

 

[drownpruf]

I've been trading the same method for nearly 4 years now and the edge hasn't gone anywhere. Price action trading is dynamic and the behavior of price around levels of "value" tells me what to do. If the volatility is low, fewer trades reach my minimum target; if the volatility is high, more trades reach my minimum target and often run much further. The net result either way is profitability over each series of N trades.

Here's a post I made almost 3 years ago describing how I trade price action:

http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?t=220303&page=2

It's the same stuff I've been illustrating recently.

Here's a post that illustrates in detail how I trade price action, and the trade was called in real time as well (follow the link to CL Redux as referenced):

http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?t=220303&page=3

These are the same price concepts I've been trading all these years. I haven't been shape shifting my methods, or hiding the losers in hindsight charts (I'm still giggling regularly over that one).

Anyone who's willing to conduct a thorough study of these concepts as applied to their chosen instrument(s) using the common 5-min/1-min day trading combo (or equivalent in tick or range charts) will find a sustainable edge hitching rides with the large traders who move price.

Would it be possible to post your redacted % performance from your broker? I ask bc I don't understand how people can post 10-20x per day yet not have the time nor inclination to do so.

If not, then why not post actual fill prices in real-time? You post on here a lot during the trading day, no?



DBPhoenix was banned so his daily stats don't reflect it, but the guy is posting 15x a day yet NEVER produces a real-time call "Sold XYZ at X" "Bought XYZ at Y". Why is that, do you suppose? I know you can't speak for him, but what's your take?

 

[Laissez Faire]

So why did you switch to daytrading if you were making 600% returns from swing trading ?

That's a pretty good question and potentially the biggest mistake I've done financially and professionally for the last 10 years.

Already at my first trade, I had a friend at business school tell me I didn't have a clue what I was doing (in a very condescending way). I kept doing my thing and as my equity peaked, I still had a lot of people around me telling me it was pure luck.

And then, suffering my first real drawdown, I started believing it myself, so I withdrew all my money.

At this point I was tired of my career as a carpenter and in my mind had the choice between a formal education in school or trying to make it as a full-time trader.

Being naive and gullible, I reasoned that if I had made a killing without not really knowing much, I would own the world if I only applied myself and studied the markets.

I then came in touch with a losing trader (only learned this much later) who 'mentored' me and always made a lot of sense. Actually, he probably was a very smart guy, but in the end he was a blow-up trader acting the role of a guru. And I trusted him.

He was the one that convinced me day trading futures was the way to go and it made sense to me as well, so that was what I put my mind to study. He was also the guy that made me hit the books.

So that's the story in short.

I don't mind discussing ideas with losing traders and I think they can have very valuable input, but they should be honest about where they are and don't try to give the impression that they're something they're not.

I don't know for sure who this would be on ET, but experience has learned me to be careful who I trust and I do know for a fact that there's a lot of BS on these boards.

Hope that answered your question.

PS: Still pondering whether to continue day trading or swing trading. I feel I've come a very long way understanding intraday ES price action, so it's a little hard to let that go.

Best regards.

 

[drownpruf]

sellindexvol posts nothing but blotters, no content (relative). DBP posts nothing but (dubious) content and no blotters or even trade posts. Why is that? SIV trades and DBP is marketing, something...

DBP offers free content. Content that he cannot monetize direct (profitability) so he inundates threads with this shotgun approach, 10 open threads like cold-calling. Call 500 ppl and somebody will provide you with a rip. DBP's rip is eventually getting a POA from one of you clowns. I will LMAO when said moron comes on here bitching that DBP lost him his savings.

Oh yeah, he's not selling anything ($30 self published rag).

The difference lies in the fact that he will be forced to actually trade in the POA. Ostensibly, he can keep up this 20k words a day w/o ever having posted an actual trade at price with a timestamp.

 

[drownpruf]

It happens to legit traders as well. Rearden_Metal fell on (relatively) hard times and then "made up" an exit to buy in Hogs at limit-up, then disappeared. If it happens to guys like him who produced millions... how can you believe a guy who hasn't produced anything but a chart showing the move after it has occurred?

 

[burt_schroder]

well a know that these triangles r workin right, coz me mate is smashin the market with them. Triangles r every where in life man, they is a common shape and the markets r full of em....look at the piramids in eggipt.

 

[cornix]

sellindexvol posts nothing but blotters, no content (relative). DBP posts nothing but (dubious) content and no blotters or even trade posts. Why is that? SIV trades and DBP is marketing, something...

DBP offers free content. Content that he cannot monetize direct (profitability) so he inundates threads with this shotgun approach, 10 open threads like cold-calling. Call 500 ppl and somebody will provide you with a rip. DBP's rip is eventually getting a POA from one of you clowns. I will LMAO when said moron comes on here bitching that DBP lost him his savings.

Oh yeah, he's not selling anything ($30 self published rag).

The difference lies in the fact that he will be forced to actually trade in the POA. Ostensibly, he can keep up this 20k words a day w/o ever having posted an actual trade at price with a timestamp.

Wouldn't posting performance be the best way to attract POA clients?

 

[drownpruf]

Wouldn't posting performance be the best way to attract POA clients?

Not when you suck. Baffle them with BS.

 

[NoDoji]

If not, then why not post actual fill prices in real-time? You post on here a lot during the trading day, no?

DBPhoenix was banned so his daily stats don't reflect it, but the guy is posting 15x a day yet NEVER produces a real-time call "Sold XYZ at X" "Bought XYZ at Y". Why is that, do you suppose? I know you can't speak for him, but what's your take?

I trade mainly during the first 2-3 hours of the pit session. I don't post during that time because as an intraday scalper I avoid distractions. If I've met my minimum goals during that period of time, I take a break and check in here and a couple of the chat rooms to commune with other traders.

DBPhoenix is actively mentoring a few folks here, at least six people I think, and his requirement is that they keep a journal here of their progress, so his post count should be high.

I used to post live trade calls and blotters and I called all my trades every day in real time back when ET had a chat room, but once I developed a real trading plan and tried to teach it to others via Skype sessions it became clear that everyone has to do their own research and plan development. How would my P/L blotter help anyone? Sellindexvol's posts are inspirational to those who want to trade for a living, but in no way help anyone learn to trade profitably.

From what I've seen, DB realized this long ago as well which is why he teaches price action concepts and encourages students to apply them on their own, so they eventually come up with a plan they can believe in because they understand what they're doing and why.

I now believe there's far more value in sharing the visual representations of auction market theory (AMT) in action and encouraging aspiring traders to apply the concepts until they start to see the hidden pictures pop out at them than to post how much money I make.

The P/L threads did help me see that profitable trading is possible, which was good during times when I felt like giving up.

But the real turning points for me came from the detailed analyses of hindsight charts in a book, and from a single detailed PM from an ET member who's never posted a live call or a blotter, and from some hand-annotated black and white naked OHLC charts provided to me by another ET member, and from a link to a video with yet more hindsight analysis by an ET member.

When I spent many hours studying these ideas and applying them to hindsight charts, then sim, then finally to my live trading (which feels very different, hence the psychological issues so many face), I found what I wanted all along but had blocked myself from discovering much earlier because of ego and stubbornness.