Is China actually bankrupt?

[asiaprop]

which discussion? That China is actually bankrupt? So those previous posters, talking about environmental waste and what have you, did hit the point, correct? And what value did you actually add? So far none, other than sitting in the back and slashing out at those who risk saying inconvenient truths.

If any country is the farthest away from bankruptcy then its China. China is issuing debt to manage its need for currencies other than RMB and to experiment, for nothing else because there simply is no need for funds other than above mentioned points. Correct me and add value or shut up.

Quote from Renegen:

You still here? Are you back from under your rock to be humiliated some more? Because just a few short minutes could pull out a great number of threads where you made a fool of yourself.

Let's focus on the discussion instead of this troll.

 

[MohdSalleh]

Quote from Anaconda:

Does the fact that China is a communist country completely elude you? No social entitlement?

It's cool to be rah rah rah about China, I know, but that does require not seeing the whole picture. China has been burying debt for decades. They can do that, it is a communist country. A lot of those sweatshop operations are actually running at a net loss, but the Chinese government supports it with loans never to be repaid simply for the purpose of keeping the people employed.
China is an environmental nightmare and in the not so distant future, it will just be a wasteland. You also may want to look up "death vans", interesting stuff. Their most profitable enterprise is selling organs on the black market, too bad that is a stock symbol you can't buy.

China is not a communist country, Communism is a misapproriated word in the American vernacular, you should really read up on what ideologically it means to be communist.

were you around during the 60's/70's when Japan was economically devloping? Many parts of Japan was an environmental shithole due to industrialization, pollution was rife, lakes and rivers in rural japan had chemicals and slimy shit in it, even at that time, where "green" wasnt a hot topic, MANy people were very vocal about the environment in Japan. but you know what eventually they cleaned it up when the cost of living outweighed that of industrialization, go to Japan now, and rural japan has some of the most pristine scenery on earth, even today, in China there are many scenic spots that are untouched by pollution, in Sichuan in Jiuzhaigou, there are lakes that reflect the sky and surroundings so clearly the likes of which you will never see in America. At wutaishan, buddhist and taoist hermits are alive and well, minding their own business, meditating in the crisp mountain air just as they have been for thousands of years. yes i have been to all these places, and China is a big country, in fact if you count in taiwan its actually larger in land area than the USA, just as there are dilapidated areas in the USA, there are such in China.

Also, if you were around during the 60/70's , you would have known brands like AIWA and SONY were considered totally SHIT inferior low quality products and look at now, we think Japanese products are the bee's knees.

fundamentally, human beings are the same throughout the world, human mind is human mind, everyone wants happiness and no one wants suffering. We are a great nation in our own way, but there is no need to disparage others to prove so, doing that only shows an underlying cause of a huge inferiority complex. A rich man never tells people he's rich, he KNOWS he is rich.

get a passport, get out of the country, travel around the world and see how people live, it might just change your life for the better.

 

[T_Geithner]

Quote from asiaprop:

which discussion? That China is actually bankrupt? So those previous posters, talking about environmental waste and what have you, did hit the point, correct? And what value did you actually add? So far none, other than sitting in the back and slashing out at those who risk saying inconvenient truths.

ignore him, he's pissed at the fact that his country is fucked in the butt by it's own stupidity, and that there are no signs of recovery, and that the people and the government are too fucking stupid to resolve any of the real issues at hand, instead they are hellbent on passing that crappy worthless health care bill and seeing their pathetic obese people naked

TSA plans to deploy a total of 450 body scanners to an undetermined number of airports this year

they're fucking animals don't you see, they have no regards for eachothers privacy, 'TSA can see my wife and kids naked, so long as it keeps me safe', you have to be a fucking moron to the tenth degree to make such a stupid statement, but they are

 

[MohdSalleh]

Quote from krazykarl:

No one seems to be talking about the Chinese credit card problem. You think Americans are leveraged, check out numbers on Chinese farmers who maxed-out credit cards to buy stocks becuase it was a no-lose situation.

is that why China's savings rate is 40% while ours is uhrm ZERO.:eek:

 

[zdreg]

Quote from achilles28:

There's not much to the article.

If true, Chinese private debt is 100% of GDP. So what?

American private debt is 4 *times* GDP.

Second, none of those loans are guaranteed. The PRC could let a good amount fail and carry the non-performers with the surplus.

Yea, Chinese real estate/stock is bubblicious and due for a hard correction.

Still, they're far stronger than the us.

Look at it this way - assuming all those investment loans went bust (which they didn't, and 2008-2011, is the time they would have), and total debt was 4.8 Trillion, China could make good on half that debt with it's surplus, and still have a public-debt obligation of 50% of GDP, and private sector near 10%.

That screams growth.

"Yea, Chinese real estate/stock is bubblicious and due for a hard correction."

your use of bubblicious is incorrect
"Bubblicious is a brand of bubble gum produced by Cadbury Adams. It was launched in the United States in 1977, in response to the tremendous sales of Bubble Yum, the first soft, no-face-sticking bubble gum.
it is not used as a substitute for bubble

how do expect to invest for a"hard correction".how will u know the correction is starting?

 

[achilles28]

Quote from zdreg:

"Yea, Chinese real estate/stock is bubblicious and due for a hard correction."

your use of bubblicious is incorrect
"Bubblicious is a brand of bubble gum produced by Cadbury Adams. It was launched in the United States in 1977, in response to the tremendous sales of Bubble Yum, the first soft, no-face-sticking bubble gum.
it is not used as a substitute for bubble

how do expect to invest for a"hard correction".how will u know the correction is starting?

lol. Yea, I know, man. That's why I said bubbliscious?!

When America sneezes, the world gets a cold. That's the signal.

 

[T_Geithner]

Quote from zdreg:

"Yea, Chinese real estate/stock is bubblicious and due for a hard correction."

I don't know much about china's real estate market

but I do know that cash based economies function in a different way than debt based economies, in cash based economies real estate is purchased mainly with cash, so when the real estate bubble bursts there is not much room for prices to drop, because even if owners of real estate properties can't sell the property due to a weak real estate market they are able to rent it out and receive an amount equal to or more than the interest they would have collected if they had put that money into a savings account

now if china's economy is cash based then the above applies

 

[Anaconda]

Quote from achilles28:


Where is Government ownership of capital in China?

Actually, the government owns everything. On the surface it may seem like private enterprise, but there is no due process for the government simply taking it. You don't really have any rights.

There's no social or welfare guarantees.

Except employment, a wage or financial support. They essentially run the same model as USSR in regards of social welfare. I am really not sure where you get your ideas from, because it is, in fact, a communist system.

China is very sound.

Yes, burying & hiding mounds upon mounds of bad debt which financed your economic growth for over a decade is very sound. I guess it is different in China's case, since it's not like anyone else can do anything about it, nor does China have to give any answers.

Listen, you think it's so wonderful, just move there, learn Chinese, prosper & become a billionaire. It's that easy, cause all is dandy in the world of China and money grows on trees.

 

[zdreg]

Actually, the government owns everything. On the surface it may seem like private enterprise, but there is no due process for the government simply taking it. You don't really have any rights.

are you talking about the US?
supreme court decision on eminent domain.

the US under obama.
bailouts and takeover of financial institutions, gm etc. salary regulations etc.

 

[achilles28]

Quote from Anaconda:

Actually, the government owns everything. On the surface it may seem like private enterprise, but there is no due process for the government simply taking it. You don't really have any rights.



Except employment, a wage or financial support. They essentially run the same model as USSR in regards of social welfare. I am really not sure where you get your ideas from, because it is, in fact, a communist system.
.

It's a well-established fact China runs a hybrid political system. A one party Head of State (Communist) merged with a free market economy and private property rights (Capitalist).

USSR ran a centrally-planned economy that outlawed nearly all private ownership. Big difference.

As far as China's welfare system, it's funded locally. Poor areas (nearly half the population), get screwed. Education, healthcare, pensions nada. Try living with mudfloors and no potable water. Chinese state-owned industry used to provide cradle-to-grave welfare for employees, back in the 80's. Still, per capita industrialization was extremely low, so most of the agrarian population was forced (and still is), to fend for themselves. Whatever Government benefits the minority do receive, is extremely small and inexpensive, relative to their US and Western counterparts. That was my point. That's why Chinese goods are so competitive, in part, because the huge social entitlement costs here in the West, don't exist in China (or exist at a fraction of a fraction of the cost).

You're rambling xenophobia against anyone who breaths a word of praise for China is disturbing. Like I said before, and apparently, you didn't listen, I am not a fan of the Communist Chinese. Their Country is simply far, far stronger, economically, than the West. If you can't distinguish between cheerleading and an unbiased read of the facts, I can't help you.